Curse

jbwarrior · May 07, 2007, 12:04 PM // 12:04

I have only a few words....

/SIGNED

Gargle Blaster · May 07, 2007, 12:45 PM // 12:45

Not Signed!

the title is easy enough to get as it is... it also brings up issues of what to do with the arena areas... or what about the fact that there is a bit of leeway in the title...

why clutter up the map just because you are lazy about trying to get another title... -- One of the main reasons i explored so much was because i wanted a clean map.

oh yea and btw i am a legendary cartographer -- with a mesmer

JeniM · May 08, 2007, 01:22 AM // 01:22

/signed

I've had 0.4% to go on Elona for too long and i really can't be bothered scraping EVERY area to find it

Gargle Blaster · May 08, 2007, 01:38 AM // 01:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeniM

I've had 0.4% to go on Elona for too long and i really can't be bothered scraping EVERY area to find it

Well then, you should not be bothered with the responsibility of an additional maxed title.

sry to be harsh but i c/n think of a better way of saying it...

therangereminem · May 08, 2007, 03:10 AM // 03:10

i have been working onthis stuff for 2 years now still have yet to get title for any maxed out
tyrian i have 98.7% i knew there areas infireislands i have yet just been tolazy to do the missions to get rest(but they are very small dont htinkits what all i need)
factions im at 94.2 have not tried to hard i can see lots there
elonia im at 95.8 but this is the one pissing me off i look at 100% maps and theres areas that are not onthere i have but there is no area i dont have . with this i know its all about hugginf sides that give .001 lol on all areas that will add up just where to start form i have been doing hard mode vanqishing slowly so hopefully i will get it all 100%

but this ideal is good been thinking about it alot over the last months time it would help alot but still make it time comsuing

/signed

freekedoutfish · May 08, 2007, 08:10 AM // 08:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by therangereminem

i have been working onthis stuff for 2 years now still have yet to get title for any maxed out
tyrian i have 98.7% i knew there areas infireislands i have yet just been tolazy to do the missions to get rest(but they are very small dont htinkits what all i need)
factions im at 94.2 have not tried to hard i can see lots there
elonia im at 95.8 but this is the one pissing me off i look at 100% maps and theres areas that are not onthere i have but there is no area i dont have . with this i know its all about hugginf sides that give .001 lol on all areas that will add up just where to start form i have been doing hard mode vanqishing slowly so hopefully i will get it all 100%

but this ideal is good been thinking about it alot over the last months time it would help alot but still make it time comsuing

/signed

If your having problems finding areas you need, when comparing maps, then ask for help.

There are countless threads on this website, that offer help with comparing maps. I used them and they helped alot.

Shadow Dragon · May 08, 2007, 08:21 AM // 08:21

I say go for it. Having done this already and knowing what a pain it is i say good idea. will prevent many a person from freaking out and breaking something.

/signed

zwei2stein · May 08, 2007, 08:27 AM // 08:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

There are countless threads on this website, that offer help with comparing maps. I used them and they helped alot.

How was THAT not cheating on title?

The way i see it, if you companre maps out of game or have other compare them for you, it's not diffenrent from game showing you where you miss spot.

IF anything, it would be way less cheating.

Why? If you get maps compared, player who compared it will tell you where exactly you have to go.

On the other hand, if all you knew is % you would still have to find that spot yourself.

% Would remove one of most stupid things about mapping: Re-entering already explored areas.

You still have to wallhug manually everything anyway, knowing that you are wallhugging right areas makes all your walhugging of already explored areas pointless and wasted, true, but it was pointless and wasted to begin with.

freekedoutfish · May 08, 2007, 09:07 AM // 09:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by zwei2stein

How was THAT not cheating on title?

The way i see it, if you companre maps out of game or have other compare them for you, it's not diffenrent from game showing you where you miss spot.

IF anything, it would be way less cheating.

Why? If you get maps compared, player who compared it will tell you where exactly you have to go.

On the other hand, if all you knew is % you would still have to find that spot yourself.

% Would remove one of most stupid things about mapping: Re-entering already explored areas.

You still have to wallhug manually everything anyway, knowing that you are wallhugging right areas makes all your walhugging of already explored areas pointless and wasted, true, but it was pointless and wasted to begin with.

Ive had this discusson with someone on here already, so im going to keep it short....

Comparing maps = using your head, your intelligent, your inititive, resources, time and effort. It shows you willing to put outside effort into exploring.

% marks on screen = nothing. It shows you can read some numbers on screen.

Simple! Their both cheating, but ones a lesser evil and one shows a willingness to put some effort in.

You'l probably disagree, but im not getting into it.

MAnderson · May 08, 2007, 09:25 AM // 09:25

This is quite a nice idea.
/Singed
But I say make the box subtle or removable so it won't annoy those whom it means nothing to.

Gem · May 08, 2007, 12:06 PM // 12:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhavv

I have 100% tyria and 97.5% cantha, but just adding a box that tells you how much you have explored isnt devaluing the title at all, just like the vanquisher box doesnt devalue that title.

The vanquisher box doesn't tell you how many you are missing. And finding a red spot on your mini map is way easier than finding the last missing spot of the map. The titles are very different in nature. Vanquisher tests you as a fighter, the explorer as someone with patience and dedication. The box showing how enemies you've slain doesn't take away the challenge from the fighting, but a box telling you how much youve explored would take away from the challenge of exploring.

What comes to my agreeing or disagreeing with this, I'm not too sure if this should somehow be visible to players. (For the reference, I am a 100% explorer in Tyria. I had over 95% even before titles were put in the game) I wouldn't personally want a new box to my bar when I've got enough enchantments, hexes, conditions, preparations and what not to. Also i wouldn't like the players to have the possibility to ctrl-click spam their percantage. An alternative idea might be to show this on the large map under the are names. Just some sort of mark if the area has been 100% explored or not, not the exact percantage.

Btw, I think that showing the number correctly would require ANet to tweak their system. I don't think that the system currently recognises which spots of map belong to which area. And how about spots that can be explored from multiple areas? Would thy be included to the totl of all those areas?

Abnaxus · May 08, 2007, 01:20 PM // 13:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

Comparing maps = using your head, your intelligent, your inititive, resources, time and effort. It shows you willing to put outside effort into exploring.

% marks on screen = nothing. It shows you can read some numbers on screen.

Simple! Their both cheating, but ones a lesser evil and one shows a willingness to put some effort in.

You'l probably disagree, but im not getting into it.

I already wrote this in the Cantha explorer thread.

I have only 1 GMC (Cantha, needed for KoBD) and I find the way exploration is designed simply frustrating.

There's no way "in game" to know at what point you are and what you need to do to achieve the title (unlike all of other titles).
The "fog" system is crap, for several points of the map you don't know if what you see is fog of texture.
Some small areas can be unfogged standing only in some precise spots and with the mouse oriented in the right direction.

The only way to realistically be able to obtain it is by using external resources, as those available on websites. I did, but to me that's cheating.

I started to go after this title together with a friend, he stopped when he was at 95% because he soon realized that it was pure stupidity to go on, I finished and at the end I felt an idiot nerd.

We should have in game and not from websites something that makes us aware of what we need to do to complete the exploration.

The % indicator is a good idea. /Signed.

And about the fact that existing GMCs will be screwed because the title could become less frustrating and nerdish to achieve, I can't care less, we all cheated to get it.

freekedoutfish · May 08, 2007, 01:50 PM // 13:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abnaxus

We should have in game and not from websites something that makes us aware of what we need to do to complete the exploration.

The % indicator is a good idea. /Signed.

And about the fact that existing GMCs will be screwed because the title could become less frustrating and nerdish to achieve, I can't care less, we all cheated to get it.

I absolutely agree that we need some kind of training, or information somewhere to educate people about how exploration should be done.

Alot of people get frustrated with exploration because they believe the stigmata surrounding it. They believe the rubbish about it being "easy".

Then they start, and get to about 80%-90% and soon realise its not and that it takes dedication and a stress-ball.

But because they went into it, with this "ah this wont take long" mentality, they start to complain.

We need some kind of NPC exploration trainers, who can make people explore areas of training zones. It would have to be challenging mind to show its not easy.

If they had that experience, and it was a tough, then it would widen their eyes as to how hard it can be.

But because there is nothing like that, and all we hear is "exploration is easy", people start it to get an "easy" 3 max titles. The result is we get people asking for % marks.

But I wouldnt shrug off those of us who already have legendary cartographer. Your not going to get many votes doing that.

Gargle Blaster · May 08, 2007, 02:39 PM // 14:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abnaxus

The only way to realistically be able to obtain it is by using external resources, as those available on websites. I did, but to me that's cheating.

by that definition: Its cheating to look up on wiki to find out where a collector is... or what boss drops a green you want...

the cheating stuph is a red herring... people before you cleared the maps some how... kill all monsters on a map... walk around the edge of a map... (note: what direction you are facing matters) it is possible with or without getting help form other people...

The cartographer titles are easy to get, specially now with normal mode...
What little challenge there is would be eliminated

IMHO strategy games should not be mind less and easy

Diddy bow · May 08, 2007, 03:01 PM // 15:01

/signed

the whole idea of this title as it is is silly imo

darkorical · May 08, 2007, 03:43 PM // 15:43

/signed

as for the I did it you can too people. I dont really give a rats a$$ what you did I am sick of all of you weather it be on this or topic or anything else. you all seem to be some what delusional in the idea that anything in game matters. like somehow you will be able to put KoBD on your Resume and your employer will say now there is a dedicated worker he goes out of his way to get the job done. well I got news for you that may be the way you look at it but in the real world if you put that along with the 2 paragraph explanition of what it means. the employer will look at that and say oh great a video game geek, probably have to watch this one to make sure he isnt surfing porn on the company t3.

Something I keep seeing over and over is people saying use the alt tab to compare to a 100% map. Well its good to know that your computer will do that. Personally when I first started playing GW if I tried to alt tab out I would go out then guild wars would crash.

Yet I know what you would say to that as well "upgrade your computer" Ive seem you people say that over and over in responce to everything from Im having lag issues to I cant run vent and GW at the same time.

maybe if you weren't so absorbed in your own leetness you would be able to comprehiend one grain of compassion and understanding for someone who might not have time to play or someone who's computer just barlely runs guild wars in the first place.

also the arguement that it will make all my hard work worthless. no it wont becasue those who give a damn about your title will talk to you about it and you can say I did it the hard way. and those like myself who don't care wont bother you.

if you think this will ruin your title think of the people who got lvl 20 in pre by lvling 1-2 moas at a time those people spent hundreds and hundreds of hours on that they worked their asses off to get that title. And what happened someone discovered death-lvling whole GROUPS of char north of the wall now it doesn't take near as long to get it I haven't seen any of them complaining to remove those char or otherwise remove the easier way.

or how about the people who played drunk with post process effects turned off to get the drunkard title until someone firugred out the timeing on zoning to get the most effective use out of it.

or the 55ers who solo vanquish while the rest of us have to party and work hard for it.

or the people who spent big bucks and afked for entire weekends to get lucky and unlucky titles which can now be gotten by use of lock picks

or look back on the history of UW at first there were groups going down
then there was the 55/SS teams
then came the 55necro solo
then came the E/mo ~ E/me

troll farming used to be a solo 55 thing
then warriors figured it out
then others made builds
and now there is a Ele build that can kill the trolls in 20 seconds

same thing with minos

bottom line is people will always find ways of making things easier.

Think back to the first person to get FoW armor and what hell they must have went through to get it.
compare that to before the griffen nerf people were making millions of gold off of it and just buying everything from the merch to get FoW

did that devalue the first guys FoW armor. maybe but oh well perhaps who ever that was should get a special gold plated set.

As I sit here typing this I find myself hoping that someone will read it and think about it. however as much as I know this might happen I figure the more likly responce to this will be either someone pointing out my bad spelling or quoting small points and picking them and judging the post on a hole by that or some other such bs.

basically the only reason I am going ahead with posting this is because at this point its too long to simply trash and maybe just maybe someone will read it and get over themselves enough to be happy that somoene else didnt have to go through the hell that they did insead of whining about it.

Gargle Blaster · May 08, 2007, 06:14 PM // 18:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

as for the I did it you can too people. I dont really give a rats a$$ what you did I am sick of all of you weather it be on this or topic or anything else. you all seem to be some what delusional in the idea that anything in game matters...

if you don't think the title matters then why would you bother to sign this thread?

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

...Something I keep seeing over and over is people saying use the alt tab to compare to a 100% map. Well its good to know that your computer will do that. Personally when I first started playing GW if I tried to alt tab out I would go out then guild wars would crash.

Yet I know what you would say to that as well "upgrade your computer" Ive seem you people say that over and over in response to everything from Im having lag issues to I cant run vent and GW at the same time.

im sry you are having issues with your computer. there are other threads here to help with these issues... also you could try submitting a guild wars support ticket for specific problems.

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

maybe if you weren't so absorbed in your own leetness you would be able to comprehiend one grain of compassion and understanding for someone who might not have time to play or someone who's computer just barlely runs guild wars in the first place.

call me whatever names you want... but it will not inspire me to give you compassion.

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

also the arguement that it will make all my hard work worthless. no it wont becasue...

that is not my argument... i am saying the game will become too easy and strategy games should not be that simple... -life is not fair... rewards should be earned -deal with it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

those who give a damn about your title will talk to you about it and you can say I did it the hard way. and those like myself who don't care wont bother you.

i don't understand you again you say the title does not matter... nobody is forcing you to complete 100% exploration... if you don't like the title don't go for it...

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

if you think this will ruin your title think of the people who got lvl 20 in pre by lvling 1-2 moas at a time those people spent hundreds and hundreds of hours on that they worked their asses off to get that title. And what happened someone discovered death-lvling whole GROUPS of char north of the wall now it doesn't take near as long to get it I haven't seen any of them complaining to remove those char or otherwise remove the easier way.

um... death leveling char was faster/easier...

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

or how about the people who played drunk with post process effects turned off to get the drunkard title until someone firugred out the timeing on zoning to get the most effective use out of it.

it is not easy to get that much beer... what do i care if they learn how to drink it faster? i still respect the effort and $ needed to complete the title.

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

or the 55ers who solo vanquish while the rest of us have to party and work hard for it.

if you can 55 solo vanquish an area i give you some mad respect...

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

or the people who spent big bucks and afked for entire weekends to get lucky and unlucky titles which can now be gotten by use of lock picks

i respect the cash as it is not that easy to get...(except those people that ebay their cash, but that's another thread) the lucky and unlucky titles were only available to achieve during holiday events... i like the fact that you can now earn the titles for the rest of the year...(as i have noted in another thread)

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

or look back on the history of UW at first there were groups going down
then there was the 55/SS teams
then came the 55necro solo
then came the E/mo ~ E/me

troll farming used to be a solo 55 thing
then warriors figured it out
then others made builds
and now there is a Ele build that can kill the trolls in 20 seconds

i think its cool that people can come up with these builds... it shows that the game is still evolving and progressing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

bottom line is people will always find ways of making things easier.

yup.. i don't disagree with you there... however i think that people should not make all things easier.

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

Think back to the first person to get FoW armor and what hell they must have went through to get it.

FoW armor meh... i think the ancient armor looks better but i guess it depends on your char class

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

compare that to before the griffen nerf people were making millions of gold off of it and just buying everything from the merch to get FoW

all part of the game -life is not fair...

also note: it was easier then and more difficult now i don't have an issue with that...

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

did that devalue the first guys FoW armor. maybe but oh well perhaps who ever that was should get a special gold plated set.

well first off there is no way to do this... how can you determin that people got their money the hard way?

second... it might be cool to see gold plated sets of armor but i think you should have to work for them...

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

As I sit here typing this I find myself hoping that someone will read it and think about it. however as much as I know this might happen I figure the more likly responce to this will be either someone pointing out my bad spelling or quoting small points and picking them and judging the post on a hole by that or some other such bs.

well i hope i have shown you that i have thought about your ideas and words. i have not taken anything out of context(correct me if i'm wrong).

i don't care about bad spelling or other such bs...

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

basically the only reason I am going ahead with posting this is because at this point its too long to simply trash and maybe just maybe someone will read it and get over themselves enough to be happy that someone else didnt have to go through the hell that they did insead of whining about it.

i'm happy just to get into a good argument. -as i have said before, the cartographer titles are easy -not hell

darkorical · May 08, 2007, 11:44 PM // 23:44

alright first I wanna say WOOT for reading thought and arguements without flames (this is not sarcasm it is a thank you for intelligence)

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

as for the I did it you can too people. I dont really give a rats a$$ what you did I am sick of all of you weather it be on this or topic or anything else. you all seem to be some what delusional in the idea that anything in game matters...

if you don't think the title matters then why would you bother to sign this thread?

Just because I dont think it matters as a social point does not mean it isn't something to strive for. I only display my light bringer title because it helps in fighting.

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

...Something I keep seeing over and over is people saying use the alt tab to compare to a 100% map. Well its good to know that your computer will do that. Personally when I first started playing GW if I tried to alt tab out I would go out then guild wars would crash.

Yet I know what you would say to that as well "upgrade your computer" Ive seem you people say that over and over in response to everything from Im having lag issues to I cant run vent and GW at the same time.

im sry you are having issues with your computer. there are other threads here to help with these issues... also you could try submitting a guild wars support ticket for specific problems.

Actually in this case I did infact upgrade my computer personally I can run... alot while playing gw but there are others who cannot thanks however for taking the time to offer direction in this matter

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darkorical

maybe if you weren't so absorbed in your own leetness you would be able to comprehiend one grain of compassion and understanding for someone who might not have time to play or someone who's computer just barlely runs guild wars in the first place.

call me whatever names you want... but it will not inspire me to give you compassion.

as near as I can tell the only name I called you was leet ... and to many that would be considdered a compliment however the context I used it in was inteded to be dirogetory.

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

also the arguement that it will make all my hard work worthless. no it wont becasue...

that is not my argument... i am saying the game will become too easy and strategy games should not be that simple... -life is not fair... rewards should be earned -deal with it.

if you have in game % counter that will tell you if you have a completed area if not then you alt tab to a 100% map and compare you still have to visit the area to find out what you are missing. I am not sure if it will nessasarly make it easier faster yes but easier I might debate that (unless they post your % on the world map then Id go for easier) However I fail see to see the lvl of strategy involved in running in a zone to uncover the entire map.

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

those who give a damn about your title will talk to you about it and you can say I did it the hard way. and those like myself who don't care wont bother you.

i don't understand you again you say the title does not matter... nobody is forcing you to complete 100% exploration... if you don't like the title don't go for it...

Again I point out that while I do not see it as important or nessasaary it is something extra to do (kinda like a side quest unimportant yet fun to do)

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

if you think this will ruin your title think of the people who got lvl 20 in pre by lvling 1-2 moas at a time those people spent hundreds and hundreds of hours on that they worked their asses off to get that title. And what happened someone discovered death-lvling whole GROUPS of char north of the wall now it doesn't take near as long to get it I haven't seen any of them complaining to remove those char or otherwise remove the easier way.

um... death leveling char was faster/easier...

if you are agreeing with me that the char is the fasterand eaiser way to go then what do you see as the difference between an easier/faster way of doing that and an easeir faster way of getting cart.

if you are questioning my statement there is a thread right here on this forum that explains it in detain and says right in it that it is faster

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

or how about the people who played drunk with post process effects turned off to get the drunkard title until someone firugred out the timeing on zoning to get the most effective use out of it.

it is not easy to get that much beer... what do i care if they learn how to drink it faster? i still respect the effort and $ needed to complete the title.

Again you seem to be backing my point here why would it matter if its faster you still have to survive to uncover those places on the map and find them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

or the 55ers who solo vanquish while the rest of us have to party and work hard for it.

if you can 55 solo vanquish an area i give you some mad respect...

personally I have not however a guild mate of mine has his link

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

or the people who spent big bucks and afked for entire weekends to get lucky and unlucky titles which can now be gotten by use of lock picks

i respect the cash as it is not that easy to get...(except those people that ebay their cash, but that's another thread) the lucky and unlucky titles were only available to achieve during holiday events... i like the fact that you can now earn the titles for the rest of the year...(as i have noted in another thread)

and again you are all for the faster easier way of doing something

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

or look back on the history of UW at first there were groups going down
then there was the 55/SS teams
then came the 55necro solo
then came the E/mo ~ E/me

troll farming used to be a solo 55 thing
then warriors figured it out
then others made builds
and now there is a Ele build that can kill the trolls in 20 seconds

i think its cool that people can come up with these builds... it shows that the game is still evolving and progressing.

once more you seem to be all for someone coming up with an idea that made life easier and faster to do a long an tedious task

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

bottom line is people will always find ways of making things easier.

yup.. i don't disagree with you there... however i think that people should not make all things easier.

but you have stated over and over that you do in fact like the new and faster ways

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

Think back to the first person to get FoW armor and what hell they must have went through to get it.

FoW armor meh... i think the ancient armor looks better but i guess it depends on your char class

Visual preferance is one thing however there is no denying the difficulty of getting FoW armor

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

compare that to before the griffen nerf people were making millions of gold off of it and just buying everything from the merch to get FoW

all part of the game -life is not fair...

also note: it was easier then and more difficult now i don't have an issue with that...

so why the problam with making cart easier?

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

did that devalue the first guys FoW armor. maybe but oh well perhaps who ever that was should get a special gold plated set.

well first off there is no way to do this... how can you determin that people got their money the hard way?

second... it might be cool to see gold plated sets of armor but i think you should have to work for them...

the first person who ever got fow armor Im sure worked VERY hard for it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

As I sit here typing this I find myself hoping that someone will read it and think about it. however as much as I know this might happen I figure the more likly responce to this will be either someone pointing out my bad spelling or quoting small points and picking them and judging the post on a hole by that or some other such bs.

well i hope i have shown you that i have thought about your ideas and words. i have not taken anything out of context(correct me if i'm wrong).

i don't care about bad spelling or other such bs...

altho I think you may have missed my meaning on a few points I do thank you for taking the time and effort to make a intelligable responce

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkorical

basically the only reason I am going ahead with posting this is because at this point its too long to simply trash and maybe just maybe someone will read it and get over themselves enough to be happy that someone else didnt have to go through the hell that they did insead of whining about it.

i'm happy just to get into a good argument. -as i have said before, the cartographer titles are easy -not hell

argument/debate = good flame = bad
Im all for debates but if/when the flames start I'm gone

funnyman100 · May 09, 2007, 12:02 AM // 00:02

/signed
sounds like a good idea to me

Dougal Kronik · May 10, 2007, 12:48 AM // 00:48

darkorical, all of your examples are player initiatives and in game conditions.

What every player who has any difficulty getting GMC is basically asking for is the game environment to change to assist them.

Player initiatives are already there, help checking maps. In game conditions are already there, edge every zone.

You do not need to use Necrotic Traversal or any tricks for any continent. Nor do you need any arenas.

And I guarantee you can get GMC.