Curse

Age · Jul 28, 2007, 09:04 PM // 21:04

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Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

GW:EN is adding more of that lush, green, farmland look though. So they can play that to get that look.

I know but I am talking about seeing what post looked like before the searing.This would include expanding on pre to what is in post and that includes all the towns and outposts .This would be from The Pockmark Flats to The Ascalon Foothills.They could even up the lvls of Charr and why.

There is only 1 or 2 towns I would like to see in post and that is Rin close to the Noloni Academy mission and Drascir .

The reason for Rin my Monk was born there.

Fitz Rinley · Jul 29, 2007, 05:25 AM // 05:25

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Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

Have you considered that adding lvl20 content to pre-searing might/would be detrimental to the entire prophercies compaign.

Then they should never have set the Defender of Ascalon title so that it is such a pain in the butt to get to level 20 in a Training Zone. I have recommended a Pre-HM that once entered would not be something one could return a character from. That would add 10 levels to all monsters just so those working on DoA title would be able to do so in an enjoyable and adventuring manner instead of the idiotic death leveling junk that exists now.

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We need the majority of players to leave pre-searing at a set point, because otherwise most players would just hang around there and do all the lvl20 content and never move on.

If Pre had been set up with stones like Shing Jea monastery which indicate both rules and the nature of Pre, this would not be an issue. People do not go to Post because they find the nature of Post to be "Un-Fun." Perhaps instead of coercing people into leaving Pre, one should find out what can be done to make going to Post worthwhile for those who don't want to.

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Its bad enough we have players being spread accross 3 games and soon an expansion. By adding lvl20 content to pre-searing your basically adding another place to keep them away from the main content.

I find that discussion between players, and the need for skills for builds, and the interest in items of various skins, makes this a spurious argument. The question again is, why do so many people find being in Pre preferrable to to Post? What have the game designers done that made them scrap their characters and start over with no intention of ever leaving Pre? (And I remember watching it start with people who came back to Pre because "Post sucked".) Some of those things have been changed. But one thing that has never changed is the lack of proper introduction in the Pre-Searing area. While Factions and Nightfall have excellent explanations that lead a player further on, there is nothing - not even an initional dialogue briefing from Tydus that says what your mission objectives are in Pre. Nor does the published material/books give any help in this. I personally take new players around and pin the cities, help them collect their armor, and explain different approaches to using Pre on their way to the game experience in Post. ANet has done nothing to render my services unneeded in the 21 months that I have had the game.

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As i've said before, we need to encourage most people to leave pre-searing because otherwise player numbers will fall in that campaign. You will have newbiew players assuming that is the main game and they will never leave.

Again this is the fault of ANet for improperly providing instruction on the nature of the game and how to play it. It is not our fault. Nor should we be further penalized because of their lack of foresight to begin with. We now have a title to achieve in Pre. I destroyed my very first character just so I could go back and get the title. Now I have another year or so of death leveling spiders and striders so I can get it because there is no reasonable content for doing so.

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There has to be a clear distinction between pre-searing being a low level, training zone and making it clear you are meant to leave to access higher level content.

This can be done with a sign on a Wisdom Tablet that gives 50 experience and 10 gold between where you are initiated and the first Town Crier.

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Its all well and good having lvl20 content in factions and nightfall on the training islands, because you can leave and return there as you please. You can very easily leave thos training islands and take part in the rest of the game.

And a person who has been playing for 2 years or so cannot easily or ever return to Pre to seek the Defender title without destroying 2 years of invested effort in developing that character. We did not create this problem, ANet did. I refuse to accept your excuses that we should have to suffer for their lack of foresight and tendency to segregate people to castes of haves and have nots.

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But if we encouraged people to stay in pre-searing they cant just leave, and they wouldnt because they know that. We would end up with players rolling new chars and never leaving that zone.

We didnt encourage people to stay in Pre-Searing, ANet decisions and product discouraged them from wanting to enter Post. This is a completely different issue.

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Do you not think that would have a negative effect on player numbers?

Not in game, because those playing in Pre are still in game. So, no it does not have a negative impact on total player participation. It does affect distribution of participation, if and only if the Pre-Searing region remains something that sucks less in overall "suckiness factor" than Post.

I personally do not think Post sucks, so much as that ANet has made many decisions which negatively affected players (some of which have been corrected) and that players in Post are generally: immature, crass, leachy, rude, selfish, overly aggressive, scamming, etc. and in Pre one needs only deal with one such jerk at a time. In Pre I do not find these behaviors as much because new players are more likely to listen to those who have some experience, and be polite so they may gain that experience. And understand, ANet has made a very decent game overall, but it has many areas where it could still be improved.

DreamCatcher · Jul 29, 2007, 03:04 PM // 15:04

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Originally Posted by Fitz Rinley

And a person who has been playing for 2 years or so cannot easily or ever return to Pre to seek the Defender title without destroying 2 years of invested effort in developing that character. We did not create this problem, ANet did. I refuse to accept your excuses that we should have to suffer for their lack of foresight and tendency to segregate people to castes of haves and have nots.

Also you can just buy additional character slots

If only particular people would realise that outside the US mst people do not use a credit card *sigh* but oh well

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Originally Posted by October Jade

Perhaps I'm just being cynical here...but I laugh a little whenever I read someone talking about the presearing "community."

I spend a decent amount of time in pre, but I rarely talk to anyone...selling dye is usually the only occasion for which I hang around in town. The largest reason for this is that presearing is undeniably the cesspool of GW society. Ascalon City (at least on the American side) is full of foul-mouthed children who stand around doing little besides spouting racial/homophobic slurs and uninformed innuendos. Local chat ftl.

If you've spend a decent amount of time in pre then you should try to broaden your horison a bit.
If you want to see a glimpse of what is being ment with the "Presearing Community" then I suggest you visit www.presearing.com asap

I highly doubt Anet would choose this site to be an officially listed site on guildwars.com if it was filled with lvl 1 cybering eles and black dye scammers

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Originally Posted by Hyper.nl

The LDoA title is extremely hard to get, and having special content for people who get the title means that only a very tiny amount of the GW players will be able to play it.

It's great that we have a title for exceptional accievements like LDoA, but don't exclude the masses from game content in this way.

Well...I've been trying out the deathlevelling lately...

To level up from 15 to 16 will need around 200 solo charr boss runs. You'll get roughly +0.5% for each solo run you'll do.
To level up from 16 to 17 will need around 10 to 20 deathlevel sessions. You'll get around +5% to +10% for each deathlevel session you'll do.

For seasoned players at level 15 it could take an estimated 15 minutes to farm all the bosses which would cost a total of 200*15=3000 minutes to level up.
For seasoned players at level 16 it could take an estimated 45 minutes (I'm being generous here) to set up 1 deathlevel. Under worst case scenario you'd need to do this 20 times costing you a total of 20*45=900 minutes.

To level from 14 to 15 --> 1500 minutes (100 solo runs)
To level from 15 to 16 --> 3000 minutes
To level from 16 to 17 --> 900 minutes

I came to the conclusion that deathlevelling is actually a lot easier then playing through the game, levelling up, in a normal way

What makes deathlevelling so tedious is the risk of getting disconnects and the amount of planning you need to do (aswell have having a 300W electrical device running for 20*9=180 hours just to level from 16 to 17) so I realy don't see whats so hard about deathlevelling.
Now I've tried it out for myself and with this new knowledge I now see that deathlevelling is even more retarded then I previously thought and a normal way to reach level 20 in pre to me is now even more desirable!

Now on to the requirement of pre searing hardmode.
Obviously having a minimum requirement of level 20 defeats the purpose of having an alternative way to deathlevel so it should be a lower level.
Some people want to see this minimum requirement set at level 10 or so which (when teamed up by a powerleveller, no matter if you pay him or not) would cheapen this title as you'd get massive amounts of xp from your powerleveller killing all the foes fro you. remember that without pre HM going from 14 to 16 alone takes 4.5k minutes of defending ascalon against the charr invasion.
Levelling from 13 to 14 takes significantly less time then levelling from 14 to 15 as you'll still get some xp from the normal charr.

I'm seeking a way to have the LDoA title obtainable in an alternative way besides the much too easy deathlevelling where the only hard part is to find yourself a quality internet provider while not making it even more easy to obtain this title by means of for example power levelling.

Powerlevelling is a serious issue in pre, many people ask for a power level in pre as it is now!
Having powerlevel seekers completely denied from gaining xp from higher level charr is nessesary to prevent the LDoA title to be cheapened.

This is why imo the minimum level requirement for presearing HM should be set no lower then level 15 (as it might be easier to deathlevekl your way to lvl 16 then to do it the honorable old fashioned way) but no higher then level 16 (any higher defeats the purpose of having an alternative way to deathlevel).

Having a hardmode this way would make the title obtainable also to people who aren't blessed with a stable high-quality internet connection.
Realy, are there any LDoA title holders who would mind having the less fortunate presearing community members amongst us to be able to put the same amount of efford into getting this title?
It doesn't have to be just deathlevelling you know

Right now deathlevelling is highly impractical, too easy and doesn't even mean you're a legendary defender.
This should change!

Fitz Rinley · Jul 29, 2007, 10:07 PM // 22:07

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Originally Posted by DreamCatcher

Also you can just buy additional character slots

Fitz - from Latin Filius, meaning son, became bastardized to fitz by Irish monks when designating an illigitimate child. Rinley is taken from Rin, a location in the Kingdom of Ascalon, and Ley, a term for valley. Fitz's mother was a maid, who found herself in a family way thru the Baron of Rin Valley, Baron Rinley. Not wishing to deal with the scandal, the Baron had her quietly put away in a monastery dedicated to Batlhazar. There Fitz grew up training as both a warrior and a monk. When the day came for him to be received into the orders, and having accomplished the highest honors of his class, he knelt before his father to take his oath of office. At no point did his father, the Baron, ever acknowledge his successful son, or even smile. Fitz who had trained hard, earned his way into the best units, fought for the honor of his god and country, could not get recognition from the only place he cared to find it - his own father. Driven to excell for this recognition and being snubbed on the most important day of his young career and life, he crashed. He went on a binge and in the deepest night screamed a curse for all of Rin to burn. The very next day, it did. From that time on, driven by both guilt and the need to find acceptance in himself he has Defended Ascalon with pure and unquestioning zeal.

This is my first character. At what point, having already gone to Post before the title was created, did he have the option to attain the title that fits his background, story, and the character. The only option we are given is to destroy all of what we created and start over.

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Right now deathlevelling is highly impractical, too easy and doesn't even mean you're a legendary defender.
This should change!

I don't know about easy. I don't find anything that is utterly boring, repetitive, droll, tedious, and monotonous to be easy. Nor do I find it interesting or fun. However, since I have no choice if the character is going to have the title that is appropriate to who he is and what he is about, then I must go through this crap.

Snow Bunny · Jul 31, 2007, 05:09 PM // 17:09

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Fitz - from Latin Filius, meaning son, became bastardized to fitz by Irish monks when designating an illigitimate child. Rinley is taken from Rin, a location in the Kingdom of Ascalon, and Ley, a term for valley. Fitz's mother was a maid, who found herself in a family way thru the Baron of Rin Valley, Baron Rinley. Not wishing to deal with the scandal, the Baron had her quietly put away in a monastery dedicated to Batlhazar. There Fitz grew up training as both a warrior and a monk. When the day came for him to be received into the orders, and having accomplished the highest honors of his class, he knelt before his father to take his oath of office. At no point did his father, the Baron, ever acknowledge his successful son, or even smile. Fitz who had trained hard, earned his way into the best units, fought for the honor of his god and country, could not get recognition from the only place he cared to find it - his own father. Driven to excell for this recognition and being snubbed on the most important day of his young career and life, he crashed. He went on a binge and in the deepest night screamed a curse for all of Rin to burn. The very next day, it did. From that time on, driven by both guilt and the need to find acceptance in himself he has Defended Ascalon with pure and unquestioning zeal.

This is my first character. At what point, having already gone to Post before the title was created, did he have the option to attain the title that fits his background, story, and the character. The only option we are given is to destroy all of what we created and start over.

It's your fault. Do you want to be able to get lvl3 survivor on your character too? I haven't done LDoA yet, but again, it's like survivor, which I have on my monk.

It's not about the title...it's about an accomplishment, something that is difficult and time consuming. I had 2 mil exp under my belt before one death. And then titles came out. I worked so hard to get that title. Why should someone who didn't have the same creative spark and determination be rewarded? Just because they want it?
And what is with the lore?

Fitz Rinley · Aug 01, 2007, 03:35 AM // 03:35

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Originally Posted by Snow Bunny

It's your fault. Do you want to be able to get lvl3 survivor on your character too? I haven't done LDoA yet, but again, it's like survivor, which I have on my monk.

No it is not my fault, and the Survivor Track line does not fit with this character. It will be appropriate to his son.

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It's not about the title...it's about an accomplishment, something that is difficult and time consuming.

If it is not about the title then take the words out of it. Merely call them Accomplishment 1, Accomplishment 2, and Accomplishment 3. After all there is no meaning to it, only some acquired numbers through tedium. They certainly don't need any descriptive attributes if they are only meant to waste time.

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I had 2 mil exp under my belt before one death. And then titles came out. I worked so hard to get that title. Why should someone who didn't have the same creative spark and determination be rewarded? Just because they want it?

Why should you deny someone something simply because your effort to get it was thwarted? If I had been in charge, I would have applied the titles retroactively to those who had made it to a certain stage before they died, or prorated it. If you have one death on your character and enough xp to exceed the first title level, I would have allowed that (but not further).
I did not state, they should be handed out just because people want them, but that they were applied without consideration of those who already had existing characters which they had fully developed. And no I do not consider wracking up a skill collection and attribute points to be character development. That is bean-counting analytical hog-wash that can be done by any mild intellect with no imagination.

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And what is with the lore?

That is character development. That is role playing. That is what an RPG is about. It is establishing a persona for your character that you explore by finding the decisions they would make that you would not, and understanding the reasons why they would make those decisions. It is getting to know each and every character you have as a different individual and allowing them to make the decisions based on what their nature is. An example of this is The Lord of the Rings, where Tolkien had absolutely no idea what was going to happen after Bree and let the book write itself for several chapters. But because he knew his characters and their environment he was able to express them. That 'Lore" is the foundation of my first character. It is why LDoA is appropriate to his character and nature. And no, their lack of consideration for existing characters is not my fault.