Curse

knifff · Sep 12, 2007, 09:00 AM // 09:00

/signed

Heores AI is worst then ever

Abbel Calima · Sep 12, 2007, 10:00 AM // 10:00

/signed
Stupid zhed

Naylyn · Sep 12, 2007, 11:05 AM // 11:05

/signed

I hate it when you flag your heros and they ignore it...

Zaxan Razor · Sep 12, 2007, 11:47 AM // 11:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gwondolas Marillion

Hiya!

Please excuse me if this probable solution to the problem has been given already (haven't read through all posts).

I think what you're experiencing with your heroes going berserk and aggroing way off is an auto-targeting issue. Targeted foe dies, and the hero/hench switches to an auto-targeted enemy; sometimes, if not even most often, outside the current bunch of foes due to the narrow targeting angle.

When experiencing these problems; has anyone tried opening the general Options panel (F11) and turning off the auto-target option?

/Gwon

To answer your question, yes, I always have auto targeting turned off. It doesn't alter anything with the heroes.

Hailfall · Sep 12, 2007, 01:04 PM // 13:04

/signed

I can't stand the fact that they run sometimes across the map to 'gather' some mobs while waiting for energy to regen..

Pulling? Sure Zhed will run in to cast flare and run back.. gg Zhed!

And when you are dead.. the Elementalists will res eachother first.. then the monks and then you.. Why in heavens name?

Talkhora and Goren like running off together in the opposite direction for no reason..

The list goes on and on..

xArcaeus · Sep 12, 2007, 01:24 PM // 13:24

Last night I was in Slaver's Exile, right before ForgeWight, and had Ogden flagged in the SW corner by the large fire pit, which sets you on fire any time u step on it. While my team was debating on what to do, Ogden decides the best strategy is to continually run into the embers, set himself on fire, and run back to his corner. Rinse and repeat as we all watch and laugh. Forgewight is large and scary, yes, but do the heroes really need to commit suicide? Anet?

rancidgoat · Sep 12, 2007, 01:32 PM // 13:32

/signed

LEROOOOOOOOOOOOYYYY ZHEDKIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINSSSSS!!

Croco Clouds · Sep 12, 2007, 04:34 PM // 16:34

/signed

Zhed is killing my party after his unexpected tank to the destroyers (I made him set to defense)

Fionn Falaich · Sep 12, 2007, 09:37 PM // 21:37

/signed

I've had many of the problems mentioned in this thread, mostly with caster heroes set to guard but disregarding flags and deciding to leeroy into a mob 1.5 aggro bubbles away, and similar overaggro problems. They have never been great at those things, and although they do seem worse now than before, I figured it was just one of those things and we had to live with it.

But since last night they have started something new: they refuse to follow me. They just stand there. Doing nothing. They aren't flagged, and I am jogging along to the next encounter, but they just stand there. I discovered it last night in Slavers Exile when I gave the signal to attack Rand Stormweaver, and noticed a little too late that only Jora and MoW decided to follow me (ele) into the fray.

Livia and four hench decided to stay at the bottom of the hill. After a quick wipe and res, I watched them and they did the exact same thing a number of times.

A similar thing just happend now. I was jogging through Lake of Drakkar with a different character, and NONE of the party followed me. We are not on the frozen lake itself, so the ice is not the issue. I decided to keep going to see if they would ever decide to follow, and it took until they were well outside my aggro bubble (~2x) before they decided to start moving in my direction.

I can deal with over aggro, but not following and not attacking? The whole AI needs serious attention.

genofreek · Sep 12, 2007, 10:40 PM // 22:40

I haven't had that issue -- they always follow -- but I've been hearing people complain about it in outposts.

Not funny, Anet. Please fix this. We know the AI can be improved because the enemies don't pull this stupid ****. They stay with their groups and run out of AoE dangers while Koss pulls raptors from the other side of the map and Mhenlo squats in an area that's getting Maelstrom'D to hell.

Pkest · Sep 12, 2007, 11:11 PM // 23:11

I've had all sorts of trouble lately with leroying heroes and sleeping heroes. I'm starting to think that Anet dumbed them down on purpose so everyone will stop asking for full hero parties.

Heimdallw32 · Sep 12, 2007, 11:16 PM // 23:16

Friend had his hero's rez locked out so he wouldn't use it (Ogden kept charging in to try to rez despite being flagged far far away...we were trying to recover from a near-wipe)...lo and behold, he continued running in to try to rez (and die). Even after the skill was "disabled". He got rezzed, and first thing he'd do would be to try to rez an ally instead of healing himself or -obeying the flag-. Yeah, okay, when user input doesn't do what it should, then there's a problem, definatly noticed that when a couple friends and I went out to cap Avatar of Balthazar for my Dervish. Let's just say the heros didn't help. Suicidal Melonni...ugh. And yes she was set to "Guard", and flagged some distance away from the fort. Friend goes in to try to pull some mobs out, and off she goes. Reflagging didn't work until she had the boss aggroed as well, then she ran back to us and stood there while the boss played with our backline.

oracleofwoe · Sep 13, 2007, 12:42 AM // 00:42

/signed
for some reason my dunkoro with 16 healing can only cast healing breeze for +3 health regen!!! wtf is going on????

Karlos · Sep 13, 2007, 02:25 AM // 02:25

Folks: Nothing changed in the hero AI. The new dungeons present new challenges that the hero AI has not been proigrammed to deal with correctly.

Here are a few examples:
*In the Elusive Golemancer quest, the first part of the second level, where you get attacked by the Golems if you pick up the key and they stop if you drop it. This part is very hard to do solo with henchies because if you tell them to move while getting hit, they don't seem to listen to you.
*In the same level, in the corridor of death where you have to walk with the protection golem past the fire traps or get nailed. Same thing, heroes do not seem to follow your flagging and calling correctly.

Now, here is what's happening:
*Heroes are programmed to heal any critically wounded party member. The priority of this is increased above obeying your movement commands IF they are close enough. i.e. If you are running (not standing still) and Mhenlo is half an aggro bubble behind you, and someone is critically injured, Mhenlo will stop to heal that person. Even though you are still walking. This is generally a good thing. If you're running from some bad guys and they land a fireball on your party, you want your monks to slap a few quick heals and not just keep walking like zombies.
*However, the new dungeons in GW:EN present the heroes/henchies with new challenges they don't comprehend. For example, Mhenlo doesn't understand that if he lags too far behind the protection golem's ward he's going to get toasted. He stops to heal someone, he drifts out of the ward, the fire traps start nailing him, you flag him forward, but as soon as he gets to what he considers "close enough" he stops to heal himself, only succeeding in getting clobbered more and never actually making it back into the ward. Then Zhed tries to res him and gets machine gunned to death by the trap just as he brings up Mhenlo who keeps trying to heal himself and the cycle continues.

I am not really sure what the solution is. Frankly, I think that part of the quest could use a little toning down. Fewer golems in that room with the key and fewer fire traps in the corridor. I know there are ways to get around hero stupidity (for example, body block the protection Golem so he stops until you mhenlo can heal all he wants) but overall, I think the encounter just has a big "WIPE" written all over it. This problem also exists in any dungeon with a large number of fire or ice traps. The traps near the key in the snowman lair is one other spot where a ridiculously easy dungeon can all of a sudden present a challenge simply because Mhenlo won't keep walking.

Punches · Sep 13, 2007, 03:02 AM // 03:02

/signed

Whether or not there has been a change, heroes ignoring the flags I place for them is a big problem for me. Holding a leash does you no good unless you put it on the dog.

Maria The Princess · Sep 13, 2007, 03:15 AM // 03:15

/signed

as soon as theres 1 bone horror attacking the target, all my henchies/heros just stand around the enemy picking in their noses. when i lock target, or call target, it doesnt help! they wait till the poor bone horror dies to attack the thing.

and this is regular PVE, not dungeons, or anything like this. simple prophecies misions.

Dylananimus · Sep 13, 2007, 04:16 AM // 04:16

/signed

Now, despite some claims here that it's us that are stupid -_- I do believe the heroes/henchies are failing to cope properly with the new environment of GWEN.

I have played all three previous campaigns with h/h alone, so believe me...I know how to control them. I flag them, together and seperatly when needed. I blank out certain spells I don't want them to spam, or know need a critical time of execution ( I keep their skill bars up at all times so I can cast the blanked spells for them). Yes, I know how to use henchies/heroes...so do not attempt to call me stupid for noticing a change, no matter how subtle at times.

I noticed right away that Jora just did not like the Watch Yourself skill, and Vekk...don't get me started on him, he was a maniac. Running in constantly with no need. I booted him and brought Zhed back but even he seems a little out of whack. My warrior (when I rarely bring one) does not attack if I'm using a longbow, or casting from far back. He'll stand by me and start yawning. This needs fixed, especially when I'm pinging the enemy over and over to get his attention. Yes, I could flag him into the fight, but I'm too busy casting the heroes spells, and trying to do my job too :/

The AI seems bugged, end of. I've heard complaints from very, very experienced (and non-stupid) players. The game is still playable, and the quests still beatable, but it's taking more effort to get the h/hs to do what you need.

It gets frustrating at times, and you have to learn ways to counter their stupidity. Like the GOLEM thing and the ring of fire ward. I had to blank out every one of my hero monks spells in order to keep him with me and not stopping to heal minions (which they seriously need to stop h/hs doing unless it's the MM) That of course meant playing my role and theirs when it came to fighting

They're needing more weilding than is fair in an expension that presents its own set of difficulties (namely that yes, it's deliciously that bit harder

).

Come on Anet, play fair and give us our old Heroes back

Mindtrust · Sep 13, 2007, 04:42 AM // 04:42

/signed

yesterday it was hilarious i had 2 super tanks in Lina and Menhlo, most of the time they totally ignored the flag. Something must be broke with the ai, if you want to bring us hard mode please to do it the proper way

flclempire · Sep 13, 2007, 05:47 AM // 05:47

*Signed*
They don't fight unless I'm holding completely still, if I turn at all they run back to me and get into formation. Also they don't attack the target that I attack+ping, its so pathetic.

Targren · Sep 13, 2007, 06:31 AM // 06:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karlos

Folks: Nothing changed in the hero AI. The new dungeons present new challenges that the hero AI has not been proigrammed to deal with correctly.

Bollocks. This isn't a GWEN-only issue. Tonight I was trying to do Ice Caves of Sorrow (Prophesies) and all was going fine. There's a pathing issue in there where heroes will get jammed up next to a ramp towards the end of the first part, but I got around that with a few seconds' flag-twiddling.

The real fun started when, in the beginning of the last part of the mission that I like to call "Run like hell from the Mursaat" that Olias and Koss decided that since heroes are infused, they should TURN THE RED ENGINE AROUND, run PAST the persuing mursaat, and aggro the SWARM in front of the bonus!

I use heroes so I don't have to PUG, FFS.

/signed