Curse

~ Dan ~ · Oct 24, 2007, 01:24 PM // 13:24

At the end of the day Bazompora, you are clearly not taking into account what people put in for these titles.

You think that maxing treasure hunter earns you far more cash. Think for a moment, how much money was pumped into that. How many hours were pumped into that.

The fact is most of the titles' bonuses do not effect general gameplay. The ones that do (effecting pve only skills, storyline progress etc) I agreed should be removed from the game, but that wasn't good enough for you.

The very fact that you believe putting all that time and money into a title doesn't deserve a proper reward, shows that there is something wrong with you.

Bazompora · Oct 24, 2007, 02:50 PM // 14:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by dan-the-noob

At the end of the day Bazompora, you are clearly not taking into account what people put in for these titles.

Actually, I do. You just keep on convincing yourself I don't. However, do you take those who are pulling on the short end of the title system into account?

Quote:

Originally Posted by dan-the-noob

You think that maxing treasure hunter earns you far more cash. Think for a moment, how much money was pumped into that. How many hours were pumped into that.

The quantity lost is the market value of the items lost through expert salvage, minus 8%; this can be even quite high at times. But even if an item is only worth a few K's, who are you to say it's worth nothing to the owner?
As for the money and time ... we're talking GW2 in this thread: no expenses have been made yet!

Quote:

Originally Posted by dan-the-noob

The fact is most of the titles' bonuses do not effect general gameplay. The ones that do (effecting pve only skills, storyline progress etc) I agreed should be removed from the game, but that wasn't good enough for you.

I'm not here to strike a bargain with you! Not only does neither of us deal the cards, but I'm here to address a serious gameplay issue: disadvantages for not ranking in titles. This is something that shouldn't repeat itself in GW2!

Quote:

Originally Posted by dan-the-noob

shows that there is something wrong with you.

You made clear what your "strategy" is; I'm not gonna bite.

Nadia Roark · Oct 24, 2007, 03:41 PM // 15:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bazompora

Actually, I do. You just keep on convincing yourself I don't. However, do you take those who are pulling on the short end of the title system into account?

I can't speak for him, but I'll go ahead and answer this on my own terms: No. I don't. You know why? Because it doesn't make a goddamn bit of a difference. Just because some people don't have titles is not a reason to remove or overhaul the entire system. I don't care what an untitled player thinks about titles. Why? Because they aren't familiar with what it takes to get a title and they are (you seem to be a perfect example) wildly ignorant about how long it takes or how hard it is, or whether the benefit is in keeping with the effort required to obtain it. You're just looking at numbers on a screen and deciding arbitrarily that you don't have the patience to acheive that number; thats your business but it's not a decision you have the right to force on the rest of us. Some of us actually don't mind that reputation titles cost 150,000 points to max, or that Cartographer is a royal pain in the ass I'll probably never bother with.

Quote:

The quantity lost is the market value of the items lost through expert salvage, minus 8%; this can be even quite high at times. But even if an item is only worth a few K's, who are you to say it's worth nothing to the owner?
As for the money and time ... we're talking GW2 in this thread: no expenses have been made yet!

Don't be a dumbass. If a skin is worth money, you don't salvage it. Salvage rates are only an issue when you want to keep the weapon and extract a mod from it, which has become less of an issue with the introduction of inscriptions. The only place I'll come close to agreeing with you is the salvage rate for lockpicks based on lucky/unlucky, but we've been over that already.

Also, of course we're talking about GW2, but we're (obviously) predicating our discussion on GW1 principles. You don't get to dismiss a point out of hand just because someone is using GW1 as a basis of comparison or as an example to validate their points (which, again, you're doing a fairly poor job of answering).

Quote:

I'm not here to strike a bargain with you! Not only does neither of us deal the cards, but I'm here to address a serious gameplay issue: disadvantages for not ranking in titles. This is something that shouldn't repeat itself in GW2!
You made clear what your "strategy" is; I'm not gonna bite.

Labelling this a "Serious gameplay issue" makes me chuckle. The "disadvantages" you've accrued by not playing the game are not my or anyone else's concern. That you have chosen a gameplay path that (apparently) does not move you towards any titles is your decision, not ours; so stop berating us for it plzkthx. There are dozens of titles to earn and most of them aren't any harder than beating a campaign. The fact that you don't have the time or patience for them is not a reason for Anet to totally rebalance titles when they release GW2.

Incidentally, I can't help but wonder why you're still stuck on slavage rates when salvage rates through the Wisdom Title is one of the most marginal gameplay effects I've ever seen in Guild Wars. You derive a much greater benefit by collecting and using PvE-only Reuptation-based skills, which are generally pretty powerful compared to normal skills, especially at r5+ in the pertinent reputation title. I already know I enjoy title benefits and don't want them to go anywhere, but in case you were planning to actually try and convince anyone else, you might try moving on from the salvage thing. If you lose a 100k+10e skin because you were an idiot and tried to salvage off the damage + 15% (while hexed) inscription, thats your fault, not the salvage rate's.

SotiCoto · Oct 24, 2007, 03:58 PM // 15:58

Can't we just get this stupid thread locked already?

95% of its content is pure bickering, and pondering over what will or will not show up in GW2 is pointless.

Nadia Roark · Oct 24, 2007, 04:01 PM // 16:01

Well, there's a mod reading the thread right now, so if it's gonna happen it might happen soon. I tend to agree that the points have been made and we're treading water, but if you're really that exasperated with a thread's content you could always try not reading it.

SotiCoto · Oct 24, 2007, 04:05 PM // 16:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nadia Roark

Well, there's a mod reading the thread right now, so if it's gonna happen it might happen soon. I tend to agree that the points have been made and we're treading water, but if you're really that exasperated with a thread's content you could always try not reading it.

Try telling that to the people who have screamed for closure in several of my threads that weren't even a quarter as argumentative / pointless as this one.... and got it.

Nah.
I am seeing content that, judging from prior experience... is not meant to be here. As such I'm suggesting it get closed so it does not continue.
Then again... I'm not expecting much. I report quite a few trolling posts these days, but they don't get deleted half as readily as my own relevant posts do. Go figure.
Perhaps I'm just getting bitter.

But honestly.... this whole thread was pointless enough even before the arguing started.

Nadia Roark · Oct 24, 2007, 04:16 PM // 16:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by SotiCoto

Try telling that to the people who have screamed for closure in several of my threads that weren't even a quarter as argumentative / pointless as this one.... and got it.

Nah.
I am seeing content that, judging from prior experience... is not meant to be here. As such I'm suggesting it get closed so it does not continue.
Then again... I'm not expecting much. I report quite a few trolling posts these days, but they don't get deleted half as readily as my own relevant posts do. Go figure.
Perhaps I'm just getting bitter.

But honestly.... this whole thread was pointless enough even before the arguing started.

C'est la vie. I moderate a different forum so I know how it goes sometimes. Sorry to hear that your previous threads were locked as the result of asshattery, but if you report "quite a few" trolling posts that might have something to do with it. I don't know how the mods here handle that, but on the forums I moderate we start getting exasperated with whistleblowers before too long, even if some of them do make our lives a bit easier. It's possible they're ignoring them because they don't want to encourage people to spend all their time hunting through GwG for troll posts. In general, mods don't like being told what to do, and report-happy players tend to develop the expectation that mods will act on any information they should choose to relay. Most of the time they're still right, but what are ya gonna do? People don't like being told how to do their jobs. The "report" feature on vB is more of a curse than a blessing

Drop of Fear · Oct 24, 2007, 04:21 PM // 16:21

the arrogance of this Bazompora is pretty amazing. he's the only one entitled to have an opinion and his posts embody the ultimate truth. why there's even a discussion here? he's clearly not accepting ideas that doesn't match with what he thinks...

Bazompora: Titles are BAAAD
Jon Doe: Imho titles are a good thing
Bazompora: U'RE WRONG TITLES ARE BAAAAD.
Jane Doe: dude u're using caps...
Bazompora NO I'M NOOOOOOOT!!!! AND I'LL KEEP SHOUTING THAT TITLES ARE BAAAAD TILL U'LL ALL ACCEPT THIS!!!
Jennifer Doe: whatever...

This said. i think titles pretty much saved guild wars. Just face it, it's nice to have a game that doesnt discriminate new players for a while, but after a year noone would play it anymore, just moved to other games. titles gave ppl something to do. most titles are fun, if u dont like grind simply avoid the grinding titles, or u want them for free?

treasure hunter and luxky titles do give higher retain rate for lockpicks... unfair? we all started at the same retain rate. even people that now have r7 chests and r6 lucky started at r0 in both titles.
if u don't open many chests why do u care about crappy retain rates at all? and if u're opening chests, well u start at the same +0 bonus retain rate as we all did.

BlackSephir · Oct 24, 2007, 04:29 PM // 16:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drop of Fear

treasure hunter and luxky titles do give higher retain rate for lockpicks... unfair? we all started at the same retain rate. even people that now have r7 chests and r6 lucky started at r0 in both titles.
if u don't open many chests why do u care about crappy retain rates at all? and if u're opening chests, well u start at the same +0 bonus retain rate as we all did.

I don't give a shit abour your titles. What I don't get is, why my Pain Inverter should be less effective than yours? Because I don't grind, is that it?
Pretty pathetic.

Drop of Fear · Oct 24, 2007, 04:31 PM // 16:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackSephir

I don't give a shit abour your titles. What I don't get is, why my Pain Inverter should be less effective than yours? Because I don't grind, is that it?
Pretty pathetic.

u can "grind" 160k asuran points in 15 hours, other reputations are even faster. even better, playing throught the whole game should give u around 1 third of those 160k points u need. if u bring hero's handbook and dungeon master guide with u while u play the game u basicly reach r10 asura without farming a single point.
if u call this grind, u have no idea what's griding about. pick another random mmo and u realize that gw is nowhere close to that.

Nadia Roark · Oct 24, 2007, 04:36 PM // 16:36

I think a lot of people are complaining about grind without using other MMO's as a basis of comparison. In WoW you have to grind simply for max level items-- in GW you get them simply as a matter of course. Sure, GW has grind, but the only real purpose it serves is (as so many of us keep repeating) cosmetic. You don't need Pain Inverter or r5 Treasure Hunter to play the game effectively, and it is not balanced with the assumption that the player has either of these things.

BlackSephir · Oct 24, 2007, 04:53 PM // 16:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drop of Fear

u can "grind" 160k asuran points in 15 hours, other reputations are even faster. even better, playing throught the whole game should give u around 1 third of those 160k points u need. if u bring hero's handbook and dungeon master guide with u while u play the game u basicly reach r10 asura without farming a single point.

Bwahaha, please, don't make me do maths again. Besides, if you repeat something, like clearing area, it's still grind. If you repeat all dungeons 3 times it's still grind.

Quote:

if u call this grind, u have no idea what's griding about. pick another random mmo and u realize that gw is nowhere close to that.

If you want to remember how GW looks without grind- go play Prophecies. And then compare it to Nightfall and GWEN.

Quote:

In WoW you have to grind simply for max level items-- in GW you get them simply as a matter of course.

I'm sorry, why the hell do you bring WoW here? Nobody cares how much you have to grind in WoW, L2 r other MMO's, we're talking about GW. Which even shouldn't be in the same category as the rest. CORPG =/ MMORPG.

Quote:

GW has grind, but the only real purpose it serves is (as so many of us keep repeating) cosmetic.

Wrong. And bullshit. You know what's cosmetic? Hero emote. Pet for I'm Very Important. People with Mighty Gladiator under their nicknames. That's cosmetic, that doesn't affect the gameplay. Higher ranks in GWEN reps do affect gameplay. Higher Lucky affect gameplay. Higher Seeker of Wisdom and Treasure Hunter affect the gameplay too. So it's not in any way cosmetic.

And how do you get your rank up? By "working" i.e. spending time on killing mobs. Doesn't matter if you're more or less skilled player, Asuran skills will be more effective if you spend more time on grind.
In a game which was supposed to be "skill > time". Whoo!

Cebe · Oct 24, 2007, 05:30 PM // 17:30

Seems this thread is now going round in circles and is only going to generate more arguments. Time to put it to sleep.

***LOCKDOWN INITIATED***