Curse

ValaOfTheFens · Jun 16, 2008, 04:26 AM // 04:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aera

[arcane mimicry][ursan blessing]

Who needs attribute points?

/fail

Not everyone has EoTN. Ursan is a problem, not a solution.

I guess part of the problem is the flawed design of Prophecies. Its about 5 missions too big and as a result everything is spread thin. Elites are only available in the last 1/3 of the game, unless you run to Drok's, and so you need your non-elites as powerful as possible. My monk has been turned away from parties just because she can't heal or prot as well as a monk with those 30 extra AP. Silly but true.

Div · Jun 16, 2008, 05:02 AM // 05:02

They don't need to be earlier. The other games just need to have the 15 attribute quests later. I love it when people complain about Tyria being too long or things going too slow.

RedNova88 · Jun 16, 2008, 05:38 AM // 05:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by holymasamune

They don't need to be earlier. The other games just need to have the 15 attribute quests later. I love it when people complain about Tyria being too long or things going too slow.

It's not that it's actually slow. It's just that doing it once is enough, after that it just becomes work, and quite a few builds don't function properly without the +30 attribute points.

If there was some way to get them earlier on after beating it once I'd be happy.

I'm not begging or whining. Just saying, after the first or second time it just becomes tedious, and the more you do it the more tedious it becomes because you've seen everything before. It's like watching the same movie repeatedly and not being able to fast forward to points of interest.

/signed

Kinn · Jun 16, 2008, 12:14 PM // 12:14

Absolutely no quest or mission in Prophecies, up until the attribute quests, is demanding enough to require that you need all the attr points.

Why make things easier than they already are?

/notsigned

Omnidragon42 · Jun 16, 2008, 12:32 PM // 12:32

Honestly, if you're determined to get those points, it's not hard. The first one is in the desert and takes about 30 minutes, and the hardest part of the second one is getting to Copperhammer to have a safe spot to leave from. If that's too much of a problem then get a run from LA->Sanctum, do sanctum and fight to augury, get a run to the desert missions, either get those run or do them, do that quest, get a droks run, get run to copperhammer and do the second quest. Take a couple hours and just do it.

I've made 8 prophesies characters that have done both quests (3 eles, 2 rangers, war, monk, and necro). I think they're well placed in the game.

And you say you're level 20 in the jungle? My first character didn't hit level 20 until I fought the doppelganger =\. I did all the desert missions at level 17. Tyria is slower than the other campaigns, but is that really such a bad thing? Some people like to take it slow.

MagmaRed · Jun 16, 2008, 01:06 PM // 13:06

/unsigned

If you don't want to play PvE, there is a thing called a PvP character. If it was diffictult to do any of Tyrian PvE, I might agree, but even using hench, you can easily get to the attribute points. And if you don't enjoy playing the game, then why are you?

ValaOfTheFens · Jun 16, 2008, 02:06 PM // 14:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagmaRed

/unsigned

If you don't want to play PvE, there is a thing called a PvP character. If it was diffictult to do any of Tyrian PvE, I might agree, but even using hench, you can easily get to the attribute points. And if you don't enjoy playing the game, then why are you?

I didn't say I didn't want to play PvE. I just said I'd prefer to get my additional 30 AP earlier in the game. Prophecies has some good ideas about PvE but those same ideas were done away with in the other 2 campaigns. Like letting you get a Signet of Capture before there are any elite skills to use it for and attaching a quest to changing your secondary profession.

Lyndka · Jun 16, 2008, 02:56 PM // 14:56

A Cap Signet will also cap non-Elite skills - which I guess they thought was handy before 'skill unlock' packs were thought of and it was a while before you were getting to an outpost with a Skills Trainer. Also - you need to do a mission in Factions before you can change your second - the equivalent of Ascension.

Personally, the extra attribute points have always been a nice extra bonus that came late in the campaign. I get a character from Ascalon to LA at L12/13 or thereabouts - level there to 15/16 in an hour, grab Heroes then off to Cantha for the first quests and L20 for everyone in about 90 minutes. The only annoying part is the hiking to and from to get to Consulate Docks for better armour if I do it as part of the sequence.

Even with Prophecies standalone I think the extra points are about the right point in the story.

Hyper Cutter · Jun 16, 2008, 09:28 PM // 21:28

/signed, because getting those last points for Tyrian characters really sucked (one of the reasons most of my core class characters are Canthan). Especially before heroes and the ability to go up through Elona for the desert quest...

quickmonty · Jun 16, 2008, 09:36 PM // 21:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by holymasamune

They don't need to be earlier. The other games just need to have the 15 attribute quests later. I love it when people complain about Tyria being too long or things going too slow.

Agree. The other campaigns should have the attribute quests pushed back later in the storyline.

Konig Des Todes · Jun 16, 2008, 09:57 PM // 21:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by holymasamune

They don't need to be earlier. The other games just need to have the 15 attribute quests later. I love it when people complain about Tyria being too long or things going too slow.

QFT!

The attribute points in Factions should be placed in the Kurzick/Luxon areas (one in each, and before Eternal Grove/Gyala Hatchery) and the points for NF should be put in Kourna/Vabbi. Thats my opinion of course. Tyria is easy to get the points in, not as easy as NF or Factions, but come on, don't want to do some work, just join the League of Lame Ursans, that way you won't need any attribute points.

/signed for pushing attribute points back in Factions/NF

Nessar · Jun 16, 2008, 10:08 PM // 22:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by holymasamune

They don't need to be earlier. The other games just need to have the 15 attribute quests later. I love it when people complain about Tyria being too long or things going too slow.

QFT!
and
/notsigned for OP's post
/signed for this idea

Age · Jun 16, 2008, 11:26 PM // 23:26

I would say that you should be ascended before you hit ToA as most there are ascended.I conside it an ascention area.

Steps_Descending · Jun 16, 2008, 11:56 PM // 23:56

/UNsigned

Because Prophecy's epicness(did I say Proph was the only epic one? no) comes from the slowness of the game.

Targren · Jun 17, 2008, 02:48 PM // 14:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kinn

Absolutely no quest or mission in Prophecies, up until the attribute quests, is demanding enough to require that you need all the attr points.

Why make things easier than they already are?

/notsigned

Because maybe you get tired of slogging through the useless Jungle for the umpteenth time and want to go play one of the other campaigns or EotN for a little variety, without getting horribly raped?

Ambuu · Jun 17, 2008, 03:16 PM // 15:16

/notsigned

Prophecies was a slow game, so it makes sense for the atrribute quests to be after you ascend

silavor · Jun 17, 2008, 09:18 PM // 21:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kinn

Absolutely no quest or mission in Prophecies, up until the attribute quests, is demanding enough to require that you need all the attr points.

Why make things easier than they already are?

/notsigned

You're (slightly) wrong about not needing the attribute points. Once you reach LA, all of Factions, Nightfall, and EOTN become availible. All three pretty much require you to have all 200 attribute points. So if a Tyrian character wants to travel to other lands, it's mandatory to reach the crystal desert/southern shiverpeaks first. Of course, if the main port to and from Tyria was Amnoon Oasis/Sanctum Cay (which, by the way, is the NPC port-town to Cantha if you read the description) this wouldn't be a problem.

It would be better if the attribute quests for the other campaigns were pushed back, that way Tyrian-born characters would have a fighting chance in PUGs for Kryta/Maguuma.

quickmonty · Jun 17, 2008, 09:25 PM // 21:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Targren

Because maybe you get tired of slogging through the useless Jungle for the umpteenth time and want to go play one of the other campaigns or EotN for a little variety, without getting horribly raped?

"Slogging through the useless Jungle" isn't necessary. Take the 'shortcut' from ToA to Sanctum Cay.

I didn't realize you could get raped in the game. Someone should inform the authorities!

Kinn · Jun 17, 2008, 09:41 PM // 21:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Targren

Because maybe you get tired of slogging through the useless Jungle for the umpteenth time and want to go play one of the other campaigns or EotN for a little variety, without getting horribly raped?

Well if you're clearly not bothered about skipping the storyline, you could always pay the small amount of money that runners charge to get you from LA into the desert.

Clarissa F · Jun 18, 2008, 04:34 AM // 04:34

They require you to have 200 attribute points? EotN, where you get the 12/9/9/9 on your level 10 character? Hell, I got my sin past Shiro before I realized I forgot the Zen Daijun attribute quest. My ranger finished the Fire Islands before I knew you could get extra attribute points. They are not even "pretty much" required.

I am /signed for moving the attribute quests for the other chapters later. Cantha's are on Newbie island, and you just have to play the game to get the Elonan. Move the Canthan to post-Electric Light Parade and the Elonan to after Moddok Crevice, when you go past Chantry of Secrets, at a minimum.