Curse

House Silvermoon · Sep 19, 2008, 03:44 AM // 03:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by draxynnic

This thread has got me thinking about henchmen improvements as well. It'll take me a few days before I have time to actually put some together, but one thing I am thinking is that Devona & co should probably have all core skills and be the same throughout the three campaigns - if it's possible to do so while being viable.

That said, some comments on what Azazel's done:

Prophecies:
Orion/Cynn: I'd probably do something completely different with these two than you've done in the first place, but the reason I generally don't use Prophecies eles (and Cynn in other campaigns) is because I don't trust them to use Mind Burn efficiently without getting mega-exhausted. (That said, I haven't tried giving similar bars to a hero, and one can't track henchmen energy to see just how bad they're doing...) I'd be inclined to give them Elemental Attunement instead. I'd also be inclined to strip out either Meteor Shower or Firestorm (Prophecies-build henchmen are criticised enough for post-battle fireworks as it is) and Immolate for Fireball and a ressig.

I was about to comment on Stefan and Battle Rage until I thought to see if the latter had been updated.

Factions:
Talon and Eli are available simultaneously in Luxon areas, so some differences would be worthwhile.

BHA is Daeman's thing, but I'd be inclined to give it to Zho as well (provides some continuity with Zho's EOTN build). If Aidan and Aurora used Barrage, this would give most outposts on the Canthan mainland a choice between a barrage ranger or a BHA ranger. This would probably make most players happy.

Even if it's just the humble Meteor, Argo should never be without the ability to cause flaming rocks to fall from the sky. Also, I have a pathological dislike of the idea of trusting AI elementalists with PBAOE.

Not only are Headmaster Vhang and Kai Ying usually in the same districts (in fact, I don't think Vhang ever appears without Kai Ying also being present, although I may be wrong), but Kai Ying is currently one of the better Factions henchmen... at least IMO. I'd be inclined to simply give Kai Ying an improved version of his current build.

Assassins/Ritualists: Some areas have two of each. It would be nice if they weren't copies of each other, especially since the current Ritualist hench build isn't really compatible with being doubled.

Mesmers: Erys Vasburg once had almost cult status of being a godly interruptor. His build is good (enough) and has eight skills already. Leave it alone...

To be honest, the Illusion henchmen aren't bad either.

Again, Brutus and Eve usually share outposts (wherever you find Brutus you'll find Eve) so some build distinction between them might be good.

Nightfall:
I actually kinda like Sogolon with his current build, although it can certainly stand some improvement. That's not to say that yours is bad, but... *shrug*

Odurra comes pretty close to being a worthy henchman even without an elite. AOE interrupts are good to have on your side. I'd be inclined to give her the new VoR or Tease as an elite, find an appropriate final skill to add in, and call her done. (Also, Signet of Clumsiness with no Illusion investment? Tsk.

)

Gehraz is in a similar boat, though not so much as Odurra - he doesn't have a cookie-cutter build, but it seems to work well enough. I'd probably be inclined to just add Reaper's to it and call it a day.

ty for the insight i figured there was some overlap in the factions areas so i'll change up their stuff a bit. and btw all the bars i have posted have been tested by me with my heros. so yea the ai does kno how to use them and the ai knos how to cancel stance frenzy with rush. there u go.

Konig Des Todes · Sep 19, 2008, 03:57 AM // 03:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by draxynnic

Prophecies:
Orion/Cynn: I'd probably do something completely different with these two than you've done in the first place, but the reason I generally don't use Prophecies eles (and Cynn in other campaigns) is because I don't trust them to use Mind Burn efficiently without getting mega-exhausted. (That said, I haven't tried giving similar bars to a hero, and one can't track henchmen energy to see just how bad they're doing...) I'd be inclined to give them Elemental Attunement instead. I'd also be inclined to strip out either Meteor Shower or Firestorm (Prophecies-build henchmen are criticised enough for post-battle fireworks as it is) and Immolate for Fireball and a ressig.

I just put the build I usually use on sousuke up, removed Factions and NF skills, and replaces them with Immolate and Glyph of Lesser Energy. Sousuke never seemed to have energy problems before, though, henchmen can be dumber then sousuke, so I wouldn't object to removing Mind Blast.

Quote:

Originally Posted by draxynnic

Factions:
-snip "need different builds"-

Understand this, I was just doing that as simplicity and as a base to work off of. Also, some henchmen already have the same build (2 BHA arrows in all luxon outposts for instance). Sure, you can split any doubles for the Kurzick Luxon areas. I'm not opposed for others to make more build ideas, like I said, those are just ideas for starting off builds. But I was just going for speed and simplicity of builds at the time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by draxynnic

Nightfall:
I actually kinda like Sogolon with his current build, although it can certainly stand some improvement. That's not to say that yours is bad, but... *shrug*

Odurra comes pretty close to being a worthy henchman even without an elite. AOE interrupts are good to have on your side. I'd be inclined to give her the new VoR or Tease as an elite, find an appropriate final skill to add in, and call her done. (Also, Signet of Clumsiness with no Illusion investment? Tsk.

)

Gehraz is in a similar boat, though not so much as Odurra - he doesn't have a cookie-cutter build, but it seems to work well enough. I'd probably be inclined to just add Reaper's to it and call it a day.

for Sogolon, I just gave him my Morgahn's build, which i take everywhere with a fire ele, and it reduces damage big time. For Odurra, the Signet of Clumsiness was an oversight x.x I put the skill organization to by campaign and forgot that I loaded a domination build >.>

I'll work on the builds some more tomorrow.

@ House:
Keep in mind, henchmen are dumber then heroes. You can copy a henchmen's build (don't know why you would) onto a hero, and the hero will do better. So you cannot trust henchmen with complicated stuff like canceling out frenzy.

And even if the henchmen can cancel out Frenzy, I don't see much point in canceling out Frenzy when you can just put Flail or another IAS. It will save a skill spot.

House Silvermoon · Sep 19, 2008, 04:05 AM // 04:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Azazel The Assassin

@ House:
Keep in mind, henchmen are dumber then heroes. You can copy a henchmen's build (don't know why you would) onto a hero, and the hero will do better. So you cannot trust henchmen with complicated stuff like canceling out frenzy.

And even if the henchmen can cancel out Frenzy, I don't see much point in canceling out Frenzy when you can just put Flail or another IAS. It will save a skill spot.

the henchmen are smarter then u give them credit for. for example, if u give a hero None Shall Pass! the hero wont use it at all unless u micro it. but devona in eotn uses it perfectly. the henchmen and heros have similar ai but with one exception. henchmen's bars never change so they get much simpler parameters. so whos to say we cant condition them to use the new bars. they can certainly use the ones they got now fine so i think with a bit of tweaking they could use the new ones just as well as a human.

oh and u only cancel frenzy when u start getting owned. otherwise frenzy away more damage to go around. flail i dislike because the heros do not cancel stance flail at all and as soon as they use flail the monster runs away and u got a crippled hero till flail is done. flail can not be used at will because u need to charge it, frenzy is always ready for use. so frenzy > flail.

Konig Des Todes · Sep 19, 2008, 04:17 AM // 04:17

Flail was just an example -.- There are many many more IAS skills to be used, if you even need to add one (which you don't).

I still go against the idea of giving a henchmen frenzy, because enemies always maintain it (which makes those enemies too easy), and I don't want to put Frenzy on EVERY henchmen like you do. One or two warriors is fine. But not EVERY warrior henchmen.

draxynnic · Sep 19, 2008, 05:35 AM // 05:35

Admittedly, the monsters aren't equipped with cancel stances. Still...

Even if the henchmen do use cancel stances effectively, they still can't anticipate as well as a human. In an area where the mobs are throwing hefty spikes, getting caught with Frenzy up may (probably will) mean you quickly end up with a dead henchman. With a hero, you can mitigate this by disabling Frenzy where you consider this to be a risk - with a henchman, however, you're stuck. Generally, the objective I'd be looking at for henchman is something that isn't necessarily optimal, but which will work reasonably well pretty much pretty much wherever you take them and whatever other heroes you take.

Azazel: Ah, yes, for some reason I thought Zho went to Echovald rather than the Jade Sea.

Incidentally, I decided to have a go at remaking the 'core' henchmen, Devona, Cynn, Aidan and Eve (I don't count Mhenlo because he isn't a henchman in Factions, and because he's significantly different in Nightfall compared to Prophecies.)

Devona:
[Backbreaker][Counter Blow][Irresistible Blow][Mighty Blow][Healing Signet]["Watch Yourself"]["For Great Justice!"][Resurrection Signet]

This is basically classic Devona with "Charge!" replaced by her EOTN elite (which happens to be Core, and thus a legitimate choice), and a couple of shouts thrown in - Watch Yourself for its defensive properties, and For Great Justice to allow her to use her adrenal skills more often.

Cynn:
[Elemental Attunement][Aura of Restoration][Fire Attunement][Fire Storm][Fireball][Immolate][Meteor][Resurrection Signet]

This version of Cynn is basically determined by what skills are Core. The dual attunement should mean that players don't need to worry about what her energy is doing, and she can happily chip away with Immolate in between area attacks.

(Alternatively, as another example of a Prophecies skill being carried through, she could keep Incendiary Bonds to add some more damage instead of the occasional knockdown)

Aidan:
[Barrage][Distracting Shot][Savage Shot][Debilitating Shot][Whirling Defense][Troll Unguent][Antidote Signet][Resurrection Signet]

Basically, this is EOTN Aidan with Volley and Dual Shot replaced by Distracting Shot and Savage Shot (because Rangers should have interrupts, because Volley is an EOTN-only skill, and because, frankly, Dual Shot isn't really a good skill unless you're adding extra damage to it from somewhere). This makes him much like your typical Barrage ranger: AOE support with some caster hate on the side (or maybe the other way around, if you prefer).

Eve:
[Blood Ritual][Grenth's Balance][Strip Enchantment][Shadow Strike][Vampiric Gaze][Weaken Armor][Parasitic Bond][Resurrection Signet]

Eve is an interesting one. She continues to use Prophecies skills in Factions and Nightfall, and I can see why: BR is essentially a nonelite form of a Core elite I wouldn't trust to the AI (Proph necroes are criticised enough for being sac-happy as it is) and Shadow Strike probably WOULD have been Core if ANet hadn't decided to dupe it instead. So I'm going to follow ANet's precedent - trying to rebuild her solely on Core skills would have been even harder.

I was tempted to give her some minion-raising capability to match her backstory, but there are some mechanical snags here: First, minion-raising is significantly hampered by the lack of runes. Second, there may be people out here that actually like having Eve as a battery necro and for whom a change may be seen as a nerf. Third, if Eve is to be a battery, it's best that she doesn't exploit corpses just in case the person she's batterying for wants to use those corpses for something. (Again, henchmen are one-size-fits-all, not optimised for any given build).

After some browsing of the Core lists and, the precedent having been set, the Prophecies lists, I eventually decided that the best additions would be Weaken Armor and Parasitic Bond. Neither seem likely to interfere overmuch with what the rest of the party may do (people can simply remember that she has Weaken Armor and not take Cracked Armor-causing skills themselves, while Parasitic Bond will only cause problems for someone wanting to use Parasitic Bond), each is fairly cheap so as not to add to energy strain, neither make her even more suicide-happy (Bond, in fact, provides more healing to offset this) and both seem likely to be useful against most foes she might encounter (remember that Eve rarely if ever shows up outside level 20 areas). The downside, of course, is that this will require splitting her attributes three ways.

Konig Des Todes · Sep 19, 2008, 05:55 AM // 05:55

While I don't dislike your want to make those 4 henchmen core-only skill sets, they go to all campaigns, therefore would have access to those campaign's skills, but in a given order. Prophecies would not have Factions or Nightfall skills, and Factions would not have Nightfall skills. And, of course, none would have Eye of the North skills except for Eye of the North.

This fact should be used to an advantage and would allow a wider skill range for Nightfall and Factions, even Prophecies (with how you're going about it).

This meaning, each campaign would use different skills for those henchmen, but the principle should stay the same.

But that does not mean your builds are bad.

draxynnic · Sep 19, 2008, 06:36 AM // 06:36

Worked that way, I'd probably have Devona and Cynn both work towards their EOTN builds, although I'm not convinced Cynn's EOTN build really needs Glyph of Lesser Energy. Maybe I'd replace Fireball or Liquid Flame with Rodgort's Invocation to give justify the glyph and give her some more BLAM!

Aidan is, as noted in the comments, virtually already there because that's where I started - I don't think anyone really likes Aidan's Proph/Factions/Nightfall build. I still think he's better off with an interrupt instead of Dual Shot, though.

Part of what made Eve problematic was that her EOTN version is unusual in not having eight skills. Another part was that looking over the Prophecies Necro skills as well as the Core ones... didn't really help much. It also probably doesn't help that I don't really have much experience with battery necroes, so I don't know if there's anything they normally take to use when not feeding energy to everyone else.

Still, that said, the ever-popular Signet of Lost Souls will probably be jumping in as soon as it was available. For EOTN, I'd probably be inclined to switch Reaper's Mark back to Grenth's Balance or some other Blood or Soul Reaping elite - Life Transfer or Vampiric Spirit should both serve to give her plenty of regen to compensate for the sacrifice. With Foul Feast thrown in, and Vampiric Gaze replaced by Angorodon's, she can help with condition management as well as likely having plenty of energy herself.

Konig Des Todes · Sep 19, 2008, 07:25 AM // 07:25

Just a note about the builds I did, I was attempting to put some synergy between henchmen, such as one providing something that another needed (such as Devona giving kd, and one of the Factions necros having fetid ground, which poisons if kd). Some builds like that would be nice to have in some heroes, especially those that get along lore-wise (like Cynn and Mhenlo, if possible at all). I realized I didn't do a good job now, so I thought it would be good to state for future build ideas.

I think the 5 core heroes (this is, of course, including Mhenlo), would be the best ideal henchmen to design synergy builds for, as they, lore-wise, would have been with each other long enough to know and help each other better then other henchmen (such as Talon and a Luxon, who never met before).

MithranArkanere · Sep 19, 2008, 01:34 PM // 13:34

Core
- Complete all weapon sets that have weapons for at least 6 different professions weapons to have all possible weapons for all professions.

Prophecies
- Add armor sets for the professions that cannot find armor sets here.
- Add a Level 5 charmable Blaze Phoenix in the End-game area.
- Add a chain of quests than ends in being able to charm the moss spider.
- Change the Tombs into a dungeon-like elite area: Repeatable quest, end-chest, set of weapons that drops complete only here (proably the complete Ghost/Eternal/Chaos set) HoM state, etc...
- Add an end-chest and Hidden Treasures to Sorrow's Furnace. Among the drops that chest would have, all the Grenth's Footprint and Sorrow's Furnace green drops would be included.
- Make the Titan quests Harder, repeatable, for a party of 8, and as mini-missions that start from Droknar's Forge by talking to Glint, instead of having to walk there. Make also a way to get the Prestige Titan weapon set acquirable only by playing there. The titan set would be allowed to the Valor monument.
- Change one Warrior skill to non-elite and one Mesmer skill to elite. to make them match numbers. Add the remaining skills so all professions have the same number for Prophecies.

Factions
- Give Imperial, Luxon and Kurcik reward trophies as rewards there.
- Add faction rewards for completing all missions on both kurzick and luxon sides. Currently only the first one gives 500 faction, only the first time they are made, and regardless of being hard or normal mode.
- Change bounties to work like Eye of the North bounties, and separate the blessing effect (+HP, +3 regen) and the bounty. The effect would be added as a title effect that works in any Luxon/Kurzick area as long as you are aligned to them (that, is if you have more faction form that side than from the other): Luxon/Kurzick blessing. While you are alligned to the Luon/Kurzick faction, you gaing +10..25 HP and +1..3 HP regeneration while you are in Luxon/Kurzick territories. Shared territories would be considered both Luxon and Kurzick. That way people will no longer able to get both bounties and get +6 regen and 50 HP.
- Priests would give the bounties for free if you are aligned with them, and you'll have to pay 100g if not.

Urgoz Warren/The Deep
- Add a priest in each side. Since the title effect would be separated from the bounty, this won't be giving battle advantages there.
- Add one NPC to the outposts that exchange Zodiac Weapons for special reward trophies. One Zodiac, one trophy. The item would be the same for both sides.
- Add then another NPC that trades 100 of those trophies for Factions elite set weapons. Player would be able to add it to HoM.

Nightfall
- Increase the chances of getting pieces of Armor in Dajkah Inlet and the Shadow nexus, or just make Hero armor unlocking account-wide.
- Add a chain of quests that ends up in being able to charm a level 20 Golden Moa.
- Add Level 5 Ghostly phoenixes to the Throne of Wispers end-credits area.

Domain of Anguish
- Rename the Nightmare weapons to 'Plagueborn' and make them drop from Afflicted in Factions, thus completing the Plagueborn set of weapons.

Eye of the North
- Make Polymock piece unlocking completely account wide.
- Add a chain of quests that ends up in being able to charm a Level 20 black panther (lynx reskin).

Vanquishing
- Add Faction/Reputation/Promotion rewards while under the effects of a bounty.

Traders
- Weapon upgrade trader is the only one left.

Titles
- Make wisdom and treasure hunter all account wide like lucky and unlucky, since they are all related and not much people goes for them in more than one character.
- Add a way to make faster to max character-based grid titles the more characters have already maxed them in the account.

Hall of Monuments
- Rearrange statues by selecting the one that goes in each slot with a simple dialog-based menu like the hat maker's.
- Add one elite set of weapons for each campaign (that, is, add one for Prophecies and one for Factions) and allow all four sets in the Valor monument.
- Statue for completion of Tomb of the Primeval Kings and the Titan Quests.
- Make it completely account-based.

Heros and Henchmen
- Allow to 'hire' henchmen from all outposts you have been into.
- Add a way to set areas in which H&H can move (probably by clicking and dragging the mouse when setting a flag, to set a circle where they can move within)

Storage problems
1. Unlocking items that are usually acquired once and never again.
- Give PvE players an item crafting interface similar to the PvP one, but instead of a 'color' box, there would be a 'cost' indicator there.
- This would be a Xunlai service: Once paid the service, you can give Hat makers, Armor crafters and Xunlai Agents the item that can be unlocked. The item you give is destroyed, but also unlocked to create in the interface. Then players would be able to create customized copies of those items by small fees:
- Festival hats: 10 gold/piece.
- Maxed common armors (lesser armor won't work to unlock): 50gold/piece.
- Prestige pieces of armor: 200gold/piece.
- Miniatures:
-- Normal ones: 10gold.
-- Purple ones: 50 gold.
-- Gold ones. 100 gold.
-- Green ones: 250 gold.
- Everlasting tonics: 100 gold.

2. Library.
Every book that is completed would be accesible from a tab in the Quest log. Those books won't have buttons and won't start missions like the others, but players would be able to read them anytime.

House Silvermoon · Sep 19, 2008, 02:10 PM // 14:10

^at above point by point.

i dont get wut u mean for core stuff.

i like the idea of giving the new profs armor in other campaigns.
no to phoenix and spider.
i like the idea of the hidden treasures in sorrows.
no to titan change and no to elite status changes.

wut do u mean kurz lux reward trophy?
i alrdy addressed this.
no sparation of bounties but i like the idea of free bounty if ur alliagned with them.
we alrdy have factions elite weapons.

i like the idea of increase hero armor drops a lot more.
no more pets wtf??

rename tormented weapons? wtf?

i agree on polymock but no more pets plz.

for vanquish u get hunts and bounties thats enuf.

u rehashed wut i said for traders, titles, and HoM.

heros and hench is a no. they have their outposts and thats fine. we have flags alrdy too.

ur storage ideas wont work all we have to do is buy it once and all chars now have prestiage availble? thats not good and the same for minis. that would destroy the value of things. and we have a festival hat trader where have u been? if u want to read the books again go on wiki.

MithranArkanere · Sep 19, 2008, 02:53 PM // 14:53

Oh, my, it seems you are having a hard time understanding what others write and lack certain common knowledge about GW. That will be a problem to work in this thread.
Ah, and please do not talk like a pirate in Sardelac. We need things well explained here.

'Core' means 'all campaigns'. It's a widely used term you should already know.

Factions has two legendary pets that can be added to the HoM, but only Factions. All campaign must have their own two. One level 5 available in the end-credits area and one level 20 available after a chain of quests.

Both Torment and Destroyer weapons are named after the 'most powerfull' of each capaign (not counting bosses or elite area creatures). Those are: Titans, Shiro'ken, Torment creatures and Destroyers. So Prophecies elite set must be Titan and factions Shiro'ken. The only place where a Titan set could be available is the Titan quests, since outside there, Titans appear only in one mission and Nightfall. They are a good idea, but they were not perfectly implemented. We know what works, and what works is missiones like Factions or Nightall, so they must be reworked like that.
Zodiac weapons re NOT an elite set. They are just like Shadow set of weapons that drop in the Anguish. they drop mostly there, but far from 'elite'.

Bounty MUST be separated from the title effect. Lightbringer and all EotN titles have the effects separeated from the title. Sunspears lacks also a title effect. It must be added to it.
On top of that, it makes no sense that a Luxon priest would give a blessing while you are already under the blessing of the other faction. And a permanent +6 regen just for 200 gold is an undesired side advantage (unless you are the kind of person who likes cheating).
Also the bounties must be reworked. Currently you get more points by killing 24 enemies and then all bosses several times, than killing all monsters several times in the same amount of time. Clearing the area, should give more points in the same time than just killing bosses, just like in EotN (with the exception of the Norn run, since it has a lot of bosses).

This are Reward tokens:
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Reward_Token
It's a common term for trophies given by NPCs when you complete quests.
Once all quests are done, there are no other sources for them.
Challenge missions should give those too, so there's another use and an unlimite source for them.
Since Vabbi has no challenge missions, there won't be problems about people farming Vabbian reward trophies for gems.

Additionally, Prophecies has no Challenge missions. They should take the Krytan, Maguuma, Crystal Desert and Fire Island old arena outposts and turn them into challenge missions.

The Plagueborn weapon set it's related to afflicted. When they created the Scythe and the Spear, instead adding them to Factions, they added them to the Anguish. They are NOT torment weapons, they are plagueborn weapons named 'nightmare'. Look here.
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Categ...ueborn_weapons
Nightmares are black and/or translucent creatures, but those 'nightmare' Spear and Scythe are not nightmare-ish at all, they are afflicted-like.
They are clearly the same set, but they separated them, since they always forfeited retroactive changes. That's a mistake. Scythes and spear should rop in Factions, and Scythes, spear, daggers and ritualist weapons in Prophecies. Retroactive changes MUST be done.

My storage ideas won't harm anything, value of things would actually INCREASE. Why? A LOT more people would get armors, since they would have where to store them, a lot of peple would go to get all armors, and the value of materials would increase. Also, people would change a lot more their armors, adding more lively change to the game.

The ONLY way to fix storage is to remove the need for storage. Most people will acquire those items ONCE, and never acquire them again. No one will buy 3 miniatures to own them, they will buy one to own and sell the rest they get their hand into. This way, after you get a miniature, you can either sell it to others or keep it forever for your account.
Not much people buys more than one item of the same kind when it's expensive and hard to get. Even less if it can be used by all characters.
Same goes for armor. No one makes 5 Obsidian sets, they make one and store it.
So, instead of paying for it and then having to stick with it in the storage, you pay once, and they you can discard it if you want, knowing that you'll have to pay much less to have it again.
And I perfectly know we have the festival hat maker, and it works PERFECTLY, that's why his system MUST be used for more items like the festival hats: Items you get just once, and don't need to gain again later. If it's good, and it works, the logical step is using the idea for more stuff.

Also, more runes would be bought and sold, since for some of them is cheaper to buy them again than using a perfect salvage kit.

Once people have more empty storage, they will buy more tuff from others.
Currently we have:
- I have no more room, I'm not getting more armor because I'll have to destroy the old armors I spend so many time to get.
- I have no more room, I'm not getting more miniatures, I have enough.
- I have the Everlasting tonic I wanted, I won't get more, since I don't have room for all 12.
- Etc, etc, etc...

After an unlock system, it would be:
- I'll get all armors with my main character, can you sell me some steel and diamonds?
- I'm getting all Birthday miniatures for my account, do you have the Jungle Troll?
- I'm getting all 12 Everlasting tonics, are you selling one?
- Etc, etc.

And remember that armor storage would be CHARACTER BASED. Make another character of the same profession, and you have to unlock them all again, like skills. Only miniatures, hats and everlasting tonics would be account wide, since they are already can used by all characters by putting them in the Xunlai Storage and using the Hat maker.

House Silvermoon · Sep 19, 2008, 03:24 PM // 15:24

u misconstrued wut i said. but im not goin to argue here. we dont need extra legendary pets, nightmare scythe and spear are fine the way they are now. we dont need more challenge missions cause no one does them now anyway. just because there were tormented weapons and destroyer weapons doesnt mean we need to add more elite weapons. its just redundant.

idk how we can make sunspear title effective without giving it some broken ability. kurz and luxon title dont need an effect the bounty as it is now is good enuf. bout stacking the bounties, if ur willing to pay that extra money for a small buff w/e most of the hard mode monsters have like +6 regen naturally anyway.

dont tell me i dont have common knowledge of gw. u said lets farm zodiacs for tokens and then get some elite weapon which is like the new gimmick everyone has to buy to look leet. a lot of ur changes are just adding unnecessary crap adding grind.

i dont think pve characters need some kind of storage interface. we have a hat guy, if we added a mini trading guy we can dupe minis as much as we wanted and they would be worthless. yes dupe that panda and sell it to the public, minis would be worth nothing. armor maybe there is a way to store it but not the way u suggested.

oh fyi post something useful plz.

Sir Pandra Pierva · Sep 19, 2008, 03:40 PM // 15:40

i know this was probolly said and beaten to death but

Fix the insribable drop problems.

Mainly putting them in proph and factions.

MithranArkanere · Sep 19, 2008, 03:54 PM // 15:54

It's about equilibrium, equitability and retroactivity. If something new is added to the system, and added to all new contentn form then onwards, and it works, and it's good, old campaigns should have it too.

Hey, Prophecies now have Heroe(s), End credits, end-game greens, end-game weapon set, gives statues...

Now that I remember, the Factions, Nightfall and EotN end-weapons sets should be craftable in their credits area, like the Prophecies end-game set.
That's an example of a new way to do things that's is better and should be applied everywhere.

I used the PvP interface as a possible example. The PvP item creation interface is quite cool, but it could be anything:
- An NPC for hats, another for tonics, another for miniatures, etc... Mahk in Kamadan could be the [toy maker] of that town.
- Each crafter could be the NPC for their armor, so you pay them a big amount and materials once, but you must get to them again if you want to make armors again (just paying much less). Talk to Oruku, pay for a complete set (5k + materials), and then you can get it later anytime for much less (250gold no materials). It fits much more the 'pay once' philosophy of Guild Wars. Although that would mean that you'll have to finish Factions and Nightfall again to get the sets in their end-credits areas.

More important than the final way to implement it, is doing it.
My main point is "Unlocking instead storage for stuff people need to get only once".
If you are going to get it once anyways, it won't harm to make it unlockable instead of stored.
That goes for skills, festival hats, armors, miniatures, polymock pieces and everlasting tonics. (Some of them are already unlockable)

Can you dupe festival hats with the hat maker? Of course no. You make customized copies only you can use. There is no duping in that. I remind you I said CUSTOMIZED. That is:
- Get a Devourer miniature.
- Give to the Toy maker NPC.
- You lose the miniature forever.
- You can now make a CUSTOMIZED COPY of the miniature with any character.
- You earn another Devourer in a birthday, since you already have the Devourer unlocked, instead of using it with another character, you sell it, so others can enjoy it.
- Customized miniatures:
* Can't be stored in the Xunlai Chest (And there's is no need, since other characters can get copes for themselves)
* Can't be dropped.
* Can't be traded.
* So, other accounts can't use your account-wide miniatures.
So, basically, the copies of items that were unlocked will be only for the account (character in case of armors).

Oh, I forgot about inscriptions. Thank you.
For that matter two things are needed:
- Make all campaigns drop inscribable items in the same way. Being it all drops, only in hard mode, only from bosses, only from end-chests or whatever the way, the way should be THE SAME worldwide. The best option would be just make all items drops like Nightfall and EotN, since inscriptions have been already proved to be more versatile.
- Hide the requirement and damage (and even the skin and name, replacing them for a generic one: "Sword", "Hammer", "Staff") of unidentified weapons. Before the inscriptions, there were some risks on selling unidentified items. You could be selling either a 15^50% or a puny +10%^Hexed. With inscriptions there are no such risks.
If that is done, when selling an unidentified "Sword" you could be selling either a {11-22 req7 Jitte} or a {7-14 req 13 Long sword} you'll think twice before selling unidentified items and you won't leave around so many items, since they could have something neat inside.
That way you'll bring back the risk lost when selling unidentified items.

House Silvermoon · Sep 19, 2008, 05:51 PM // 17:51

ok guys i have made a lot of changes so plz read these new changes before posting new ideas or possible changes. and read everything because some people were saying should do this this and that when i alrdy mentioned it. i might be making a new thread just for the hero and hench stuff alone cause that is a big problem but i'll make a link between the two cause the heros and henchs are vital to happy pveing.

Konig Des Todes · Sep 19, 2008, 06:44 PM // 18:44

House, I must say, that MithranArkanere is right in the long run with his reasonings for his suggestions.

And I don't know why you hate the idea of new pets. Do you want everyone running around with a Rainbow Phoenix or Black Widow? Adding more "elite" pets would give more customization. Something that is not needed, but wanted, and it would increase more content to people, albeit on a small scale, and in no way will it increase grind (unless you think doing quests is grind, and if that is so, to you, everything sounds like grinding I suppose).

Nothing that MithranArkanere said increases grinding, except for the reward tokens, but that would only be for those who want to grind those for whatever they give. Something that would be pointless. And those that want to grind those, currently just do every single quest that gives them, makes a new character, does those quests again, etc. etc.

Only thing I disagree with MithranArkanere on, is the "hire" henchmen in any outpost you've been to. Doing that would go against lore, by bringing henchmen in earlier then they should.

Other then that, there is nothing bad in what he said. And all of that would benefit GW (even the re-making of the armor sets, that is, if it is character based *while the minis should be account*, then it would, as he said, increase prices because more people would go for buying everything they can).

Skyy High · Sep 19, 2008, 11:33 PM // 23:33

Considering it's just a compilation of old suggestions (henchman upgrades, improved rewards for challenge missions, added armor for non-Factions and NF classes in those chapters, etc), the thread title and OP are incredibly pretentious.

Konig Des Todes · Sep 19, 2008, 11:58 PM // 23:58

Seeing how often these things are asked for, I think that is proof enough that ANet should work on improving them. At least say they will get to it (for one of their huge monthly updates).

MithranArkanere · Sep 20, 2008, 02:40 PM // 14:40

They know most of those things, but many would take a time and they don't have or knowledge the ones left to deal with GW lack.

House Silvermoon · Sep 21, 2008, 05:12 AM // 05:12

ok guys plz look over the changes i made. i also tried to make the layout more friendly on the eyes. it was too much clutter before. hero section to come soon, if there is anything bout the heros or any other part of the list u want to discuss post away.