Curse

gameshoes3003 · Oct 02, 2008, 11:34 PM // 23:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Numa Pompilius

You're seriously arguing for the return of shadow-step instagibbing?

You first need a shock rifle for instagibbing! w00t!
But yeah, I did not appreciate the shadow step madness that raped people especially with spells like shockwave and what not.
But Horns of an Ox could use a little bit more damage though sometimes depending on the build the condition can be easier to achieve than Trampling Ox's.
As for defense, I think Critical Defense works fine. It sure annoys the hell out of me when an assassin runs up to me with it.

Deadshot Seven · Oct 02, 2008, 11:45 PM // 23:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master Ketsu

Shadow steps don't need to die, they just need to be made less degenerate by placing conditional restrictions on them.

-Shadow steps that return you to your original location ( AoD, shadow walk, meld ) Should fail on the return trip if sins are not in casting range of where they first teleported from.

-Line of F***ing sight. Seriously. Assassins shadowstepping through walls and bridges is nonsense and bad for the game.

-No more of this "push button, teleport, 12345" nonsense. Add conditions. Like "if target foe is using a skill, you shadow step to their location." or "if foe is below 50% health".

I can agree with the last part of what your saying. It'd be more balanced if there wasn't an aftercast and rather you have to have some sort of condition to be able to shadow step.
Maybe the condition could even be a condition, such as "Shadow Step to target foe. Fails if target foe is not poisoned" or under a hex and the like.
However, assassins shouldn't need a line of site to shadow step. Being able to come down from a building (Ancestral Lands) to start attacking someone or through a door of some sort (again, Ancestral Lands) is one of the fun parts of being an assassin.
Although as someone with 900 hours on an assassin I don't really mind the aftercast.

Though I do mind the QQ'rs who want an entire profession removed...

NeroX · Oct 03, 2008, 01:13 AM // 01:13

ive read all comments thus far and have gotten the impression that numerous people believe shadow stepping makes the game unbalanced??? and ruins the positioning aspect of the game???

well for a start, i don't believe it has. Only because in online games, theres always gonna be new content (such as adding an assassin which many complain about). and when new content is added OF COURSE the game is going to change. Learn to adapt to these changes that the game provides. Those who lack that ability ... well .... theres always gonna be those that complain about assassin being too overpowered because of their ability to reach places quicker than others. Well... i dont see many people out there using assassins. Seriously!
as its been mentioned before, BECOME AWARE OF UR SURROUNDINGS before entering the battle. This gives the whole team time to think of how they should react against them. All about adapting...

And for those who think .75 secs aftercast isn't a lot and doesnt really effect anything, ummm .... why was it added then???
(my answer: to ruin one of the main things that is key to assassin)

Prokiller88 · Oct 03, 2008, 02:09 AM // 02:09

Skill damage on horns needs to be +5..20..25 imo. The .75 aftercast is fine, at first I didn't like it because it is somewhat restricting, especially on AoD. Main problem is the combo chain style really, if you blocked, blinded, you are screwed for however long it takes you first attack to recharge since sins have no pressure what so ever.

zelgadissan · Oct 03, 2008, 02:21 AM // 02:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeroX

...numerous people believe shadow stepping makes the game unbalanced??? and ruins the positioning aspect of the game???

well for a start, i don't believe it has.

There was no need to read past that (I did anyway), and it also completely verifies Snow's post.

Keekles already explained everything I could say in his post.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keekles

The entire concept of ignoring the positioning aspect of game play was flawed to begin with. The way Guild Wars PvP is structured, positioning plays a rather large role, and allowing one class (or anyone who takes it as a secondary) to completely ignore an aspect of it is bad.

Konig Des Todes · Oct 03, 2008, 02:26 AM // 02:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master Ketsu

what difference does it make for secondaries if a primary skill is % chance to fail at 1 or 16 ? They still cant use it.

Well the point is the % chance. Secondaries can still use it, but there is a chance of it to fail. And you just criticized your own suggestion you know. I said to keep it in Shadow Arts/Deadly Arts. You said to move it to Critical Strikes with the % chance of failure.

Quote:

Originally Posted by zelgadissan

There was no need to read past that (I did anyway), and it also completely verifies Snow's post.

Keekles already explained everything I could say in his post.

Meh, I didn't bother reading past that. But Keekles is right, and that is why Shadow Stepping makes PvP unbalanced. PvE, not so much (but that's because it's not very needed and the AI will target the shadow steppers faster).

NeroX · Oct 03, 2008, 02:38 AM // 02:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by zelgadissan

There was no need to read past that (I did anyway), and it also completely verifies Snow's post.

Keekles already explained everything I could say in his post.

i dont think it has made anything unbalanced/unfair (maybe i didnt explain my self clearly) ... because no one uses assassin anyway (i would like to but no one lets me) in battles like gvg. So why r people complaining about me wanting the aftercast to change. For the very few assassins that ARE played in gvg ... leave them be with no aftercast.

or maybe its because everyone has a different concept of "what the ideal style of gameplay is/should be"

Trylo · Oct 03, 2008, 03:02 AM // 03:02

i dont think i would mind bringing shadow stepping back if they did something like... not allowing IAS to affect daggers. then they could put all shadow steps in crit strikes.

then i might be ok with shadow steps.

otherwise; no.

NeroX · Oct 03, 2008, 03:04 AM // 03:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trylo

i dont think i would mind bringing shadow stepping back if they did something like... not allowing IAS to affect daggers. then they could put all shadow steps in crit strikes.

then i might be ok with shadow steps.

otherwise; no.

yeh im down with putting all shadow steps to crit strikes.
btw whats IAS?

Trylo · Oct 03, 2008, 03:14 AM // 03:14

increased attack speed [flail][way of the assassin] etc.

Charlotte the Harlot · Oct 03, 2008, 03:54 AM // 03:54

Assassins need to be fixed considering they are next to useless for any legitimate play but buffing all their previous problems isn't the answer... although I'm not sure theres a good way to balance them with out them being gimmicky and/or OP while still retaining their original purpose.

FelixCarter · Oct 03, 2008, 03:56 AM // 03:56

I play a SinX and I still think she's a tad powerful...

I won't say the balancing for Guild Wars is horrible, because it takes quite a bit of time to "balance" a game... No matter what, you'll have people who don't agree that what you've done is "balanced". If someone seriously thinks they could balance the game better than Izzy, then they would have posted their ideas already. But then someone else would think they have a better concept of balance than the aforementioned individual...

I don't know very many MMORPGs that the majority of players will respond to with, "This game is very balanced," because it's very difficult to do so.

If your class has been "nerfed", then try a different strategy, build, equipment setup, or a combination of all three. I know it sounds like another "stfu and learn2play" speech, but with enough effort, you might just find a way to make yourself into a force to be reckoned with.

...

Unless you're a Paragon. Then you should be asking Izzy everyday why he hates you so much.

The Iron Saint · Oct 03, 2008, 04:27 AM // 04:27

Limit shadowstep skills to characters with assassin primaries only, or some kind of penalty like

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master Ketsu

Moving AoD, Meld, Shadow walk, and deaths charge to CS with 75% chance failure with 2 or less would also be good.

This has always been the most logical choice for me. I was disappointed when I learned shortly after Factions release that such a profession defining aspect as shadowstepping was not limited to primary assassins. And it's quite aesthetically awkward when a huge bulky warr teleports all over the map.

I mean, necros have corpse telports, eles have stuff like ride the lightning, but most of them are conditional... Something as powerful as shadowstepping with teleporting as a primary effect should have been kept to assassins only. A lot changed in PvP when suddenly your bodyblocking and positioning tactics became moot.

You wouldn't even have to move shadowstep skills to critical strikes. Just add a condition of failure like: has a 50% chance of failure if caster is not a primary assassin.

Knowing Anet and the state of the game however, I don't count on this change being implemented. And yes I know shadowstepping wasn't responsible for breaking the game singlehandedly, but every little change back to when it was 'balanced' helps =]

xDusT II · Oct 03, 2008, 04:46 AM // 04:46

Isn't it funny how 98% of people who get an opinion don't have a clue?

Good updates are few and far between, opting to revert a significant one like this is ridiculous.

Selene's posts compares apples to oranges. Sins undermine so many essential balance mechanics that they are better left out of the game.

Demonstar · Oct 03, 2008, 05:06 AM // 05:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eragon Selene

Delete monks: they heal people so I cant kill them

Delete Eles: They cause AoE and whipe my party

Delete Warriors: They have to much armor and health

Delete Rits: Spirits kill the game

Delete Necros: Invincy MM's ruin AB

Delete Mesmers: Hexs and interupts are lame

Delete Rangers: Touchers are so noobish

Delete Dervs: Just because

Lets all play Paragons!!!!!

I can't begin to describe how much this post entertains me.

Bravo, good sir.

JupiterStarWarrior · Oct 03, 2008, 05:22 AM // 05:22

I didn't read the original post because, quite frankly, I got a headache from reading the very poor spelling (or speed, or whatever), and the random bold text in-line, even if they were for pointing out key words and/or phrases, but I did get the gist of it (that may have been a run-on, but oh well).

My advise? DON'T REMOVE THE AFTER-CAST DELAY!!! Shadowstepping, especially in PvP (Okay, so I OCCASIONALLY do Alliance Battles).

Please resubmit your proposal without the bold text and with PROPER ENGLISH SPELLING AND GRAMMAR!!!!!

NeroX · Oct 03, 2008, 05:54 AM // 05:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by JupiterStarWarrior

I didn't read the original post because, quite frankly, I got a headache from reading the very poor spelling (or speed, or whatever), and the random bold text in-line, even if they were for pointing out key words and/or phrases, but I did get the gist of it (that may have been a run-on, but oh well).

My advise? DON'T REMOVE THE AFTER-CAST DELAY!!! Shadowstepping, especially in PvP (Okay, so I OCCASIONALLY do Alliance Battles).

Please resubmit your proposal without the bold text and with PROPER ENGLISH SPELLING AND GRAMMAR!!!!!

sorry about all the spelling and grammatical mistakes. I'm sorry I'm not perfect but maybe people should be a bit more empathetic and understanding in general.

and if you read my justification in regards to this argument, maybe you would understand?

and btw, Eragon Selene has a fantastic post, point comes across quickly and clearly.

Vallisahllirium · Oct 03, 2008, 06:57 AM // 06:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeroX

and btw, Eragon Selene has a fantastic post, point comes across quickly and clearly.

true

...Idea of 50% failure for the other classes or something like that is more or less good. Atm sins are crippled and anet should do something about it, you all said that there is not too much sins in GvG, so puting shadowsteping back only for sin primary prof or with failure chance for sins as sec prof shouldn`t be so bad.

As for you Jupiter...I apologize that we are not all from AMERICA
and that we have some grammar mistakes...please forgive us...shame on us

Destro Maniak · Oct 03, 2008, 07:12 AM // 07:12

Assassins shouldnt use shadow step ITS USELESS
Im a sin for more than y3ear I gave 1200 hours to it

And what I observed, any kind of shadow step is useless
Not only because the after cast delay that is foolis
THE RECHARGE IS SOOOO LONG

But I am aware that shadow steps arent that good even if the delay is reduced

(btw, you complained about whirled defence of rangers, allways use golden fox strike+wild strike, you kill everyone *I use golden fox+wild strike+shattering strike to unleash hell

)

ShaneOfMach · Oct 03, 2008, 07:26 AM // 07:26

use aura of displacement on one enemy and then Death's Charge on another, just to RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO with them.

It's really fun.