Curse

Galatea · Jun 09, 2005, 10:44 PM // 22:44

Many of us know that the current trading system we have in-game has lots of room for improvement. The auction house is a suggestion that has been covered quite a bit (see for yourself). Some simply suggest a need for it, others go into more depth.

First off, I want to thank ArenaNet for taking the time to read through Fansite Forums and taking our suggestions to heart. The addition of the Rune Traders in the most recent patch definitely shows that you guys listen to us. I hope that the current trader system is only a temporary fix, and that an Auction House will be implemented in the future. Right now, it is extremely difficult to trade/sell efficiently. Let's face it: the major trade spot of the game is Lion's Arch, District 1. District 2 and District 3 are often filled with trade spam as well, especially when District 1 is so full no one can enter. Ascalon City appears to be a big trade city as well, although if you really want something, someone in Lion's Arch almost definitely will have it.

However, even so, it is so difficult to find what you are looking for. Your "WTB" or "WTS" messages get lost between the 99347823748732 million other WTS/WTB messages being spammed over and over. Even harder to do is to guess the current going price. Upon asking, "How much does xxxx go for?", I can receive anything from no answers at all, or people trying to sell to me at obviously outrageous prices. There are also people who are willing to pay 500 gold for a rune, while others will tell you, "No way, that goes for no more than 100 gold." Also, the current system requires players to stay online for n amount of time in order to sell or buy, whether sucessful or not.

So without further ado, here is my detailed proposal for a trade system involving an auction house, with eye candy included:

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THE MAIN TRADE SOURCE: The Auction House

The Auction House should consist of anywhere between 3 and 5 NPCs, who will stand in/at an allocated Auction House building. There should be five Auction House buildings, each one located in the main cities (gold dots on the map): Ascalon, Lion's Arch, Henge of Denravi, Amnoon Oasis, and Droknar's Forge.

Auction Houses aren't really required in the mission cities or in the small towns, but that's really up to the devs/community if it deems necessary.

Districts should not affect the stock or prices of these auction houses. Players should only be able to sell n amount of items at a time, and each item should only stay on auction for a certain duration of time (if at the end of this time, the item is not sold, then the player can re-auction it, or take it back). Players do not need to be online to keep their items in the auction house. There is anonymity in that buyers do not know who the seller is.

Now, there are two options, each with their own pros/cons (which others are free to address, if not yet already mentioned):
a) One Single Institution
Under this option, the stock of the five auction houses is shared. This means that a player in Ascalon City can bid on the same items available to a player in Amnoon Oasis. This also means that if I place an item on sale in Lion's Arch, then anyone can buy it from any of the other auction houses.

Some pros:
- items are available across Tyria
- prices remain stable across Tyria
Some cons:
- overstock of items
- demand might not meet supply

b) Individual Institutions
Under this second option, each auction house will stand as its own. This means items on sale in Lion's Arch are only available in Lion's Arch.

Some pros:
- incentives to visit all of the five major cities
- items generally won't be overstocked
Some cons:
- players may decide to sell items like superior runes only in droknar's forge auction houses, making it nearly impossible to attain one until after ascension
- player may need 200 of a crafting material and might have to travel to 2+ auction houses to meet his demand

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The Structure of the Auction House

Two tabs - one for buying, one for selling.

Selling
Under the selling tab, player will select an item from their inventory and enter in a price. They can check the current prices by going into the BUY tab and selecting am "Auction Log" button for a certain item, which can show the past 10 winning bids on the item. Let's say a player wants to sell a Minor Rune of Vigor, and he sees that the past 10 winning bids were 250 gold. The player then will have an idea of how much to place theirs for sale.

Player A places his rune on sale for 250 gold.
If Player B places the same rune on sale for 200 gold, then player B's rune will sell more quickly, because his had a lower reserve price.
Player C decides to be greedy and places his on sale for 500 gold. His most likely will never sell, or will sell once the supply runs out and demand is still high.

Certain items should be stackable and stacks should be listed separately for bidding. Currently, we have stacks of 10, but perhaps introduce stacks of 50 for those that need a lot to craft armor.
Example:
- Bolt of Silk
- 10 Bolts of Silk
- 50 Bolts of Silk

Generally, buying in bulk will cost less than buying a single silk.

After an item is sold..
Since we currently don't have a delivery system, the seller can go to the Auctioneer to pick up his earnings.

Buying
Here's some eye-candy:

*I noticed I made a typo, and also forgot to include an "Auction Log" button as I mention below, but.. pretend those little mistakes aren't there, because I don't feel like making a new image. 0_x

Under the buying tab, players should have the ability to toggle on/off various categories (Weapons, Dyes, Runes, Salvage Items, Unidentified Items, Miscellaneous, etc...).

Listed underneath these categories should be the items, which players can choose to be organized in any fashion - by class, alphabetically, by rarity, etc..

The number in stock should show up next to the the item's name.

Player will select the item he/she wants. I forgot to include this in my image (^_^), but there should also be a button that says "Auction Log", so that players can see the 10 past winning bids on the item, and have an idea of what the going price is.

If player decides to purchase the item, he will then enter in the amount he'd like to purchase, and then select a BID button. Player will then enter in an amount he wants to bid. If he bids too low, he can continue increasing the amount of gold until he wins the item.

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THE TRADERS:
I don't feel that traders need to be removed. I feel that certain items, such as dye and runes, should still be available for purchase from a trader/merchant NPC, as well as drops from monsters. However, I feel that the Auction House will help regulate prices, allowing buyers the option to see what others buy/sell for, and avoid new players from getting scammed.

Prices will always continue to fluctuate. On one day, black dye might cost 5 platinum at the trader, and only 3K in the auction house. However, the trader might be buying them for 4K. The next day, it might be cheaper to just buy/sell at the Auction House, without the trader's assistance.

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Meh, there is of course, lots of room for development with this idea. I'd like to see what others think, and see what suggestions they too, have to offer. I have already written this out once, but somehow lost everything I wrote, so what you have just read is a re-written version, with some details missing because they've slipped my mind. ;_;

It'd be nice too, if we could have one official Auction House/Trade Center thread, so that the devs won't have to jump from thread to thread to see all the suggestions being made.

(Closed to prevent random thread resurrection. Please PM a mod if you wish to open this thread.)

johnnylange · Jun 09, 2005, 11:43 PM // 23:43

are you going to apply for a job at Guild Wars?

battlehammer · Jun 09, 2005, 11:43 PM // 23:43

very nice. I like how you think.

kidxsoup · Jun 09, 2005, 11:45 PM // 23:45

good job. auction house please! oh and yeah it would be nice if people talking about auction houses would just post under this one. maybe anet would notice how badly we want one.

eA-Zaku · Jun 09, 2005, 11:48 PM // 23:48

While I don't see the NECESSITY for an auction house, I agree it would be a bit more orderly and convenient, even if it were a pain to implement.

Also, you put up a hell of an argument.

Tsukiyomi · Jun 09, 2005, 11:49 PM // 23:49

Wow, that's very detailed indeed, and I love the idea! I hope anet will do something like this in GW in the near future.

Nokomis · Jun 10, 2005, 12:08 AM // 00:08

Here here. Less stupid WTS/WTB chat spam. Less time spent looking for an item you want. Less noobs being ripped off. Most excellent idea.

--Nokomis

Valerius · Jun 10, 2005, 12:14 AM // 00:14

/signed

johnnylange · Jun 10, 2005, 02:17 AM // 02:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by kidxsoup

good job. auction house please! oh and yeah it would be nice if people talking about auction houses would just post under this one. maybe anet would notice how badly we want one.

I think they do know how badly everyone wants one, the only thing is I guess it's something that more complex to implement, I read from an interview that they probley will put one in, but didn't give an actual time frame...maybe they want to surprise us or something...?

deathwearer · Jun 10, 2005, 02:24 AM // 02:24

Yup, thats awesome, i like idea A better.

Galatea · Jun 10, 2005, 02:30 AM // 02:30

Thanks everyone - I'm glad everyone is responding well to my suggestion. ^_^ I put a lot of thought into this one.

An Auction House would definitely make trading much more organized and easier for everyone, and it would eliminate unnecessary hours spent spamming WTS/WTB and trying to find that one item that you so desperately need.

I read on one of the Fansite Fridays a hint towards an Auction House, but I'm not sure if they will actually go through with it, what kind of system it will be, and when it will be implemented. They said they are still working on Observer Mode, but I really do hope that an Auction House will be the next big update on their agenda.

Everyone, please feel free and continue to make additional suggestions in this thread or critique the suggestion I have made in my original post. I left a lot of room still for it to be developed more thoroughly, and hopefully we can mold it into an Auction House that everyone, or at least the majority of the players, will be satisfied with, and one that the Game Devs will be able to accomplish.

Ba Ne · Jun 10, 2005, 03:06 AM // 03:06

Well done and a good idea.

The first thing that came to my mind was this: make it function closer to eBay.

When putting an item up for auction you select the amount of time you want to leave the auction open from several predetermined selections. Then you can set a reserve price if you wish or choose to have no reserve. The buyer's can see the item, the current high bid, whether or not the reserve has been met and the auction log, but not the reserve price.

ManadartheHealer · Jun 10, 2005, 03:19 AM // 03:19

Very good suggestion; very detailed.

Quote:

a) One Single Institution
Under this option, the stock of the five auction houses is shared. This means that a player in Ascalon City can bid on the same items available to a player in Amnoon Oasis. This also means that if I place an item on sale in Lion's Arch, then anyone can buy it from any of the other auction houses.

Some pros:
- items are available across Tyria
- prices remain stable across Tyria
Some cons:
- overstock of items
- demand might not meet supply

That seems like the better idea. After the first week (if we had system B), the sellers would just find the auction house used the most (most likely LA out of habit

), and they would all go there. Then the others would be vacant.

spikydude · Jun 10, 2005, 03:28 AM // 03:28

I love the idea of an auction house.

Galatea · Jun 10, 2005, 03:41 AM // 03:41

Ba Ne:
The eBay idea is good, but I think takes too long, and if you decide not to set a reserve price, then the item might sell for less than you intended.

Under the system I suggested, you set the lowest price you are willing to let the item go for, and if someone bids the exact price or higher (and no one placed their item on auction for 1 gold piece), then your item will be sold instantly; no waiting around for the next x amount of days to pass for you to get your money. This means you could place something on auction, such as a stack of 10 iron ingots, and it might be sold within a matter of seconds, due to the high demand.

I noticed with eBay, prices aren't always stable. Someone might be selling, say, a video game for $50 while another sells it for only $25. Also, the eBay system allows for multiple bidders on one item. While this might be good with some of the more rare items (max damage weapons with super awesome built-in mods, gold fiery dragon swords, etc.), this may annoy the buyers of craft materials who just want their items right away, and don't want to stand around outbidding other players.

Manadar:
Yeah, that came to mind - that people might just decide to stick around at one auction house, and never another. When I played FFXI, each auction house stood as its own institution - and because you had to travel (by foot, chocobo, boat, etc.) to other towns, I would have to ask people on my friends list or linkshell to see if they were near the major cities and do price checks for me. A crafting material I might need in one city might cost me 400g, while in another city the going price might have been 100g due to overstock. If we have a single institution (choice A), then the prices of items would be stable across Tyria, and I think this would be best for our economy. I think no matter which choice is used, most will probably still hang out around Lion's Arch, but I expect that the other cities won't be so underpopulated. Amnoon Oasis, Henge of Denravi, and Droknar's Forge are surprisingly empty, as opposed to Lion's Arch and Ascalon - which is quite sad to say, because the designs of those cities are stunning (especially Henge of Denravi; I love that whole rainforest feel of the map).

kidxsoup · Jun 11, 2005, 01:57 AM // 01:57

thanks for the info johnny. i guess its all just a matter of time

Soulo · Jun 11, 2005, 02:10 AM // 02:10

/signed

The only thing I think that was done well in FFXI (Final Fantasy XI) is the Auction House system. Trust me, when you try the AH system out you won't know how to play without it.

JoDiamonds · Jun 20, 2005, 05:38 PM // 17:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Galatea

a) One Single Institution
Under this option, the stock of the five auction houses is shared. This means that a player in Ascalon City can bid on the same items available to a player in Amnoon Oasis. This also means that if I place an item on sale in Lion's Arch, then anyone can buy it from any of the other auction houses.

Some pros:
- items are available across Tyria
- prices remain stable across Tyria
Some cons:
- overstock of items
- demand might not meet supply

I don't think either of the cons actually exist. If there would be an overstock worldwide, wouldn't there just be smaller but equal overstocks in each of the smaller cities? The supply and demand are simply combined. If there wasn't enough demand in one small auction house, that will translate to the single house. Having a single house would help smooth the localized effects that might otherwise occur, too. (i.e. Lion's Arch might have a short supply, while Ascalon might have short demand, which would be "fixed" by combining them.)

Maybe I'm missing something, but I have no idea why overstock would be created by combining both supply and demand in one place.

- Players who really want to see everything don't need to go to every city
- Players might just always sell in Ascalon anyway (making it like a single house), because that's the place where everyone can see it.

Quote:

The Structure of the Auction House

I don't necessarily oppose a more complicated system, but here's an idea for a simpler system:

When you auction something, the auctioneer NPC immediately pays you the vendor buy price for the item. The item goes up for auction at a minimum bid at that price. After the end of the auction (however long that is), if the item sold, the player gets the extra money. If it didn't sell, the item just ceases to exist. The player already got some money for it (same as selling to a vendor), and doesn't have to think about it again. Either money appears for them later, or it doesn't. =)

Quote:

Buying

Pretty much everything you had for "buying" seemed pretty good and basic. Well done.

squakMix · Jun 20, 2005, 09:42 PM // 21:42

@ first post: Yea, it would be awsome if the auction houses in the cities only showed the items that were put up in that specific city (which I think you were suggesting in B), so the more you progress the better the items in the different city AH's are.

I LOVE this idea; Signed.

Edit: also perhaps include a minimum price option (I didn't see it in the image but saw you suggested it).

arnansnow · Jun 20, 2005, 09:45 PM // 21:45

Auction houses seem like a very good idea to even out the prices for items, although it would give people a way to get all they need to unlock stuff without needing to farm.
(people could put unidentified runes and weapons up there so other people can get unlocks easy)

Signed