Curse

WhiteAsIce · May 25, 2009, 12:17 AM // 00:17

There should be a NPC at Great Temple of Balthazar that allows you to trade up equipment bags. It would go:

Equipment pack:
Light = Small Equipment Pack + 5 Silver Coins + 200 gold
Large = Light Equipment Pack + 4 Gold Coins + 350 gold
Heavy = Large Equipment Pack + 10 Gold Coins + 600 gold

This way, if you got a lesser bag, you can still get a larger one for equal amount of coins needed to get the larger ones without having to get all the needed Zaishen Coins again.

karadoc · May 25, 2009, 02:24 AM // 02:24

I prefer it how it is. This way you have to make decisions about whether you should save your coins or buy a bag. Under the current system there is some resource management and planning, which adds to the game. With your suggestion it's a no-brainer: always buy a bag right away.

I suggest that if you are looking to upgrade your bags you should try to sell your smaller bag (and/or other zaishen rewards) for gold and then try to buy a bigger bag from another player. (Note, if your suggested reward system was implemented then the value of heavy and large bags would drop significantly.)

lewis91 · May 25, 2009, 02:24 AM // 02:24

EDIT: Damn beaten to it xD.

Ok ive noticed this threads been open a while and still no one has commented.

And i think thats because its a "meh" subject.

In other words "Is it really worth the effort" /notsigned
But on the otherhand "In a month i may want to upgrade to a heavy" /signed

So let me be the first to say.

/undecided

Puebert · May 25, 2009, 03:34 AM // 03:34

I like it.

/signed because my main has yet to get an equipment pack because I don't wanna waste money on more than one.

PahaLukki · May 25, 2009, 02:57 PM // 14:57

/signed or whatever, I think all the eq packs are way too expensive and the amount of stuff you carry in this game has exploded from the early years.

MithranArkanere · May 25, 2009, 03:24 PM // 15:24

Well, they should have been upgradable from the start.

Instead adding another NPC to change them, I'll just replace the mediumn, large and big bags in the collector with runes that upgrade each size to the next, and reduce their prices, so each one adds up.

An item like that should not be something to speculate with.

Yawgmoth · May 25, 2009, 11:36 PM // 23:36

/notsigned

Current system works perfectly fine and there's no need to change. You're just looking for a way to get CHEAPER bigger packs.
Yes, cheaper.
This change would be ~almost~ like making the ZCoins tradeable - people would no longer need to get all 15 gold coins on 1 account to spawn a new Heavy pack, they could get just 10 which is a major difference.

rick1027 · May 26, 2009, 12:02 AM // 00:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

Well, they should have been upgradable from the start.

Instead adding another NPC to change them, I'll just replace the mediumn, large and big bags in the collector with runes that upgrade each size to the next, and reduce their prices, so each one adds up.

An item like that should not be something to speculate with.

if i was to sign it woould be for this they can keep the bags too just add the runes

kazjun · May 26, 2009, 02:10 AM // 02:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

Well, they should have been upgradable from the start.

Instead adding another NPC to change them, I'll just replace the mediumn, large and big bags in the collector with runes that upgrade each size to the next, and reduce their prices, so each one adds up.

An item like that should not be something to speculate with.

Agree. Should have been like this in the first place. But whatever. Got all the bags I can be bothered getting. Is pretty lol though, pvp is the best way to get them, except my pve chars seem to be the ones to swipe them as soon as I get them.

MagmaRed · May 26, 2009, 03:01 AM // 03:01

And take out a potential money sink? Currently people will be selling their old bags if they want to upgrade to a larger one. This means someone else will be buying it. In a sense, it is a money sink. I also like that it makes you plan.

/unsigned

MithranArkanere · May 26, 2009, 04:09 AM // 04:09

No. It doesn't make you plan. It adds regrets.
Plan is like when you choose a side in Factions, a hero in Nightfall or a storyline in Eye of the north. You'll get things different while you play, but with no regrets, since you'll be able to coma back later and do other things you could not before. You plan when you play, but there are no regrets.
Same with upgrades. You either get the big first, or upgrade slowly. You plan, but without regrets.

And it is NOT a gold sink if another player gets the gold.
When another player gets the gold, you can call it a gold funnel. The gold doesn't disappear, it gets concentrated in one player. And that's BAD.
If you want to turn them into gold sinks, make them available for 100k in traders.

kazjun · May 26, 2009, 05:10 AM // 05:10

Mithran is right. A gold sink removes gold from the game (like crafting armour, money is taken from the game forever), trading cash to another player just moves the gold around. The gold still exists within the game, just with a different owner.

**Marty Silverblade** · May 26, 2009, 07:29 AM // 07:29

I like the idea of upgrading the bags. As long as the upgrade price corresponds or even a bit more I'll /sign.

Elephantaliste · May 26, 2009, 08:03 AM // 08:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagmaRed

And take out a potential money sink? Currently people will be selling their old bags if they want to upgrade to a larger one. This means someone else will be buying it. In a sense, it is a money sink. I also like that it makes you plan.

/unsigned

Second hand market is not money sink.

rick1027 · May 26, 2009, 07:09 PM // 19:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marty Silverblade

I like the idea of upgrading the bags. As long as the upgrade price corresponds or even a bit more I'll /sign.

id also agree with this

draxynnic · May 27, 2009, 05:19 AM // 05:19

I agree with Mithran.

Plus, consider why the bags were introduced in the first place - because players asked for more storage. Non-upgradable bags mean that, in practise, most players are just going to save up for the biggest ones. The smaller ones almost might as well not be in the game, and while a player is saving for the first equipment pack, they aren't getting the benefit of the update.

Making them upgradeable would allow players to get some of that inventory pressure relief now, while still having something to work for without having to start over from scratch.

Besides, what's going to happen to the market in sub-heavy packs in a year or so when most people who want heavy packs have already got them?

Yawgmoth · May 27, 2009, 06:27 AM // 06:27

Cheap people are cheap.

There are NO regrets in this system. Bags don't get customized, they can be sold or just passed down to a less played character or mule. No value is lost.

I can ensure you that even the 10-slot bags will still have solid market value in 12 months from now (provided no major update affects them), even if it's as low as say 5k.

No change please, the system works well here.

MithranArkanere · May 27, 2009, 11:57 AM // 11:57

Well,, not value is lost because ZKeys can't be sold, so they are invaluable.
One single gold coin spet in a smaller bag makes harder to get the big one.

There is no speed clear for all ZCoins, there may be some fast ones.

The change won't affect the players if you put the right prices, only those that get the bags only to sell them. There's nothing wrong with that, more like the opposite.

Pistachio · May 28, 2009, 01:33 AM // 01:33

I'm all for upgrading equipment bags. After all it's a system that is already implemented in the game. Have we all not used a Rune of Holding?

Yawgmoth · May 28, 2009, 03:11 AM // 03:11

Bag upgrades would be fine only if they costed as much as the full bags, so they won't devalue the bigger ones.

The seemingly 'fair' pricing suggested in the OP does make obtaining the Large and Heavy bags much EASIER. The effect would be just like making ZCoins themselves trade'able, but to a smaller extent. This would allow new ways of obtaining the heavy packs, for example a player could buy a Large and get 10 gold coins himself and boom - a new Heavy pack is created - bypassing the need for a single account to get to 15 coins.

This would mean MORE Heavy packs in the market, which would lead to them being cheaper which would lead to the ZCoins themselves having less value for the players in the long term.

Zcoins value is dropping by itself, making updates which drop them further would be a bad mistake!
Wrong Way!
Maintaining high value of the ZCoins is important for the whole system to be worthwhile and all the Zquests remain well rewarding.

And theres absolutely no NEED for this kind of update. Bags are sellable and can be just passed down to other characters. Going for the biggest one right away without getting any smaller is a horrible WASTE of resources - get a bunch of smaller first, then gather the coins for bigger ones.

And if you really really NEED a 20-slot for your main char, and you can't afford buying it from other players right away, getting smaller ones first for your ZCoins is still NOT any kind of waste! No value is lost! You can just spend your ZCoins on the smaller ones, and by the time you would get the 15 Goldcoins, you will have about the SAME value in smaller bags --> just sell them and buy the heavy then! Market prices are changing but so far the price of the Heavy is always equal to price of 3 Large ones, and it will stay like that for a long long time.