Curse

Dmitri3 · Jan 20, 2009, 12:36 AM // 00:36

Currently:

Quote:

Reduces Hex durations on you by 20% and damage dealt by you by 5% (Non-stacking) Armor -20

It MIGHT be actually worth to wear it if it can stack.

Things it might change:
- Water mesmers less effective
- Warriors dish out less damage, but harder to shut down
- Warriors more squishy
- May bring warrior runners back
- Umm...

EDIT: Since % are multiplicative in GW and not additive, you won't have ever have 100% hex resistance (my bad, I assumed originally GW only did it to chances).

Now, most at max will probably run 3 or 2 pieces (so not to put it on body and legs).

Of course you don't have to wear them, it's just to give more option to warriors.

P.S. Now, should [Wastrels Worry] stay just to punish these wars more or should it be changed? It will prove far too powerful if used against warriors with Leutenant's (of course considering he's not running 100% less hexes).
My proposal for it: ""For 3 seconds target foe is struck for 4...28 damage each second. Wastrel's Worry ends prematurely if that foe uses a skill. "

_Nihilist_ · Jan 20, 2009, 12:50 AM // 00:50

This wouldn't work, I don't think.

If it has a possibility to reduce hexes by 100%, would the spell fail (a la [[Obsidian Flesh], [[Shadow Form], or [[Spell Breaker]) or just immediately have the end effect (if there was one - and yes, in that case, [[Wastrel's Worry] would be insanely overpowered: 5e, .25 cast, 1 recharge 105+ armor ingnoring dmg spam, talk about a Warrior-killer)?

I don't think you'd see many Warriors running full Lt's sigs, anyways. Stonefist is too important, especially if you are reducing your attack dmg and your AL.

/notsigned

Dmitri3 · Jan 20, 2009, 12:58 AM // 00:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyrael_Eveningsong

This wouldn't work, I don't think.

If it has a possibility to reduce hexes by 100%, would the spell fail (a la [[Obsidian Flesh], [[Shadow Form], or [[Spell Breaker], or just immediately have the end effect (if there was one - and yes, in that case, [[Wastrel's Worry] would be insanely overpowered: 5e, .25 cast, 1 recharge 105+ armor ingnoring dmg spam, talk about a Warrior-killer)?

I don't think you'd see many Warriors running full Lt's sigs, anyways. Stonefist is too important, especially if you are reducing your attack dmg.

/notsigned

With 100% Lieutenant it would be the same as [Patient Spirit] cast on [Mark Of Insecurity]. It would not work (no heal, no damage). With only 4 pieces, it would probably last 1 second, so yeah, that would be a problem.

Currently Lieutenant's insignia is almost worthless. What I'm proposing is making it more useful in some situations. You don't have to run it and if you've ran just 1 piece of Lieutenant's, you still can.
----------------------------------------------

I'll explain my motivation behind this suggestion...

Currently the biggest gripes about GW are:
- warriors deal too much damage compared to casters
- the amount of melee shutdown, water mesmers etc.

That would fix both issues without going into warriors and nerfing them and nerfing all hexes.

One small thing would change quite a bit. Even if not many warriors would use it, it would still bring many possibilities (warrior flag runner for one) and it would discourage of some types of play (guess which) just by being there, in a corner.

Eragon Zarroc · Jan 20, 2009, 01:24 AM // 01:24

no immunity to hexes ty

MStarfire · Jan 20, 2009, 01:25 AM // 01:25

Not only do you contradict your own suggestion, but you've made a poor one.

/notsigned

Dmitri3 · Jan 20, 2009, 01:36 AM // 01:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by MStarfire

Not only do you contradict your own suggestion

I only said that the insignia won't be "oh wow, I'm a God, I pwn you all". It would be certainly advantageous in certain situations, but in others it would cause your doom.

Anyhow, I would appreciate an explanation going with the statement. In others words, at least quote what you mean by contradiction.

[Morkai] · Jan 20, 2009, 01:45 AM // 01:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dmitri3

- Warriors dish out less damage, but harder to shut down

I stopped reading there.

MisterB · Jan 20, 2009, 02:08 AM // 02:08

Percentages stacking would be multiplicative, not additive. So ~22.62% reduced damage and ~67.23% reduced hex duration for all 5 if they were stacking. Not sure how the rounding works, and can't be bothered to look. It would not be 75% damage and zero hex duration for all 5.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dmitri3

- Warriors dish out less damage, but harder to shut down

Quote:

Originally Posted by [Morkai]

I stopped reading there.

Ditto.

Antares Ascending · Jan 20, 2009, 02:11 AM // 02:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by [Morkai]

I stopped reading there.

Head Chest Arms Legs Feet
Reduces Hex durations on you by 20% and damage dealt by you by 5%
Armor -20

In theory it would mean no hex at all but 25% less damage.

I hope you stoped reading to actually look to see what the insignia did

edit: it would also make for a squishy warrior

_Nihilist_ · Jan 20, 2009, 02:48 AM // 02:48

Again, no self-respecting Warrior would run 5. Stonefist Insignia will ALWAYS be on any half-decent Warrior. KD is just too powerful a tool to ignore that extra second.

Even if they wanted to be gimmicky and run 4, the other options that are already better would remain better.

As far as the gripe that Warriors do more damage than casters...

It's a WARRIOR FFS.

Damage is what we DO.

Oh yeah, and what about the limitations we have? Casters don't have to build energy to fire off their Elite as soon as someone gets into casting range. Meanwhile, I have to build up 6A, 7A, or 8A (possibly up to 10A if I decide to go with [[[email protected]]) before I can let loose with my big guns.
Casters usually have a lot more utility than Warriors do as well. Most Warrior bars function with the use of one, at most two secondary profession skills. And even then, those skills have to either boost our damage ([Conjure [email protected]] [Conjure [email protected]] [Conjure [email protected]]) or provide utility that we just don't have ([Mending [email protected]] [Death Pact [email protected]] [[email protected]]).

As far as I'm concerned, anyone bitching that a Warrior does more damage than any other class needs to look at what we can't do, or how easy it is to either Prot or anti-melee to counteract that damage, then come up with a reasonable excuse to cry about Warriors.

[ Disclaimer ]

My Main is a Warrior with over 10mil xp. I've played him since the first day I started GW. He was the first character I ever made. I'm biased. I like my Warrior. The fact that they have actually made some of the Warrior skills in this game better makes me happy. The amount of anti-melee in this game drives me crazy. The lack of 2-handed Axes/Swords or 1-handed Hammers pisses me off, but I'll get over it, just like the fact that I can't dual wield is a reality (though THAT could be taken care of quite easily, and feasibly, that's a topic for another thread, which I'll probably start as soon as I get finished responding to this one) and I'll deal with that as well.

Warrior haters, kiss my ass.

MStarfire · Jan 20, 2009, 03:46 AM // 03:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dmitri3

I only said that the insignia won't be "oh wow, I'm a God, I pwn you all". It would be certainly advantageous in certain situations, but in others it would cause your doom.

Anyhow, I would appreciate an explanation going with the statement. In others words, at least quote what you mean by contradiction.

You want hex immunity except for Wastrel's Worry, a hex.

Fail.

Dmitri3 · Jan 20, 2009, 04:55 AM // 04:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by MStarfire

You want hex immunity except for Wastrel's Worry, a hex.

Fail.

Wow, did you seriously just say that? Read above, I said Wastrel's would require a change of some kind.
But anyhow, if it wasn't, you don't need to wear the insignias, so it wouldn't change anything unless you let it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyrael_Eveningsong

It's a WARRIOR FFS.

Warriors do a lot of damage cause they're easily shutdown. What I'm proposing is an OPTION to do less damage, but be harder to shutdown.

By buffing Lieutenant's it would basically provide more pressure like warriors while leaving current warriors as they are.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MisterB

Percentages stacking would be multiplicative, not additive. So ~22.62% reduced damage and ~67.23% reduced hex duration for all 5 if they were stacking. Not sure how the rounding works, and can't be bothered to look. It would not be 75% damage and zero hex duration for all 5.

That's how block and faster cast/recharge chances stack. Not sure if it applies to + or - % on damage. Same for hex duration.
But even if it did, change Wastrel's and it'll be fine.

MisterB · Jan 20, 2009, 05:07 AM // 05:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dmitri3

That's how block and faster cast/recharge chances stack. Not sure if it applies to + or - % on damage. Same for hex duration.
But even if it did, change Wastrel's and it'll be fine.

You are incorrect, sir. See damage calculation from weapons(15% or 20% if X and 20% customization along with other effects like Asuran Scan and slaying mods) as well as enchantment duration modifiers from weapon mods and [[Blessed Aura]. It's just math. Percentages "stack" in multiplicative fashion.

Sounds like you want to have your cake and eat it too with regards to [[Wastrel's Worry], which is another reason I oppose this suggestion.

Dmitri3 · Jan 20, 2009, 05:34 AM // 05:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by MisterB

You are incorrect, sir. See damage calculation from weapons(15% or 20% if X and 20% customization along with other effects like Asuran Scan and slaying mods) as well as enchantment duration modifiers from weapon mods and [[Blessed Aura]. It's just math. Percentages "stack" in multiplicative fashion.

It's not a matter of math, it's a matter of how GW handles percentages.
But yeah, I suppose I've been wrong on this account.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MisterB

Sounds like you want to have your cake and eat it too with regards to [[Wastrel's Worry], which is another reason I oppose this suggestion.

Originally, I ASKED if it should be changed or stay as it is. But I guess if I had my way with it:

"For 3 seconds target foe is struck for 4...28 damage each second. Wastrel's Worry ends prematurely if that foe uses a skill. "

Ala Ancestors' Rage (PvP). Make it PvP version too so PvErs won't whine how they can't kill bosses with it now. The skill would be a lot more useful in PvP too.

------------------------------

So far I only see comments on how it would be a bad choice to have this armor. Such as, you wouldn't wear it. So many times though, I pointed out that you don't have to.

Icy The Mage · Jan 20, 2009, 05:50 AM // 05:50

/Signed

For the pure reason of the need to change Wastrel's Worry.

Div · Jan 20, 2009, 08:18 AM // 08:18

I don't see how you don't get the severe balance issues around that. If the -20 armor adds up every piece of insignia you put on, then we're talking.

Lourens · Jan 20, 2009, 08:25 AM // 08:25

[Purge Signet] Ftw on adrenaline wars? No its cool now usefull for running and thats it

Dmitri3 · Jan 20, 2009, 09:19 AM // 09:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by holymasamune

I don't see how you don't get the severe balance issues around that. If the -20 armor adds up every piece of insignia you put on, then we're talking.

You get a certain chance to hit certain parts of the body... In short, yes, it would add up.

And yes, I do see how it could change the meta. Disadvatages are still quite big for it to be overpowered though.

----

Lourens, the skill is awful and no, it isn't the same. Besides, lower durations are a lot better that direct removal.

MithranArkanere · Jan 23, 2009, 04:35 PM // 16:35

Look at all other properties they are limited and no longer stack, even if they did some time ago. There's a reason for that, and that reason is still valid.

As long as that reason stays, so does the stack limitation.

The reason? IF you don't know, sorry, I'm not telling. You should know already.

Dmitri3 · Jan 23, 2009, 09:07 PM // 21:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

Look at all other properties they are limited and no longer stack, even if they did some time ago. There's a reason for that, and that reason is still valid.

As long as that reason stays, so does the stack limitation.

The reason? IF you don't know, sorry, I'm not telling. You should know already.

Yup, it's made so you can spam Blurred on warriors all day. It is one of the reasons teams are allowed to play defensive.

Anyway, I understand that the game isn't only about me. I suggested a change, although many people don't understand how it could change the game in a good way (IMHO), I'm also not planning to insist on this for my whole life.