Curse

Steps_Descending · Nov 13, 2009, 01:33 AM // 01:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaximus

clearly you dont understand the concept of balance. the dervish was a-nets repsonse to people wanting to be wammos. this was the caster melee class that people wanted. now people are whining to get versatility + performance equal to that of classes specifically designed to do one thing. so, if people get what they want again, (which would be utterly stupid) and have dervs equal to the two melee classes in melee, then they should have to lose all of their abilities to do other things. if this happened, itd be stupid to play a derv with less armor when you could play a warrior with more.

dervishes are to melee as rits are to healing. since both can do multiple things they cannot be as good as single focus classes in the things they do.

The balance argument is flawed here actually. See, compared to a rit,who can have both good heals(or resto spells) and spike on his bar and do a decent job on both (help the heal and assist the spikes). On their side, a derv can't be an efficient healer and melee at the same time, the full melee bar (with all the quasi-required utilities) is too big for the other full healer bar.

And then there is the stats problem, you'll need scythe + wind + earth (with maybe some mystissism) to stay alive and be any kind of team support. For the rit resto is the support and the stya alive, channeling is the offense, second prof and Spawning gives the utility (as well as possibly the offence).

That means a derv should at least be on par with warrior in term of offence. That doesn't mean better or even equal : it's logical for a pure offence class to have more options and for the hybrid to have to relie on "gimmicky tricks" (Wonding strike) to be effective (he is limited by his hybrid status).

On the other side, even a Wammo, to be efficient, couldn't be a healer. The best he could do was to have 1 life-saving skill on a long cooldown or give himself a buff like sheilding hands. What do derv have? Nothing of the former and all in the later. They are pure damage dealer. So they shoul dbe on par with the warrior.
Ooooor, the other possible situation, they are balanced : they have the very powerful WS and are a melle/caster hybrid who only fulfils the role of a melee, so it's ok to be worse than warrior even tought it is the only thing they do, because they still have 1 or 2 very good possibilities.

On-topic : If the buff is nearly alway maintanable, it should have a drawback : either a very short duration (stealth drawback) or a classic drawback (like the other full duration IAS).

IronSheik · Nov 13, 2009, 02:25 AM // 02:25

Revert pious assault, slightly buff the earth/myst 30s enchants.

Dervishes are awesome again.

lilondra · Nov 13, 2009, 06:10 AM // 06:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaximus

clearly you dont understand the concept of balance. the dervish was a-nets repsonse to people wanting to be wammos. this was the caster melee class that people wanted. now people are whining to get versatility + performance equal to that of classes specifically designed to do one thing. so, if people get what they want again, (which would be utterly stupid) and have dervs equal to the two melee classes in melee, then they should have to lose all of their abilities to do other things. if this happened, itd be stupid to play a derv with less armor when you could play a warrior with more.

dervishes are to melee as rits are to healing. since both can do multiple things they cannot be as good as single focus classes in the things they do.

I understood you perfectly fine.The design of Dervs was to be a melee caster (similar to the design the scrapped for sin) and to have some hefty damage however this design just looked stupid to the common players (because it is) so everyone ran a avatar.Anet was ok with this "since it created a intresting flow in battle".If you don't realise that the wammo design is a bad design then srsly :/ It doesn't matter if its a diff profession you want your backline to prot/heal you for most of the time and in some cases you take heal sig on a war (although that is outdated,hello powercreep).If you can choose between a raw damage class that crits for 100+ ,spams DW like Holy shit bannanapeel and can even hit in AoE or a meh jackofalltrades your choice is quickly made.At most you'll take Avatar of Dwayna + Conviction since it doesn't hinter your ability to do your job : KILL STUFF.Don't get me started about the rt it was a terrible design.

reaper with no name · Nov 14, 2009, 05:43 AM // 05:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by IronSheik

Revert pious assault, slightly buff the earth/myst 30s enchants.

Dervishes are awesome again.

This is a myth. Even if dervishes regained all of their former power, they would still not be able to compete with scythe sins and scythe warriors in raw power. Of course, this suggestion wouldn't give them that ability, either, but that's not really the issue here.

IronSheik · Nov 14, 2009, 06:06 AM // 06:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by reaper with no name

This is a myth. Even if dervishes regained all of their former power, they would still not be able to compete with scythe sins and scythe warriors in raw power. Of course, this suggestion wouldn't give them that ability, either, but that's not really the issue here.

Talking about PvP, not 'PvE'.

My suggestion would at least make dervishes viable. This suggestion is just...bad. For reference look up other suggestions by 'reaper with no name'.

reaper with no name · Nov 14, 2009, 06:16 AM // 06:16

Maybe in PvP, but it wouldn't help them at all in PvE.

Giga_Gaia · Nov 15, 2009, 03:59 AM // 03:59

Assuming you're talking about PvE: Whirling Charge with that Dwarven skill that increases your stances duration by XX % works. Or bring a 20% enchant mod. Eternal Aura works too. In PvP: meh, it's balanced enough as it is.

IronSheik · Nov 15, 2009, 04:41 AM // 04:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Giga_Gaia

Assuming you're talking about PvE: Whirling Charge with that Dwarven skill that increases your stances duration by XX % works. Or bring a 20% enchant mod. Eternal Aura works too. In PvP: meh, it's balanced enough as it is.

Why waste a PvE slot to bring a conditional bad IAS when you can just run drunken master.