Curse

Dobermann · Jan 09, 2010, 09:27 AM // 09:27

With the impending destruction of shadow form and 600/smiting creeping ever closer, i suggest reverting Ursan too what is once was, (energy every time your are hit or hit someone) but to give it a huge recharge of like 300seconds.

Ursan did NOTHING like shadow form could - A DoASC could never be done in 40 minutes with Ursan - like with shadowform.

An UWSC Could never have been done is 7 minutes with ursan - like the world record with shadow form stands.

All ursan did was allow ALL professions (regardless) to farm, took a lot more skill not to die than shadow form.

Killerminds · Jan 09, 2010, 11:09 AM // 11:09

Stop the bad troll threads
And as for the more skill than shadow form thing, SF requires -5 skill and Ursan requires 0.

Dobermann · Jan 09, 2010, 11:13 AM // 11:13

Please explain how this is a troll thread?

I considered this a very sensible thread with my humble opinion on what should be done..

lishi · Jan 09, 2010, 11:36 AM // 11:36

Wait, lets see the logic here

normal power level limit 50

Ursan power level 100

Shadow form power level 150

Ursan power level was too high, so it got nerfed.

Shadow form power level is no good so it will be nerfed.

So how after concluding that a power level of 150 is not a good thing a power level of 100 became ok?

Now, i do realize you think going 100 is ok, but you are trying to convice anet.

Cuilan · Jan 09, 2010, 01:37 PM // 13:37

You can Arcane Mimicry Assassin's Promise to have the team maintain Ursan.

I want to play the game, not be forced into builds. If Ursan makes a comeback, I will quit the game again.

Steps_Descending · Jan 09, 2010, 01:54 PM // 13:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by lishi

normal power level limit 50

Ursan power level 100

Shadow form power level 150

Ursan power level was too high, so it got nerfed.

Ursan had two problem, forced grind and powerlevel. The former wouldn't be fixed in any way. The later could be worked around with the enormous unavoidable recharge (recharge kicked in after UB ended like echo, right?), it would at least punish the player for letting in down. But would they let it down? I never ran it, so I don't know if it is hard or not.

So, do we want to bring an old and less-broken-than-SF meta back or risk a new neta with normal skills and hopefully a lot fewer godlike-OP skills? BTW, what really OP skills are left : Obsi? it's strong but the movement penalty makes awesome but (kinda) impratical. SY? Last I heard it was strong, but only against non-assa-physicals/elems/rits and was used in balanced so no one hates it yet. Ether Renewal? That one will be nerfed or make it's way into the meta one way or another, I think. Spiritway-like? Are they really powerfull enough to be OP?

I see only one SF-level-of-problematicness skill in that : ER. And while it's as powerful as SF/UB, those 2 could be stacked, but I don't think we'll see 6ERelem-team anytime soon. But then again I could be very wrong My vote is for a new meta.

own age myname · Jan 09, 2010, 02:20 PM // 14:20

I miss Ursan. Even still, it can still be played to a viable level, I don't know why people don't play it (I saw a build on it with an oath shot spammer awhile back). I still never got the arguments against Ursan. It allowed the average player to get into the elite areas. But, greedy bastards who hoard ectos/ambraces/any highend item, don't want to lose their virtual cash -.-

Reformed · Jan 09, 2010, 02:36 PM // 14:36

I'd really prefer Ursan stayed gone but at this point does it matter?

On the plus side it was very forgiving and encouraged the most PuG play I've seen since the good old days. Under Ursan though bad players stayed bad because they weren't encouraged to learn the basics. Most groups couldn't even figure out how to chain KDs let alone bodyblock correctly with 6 frontliners (think about that). Those same people still play GW and really shouldn't be in the Elites if they don't understand aggro control you learn in the first 5 minutes of the game.

Desert Rose · Jan 09, 2010, 02:42 PM // 14:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by lishi

Ursan power level 100

Power Level of Ursan after nerf - 99
Skill required to play Ursan - 0
Skill required to play Ursan after nerf - 1

Ursan is nearly as powerful as it was before the "nerf", people are just too dumb to realise this.

Shayne Hawke · Jan 09, 2010, 03:19 PM // 15:19

Guild Wars is a game of ten professions, not one.

/nothanks

Damian Manson · Jan 09, 2010, 04:35 PM // 16:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shayne Hawke

Guild Wars is a game of ten professions, not one.

/nothanks

I personally would like to thank you on stating this because for a long time people have forgotten this very fact that there are 10 proffesions and not just 1 but meh i think we will allways have people wanting ursan back the way it was or when it comes sf lol

there is one thing i will also agree with and that is ursan did promote some pug play but most of the time it was a rank fest so was not worth it

and not the most user friendly if you were of lower ranks. Anyways good day all and have fun with the rest of the discussion

Morphy · Jan 09, 2010, 05:14 PM // 17:14

Who cares. PvE sux anyway.

Gennadios · Jan 09, 2010, 05:18 PM // 17:18

When my guildies and I first beat UW, most of us were playing for around two years and it was the most profound sense of accomplishment to be had in GW.

There is some part of "Elite Mission" that people don't seem to comprehend, It's not meant to be completed by a hoard of peasants.

Marzipan Marci · Jan 09, 2010, 05:28 PM // 17:28

The problem with ursan was it wasn't class-specific. Every profession could use it. We don't want this. Just nerf everything and let's play a fair balanced game. XD just kidding, this game will never be balanced.

/Noobthread

Goddess Of Defense · Jan 09, 2010, 05:29 PM // 17:29

Ursan actually opened up pug groups again, people don't realize this because they thought it was over powered. It got random people to actually work as a team, to do something they wanted. People could actually do something because the skill was relatively easy to go and get. The problem being is that people wanted r10 to do all the really fun stuff. Now the fun stuff is strictly moved to only what 3 classes allowed? out of the 10 someone suggested we have? Ursan allowed all 10 classes to do something regardless of what skills brought because only 1 skill allowed them to work as a team, not including the healing cookie cutter monks. (that's a different argument) On the brighter hand without Ursan some things put out jobs that people can now run instead of forming a pug and fight their way through... still doesn't bring the players together, now all they do is argue, troll, talk garbage, and play e-peen.

< /valid point >

Killerminds · Jan 09, 2010, 06:02 PM // 18:02

kk how bout instead of fixing Ursan they just fix meta.

MagmaRed · Jan 09, 2010, 06:09 PM // 18:09

PUGs are bad. Haven't always been, but they have been for a LONG time. The reason is people have stopped learning how to play. With the addition of heroes and over powered builds that require little interaction from the player, even a monkey can play PvE effectively. If you want to play with all 10 classes and be effective you do not look for PUGs, but you use guild/alliance/friends.

Doberman, you failed to present a good reason to bring Ursan back. You state that it allows all 10 classes to FARM, yet the game is not about farming. Yes, many people farm for various reasons, and always will. But changing skills to help people farm is not how the game should be run. Skill changes should be made to balance PvP or to make PvE more fun/interesting. On occassion, skills have been nerfed/buffed for PvE to 'fix' problems, but the ability to farm should not be a reason to change a skill. The only skill change that should be made in regards to farming is when a skill allows things to be done too easily/fast to disrupt the economy or game play.

Ursan in its current form, in my opinion, is well balanced. It actually takes some skill to use it effectively now, and is not super powerful anymore.

MisterB · Jan 09, 2010, 06:28 PM // 18:28

Ursan doesn't need a buff, but PuGs do.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Desert Rose

Ursan is nearly as powerful as it was before the "nerf", people are just too dumb to realise this.

I'm curious what the reasoning is behind giving Ursan a 300 second recharge.

For my opinion on the topic of Ursan Blessing, see Shayne Hawke's post.
Addendum: There were actually 2 classes, U/lolwut and Mo/.

Arduin · Jan 09, 2010, 07:02 PM // 19:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goddess Of Defense

Ursan actually opened up pug groups again, people don't realize this because they thought it was over powered. It got random people to actually work as a team, to do something they wanted.

6 Ursan and 2 HB Monks never worked as a team. You had 6 rampaging bears c-spacing through the enemies, and two Monk pushing red bars.

There was no synergy between the Ursans other than the shout being applied to team-members. Perhaps knocklocking on tough groups, but there the team ends.

That's why it worked so well. 8 random pugs could kill anything, because everyones job was that easy, you didn't need teamwork, other than staying in proximity of each other.

The Abuzer · Jan 09, 2010, 07:08 PM // 19:08

Man, think a little at a thing:
-SF can be kept with only the assassin profession.
-A case can be the old uwsc with 7 sins and a necro

-Ursan can be kept with ANY profession.
-Result: even pve unwanted professions (mes for example) can do a team and start to play with other players.

Conclusion:

-Sf make a dominant class witch makes unbalanced gaps in professions(for example a guy which like mesmers but can't be part of a team), instead it, ursan can make everybody enter a team.

NOTE: Sorry 'bout saying the mes are not wanted in pve, didn't remembered another profession that isnt used for farming.