Curse

Perfected Shadow · Mar 14, 2010, 10:18 AM // 10:18

Title
E.g. q8 shields, etc.

Did a quick search to see if this has been suggested. Apologies if it has.

MagmaRed · Mar 14, 2010, 10:30 AM // 10:30

Why? To further destroy the economy? These are rare items, and provide decent money for people that find them. Giving them away for free to PvP characters will only make the skin matter for pricing. There are plenty of them available, just buy one from another player.

/signed

*edit* Thought I better make sure people realized the "/signed" was sarcastic

stanzhao · Mar 14, 2010, 11:36 AM // 11:36

i am almost mesmerized that you think this is an idea even worth mentioning. to be honest i wouldnt apolagise about not using the search function, i would apolagise for not using your brain.

say... for some crazy reason, anet decided that they would give you q8 weaps for every pvp char. then someone else comes along... 'ya know what this game REALLY needs? some q7 weaps.'

'hey yeah, thats a good idea too, but i have thought of an even better one... q6!'

'holy balls! this guy right here... he's thinking of the future... the future'

...and so on and so forth. its also pointless to have everyone on q8 weaps... as everyone else would have them too... kinda defeats the object, why not just stick to q9... which everyone already has

BlueNovember · Mar 14, 2010, 11:46 AM // 11:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by stanzhao

why not just stick to q9... which everyone already has

Because builds that have Mo/W with 8 in tactics gain an advantage by having a r8 tactics shield. Part of the ethos of GW pvp is that equipment does not provide an advantage over your opponents.

However the advantage is relatively insignificant, and it would ruin a perfectly good market.

Andemius · Mar 14, 2010, 01:03 PM // 13:03

/notsigned

low q items give average PvErs an advantage over PvPers, they're supposed to be rarer with nice skins, In any case, ppl who are rich can just buy them anyways.

Desert Rose · Mar 14, 2010, 01:37 PM // 13:37

Being able to create PvP equipment with a lower req but therefor less power would be nice, e.g. q7 shields with only 15 armor.

FoxBat · Mar 14, 2010, 02:18 PM // 14:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by stanzhao

say... for some crazy reason, anet decided that they would give you q8 weaps for every pvp char. then someone else comes along... 'ya know what this game REALLY needs? some q7 weaps.'

'hey yeah, thats a good idea too, but i have thought of an even better one... q6!'

The buck stops at q8 only because you can ALREADY get those in PvE. q7 max insc do not exist.

A UI to specify lower powers would be cool but it seems like too much work at this stage. So I'd settle for max PvP items lowered to q8. Or retroactively nerf q8 maxes to q9, lord knows Mo/Ws don't need to be as good as they are, but that will just have people scrambling over q7/al15s.

Quote:

its also pointless to have everyone on q8 weaps... as everyone else would have them too... kinda defeats the object, why not just stick to q9... which everyone already has

Everyone is SUPPOSED to have the same thing, it's called even competition, it's the point of PvP character creation.

Again, bypassing the economy/market entirely is the POINT of PvP characters.

Skyy High · Mar 14, 2010, 07:48 PM // 19:48

I agree that this would make it more fair for PvP chars, but is it a big enough deal to care about?

Div · Mar 14, 2010, 08:21 PM // 20:21

Anet cares more about (what's left of) their economy than actual game fairness.

While it makes no sense why someone has to spend ~500k+ to get a full set of req8 shields to even start competing fairly in PvP, Anet simply doesn't care about the PvP community enough, so won't do anything about it.

Anyone who argues that PvE characters or rich players should have an advantage doesn't understand the premise the game was built on.

Reverend Dr · Mar 15, 2010, 01:40 AM // 01:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Div

Anet cares more about (what's left of) their economy than actual game fairness.

While it makes no sense why someone has to spend ~500k+ to get a full set of req8 shields to even start competing fairly in PvP, Anet simply doesn't care about the PvP community enough, so won't do anything about it.

Anyone who argues that PvE characters or rich players should have an advantage doesn't understand the premise the game was built on.

This^

They also care too much about what's left of the economy to put in a real AH, as if they put in a working AH the economy would be destroyed in a few months.

jazilla · Mar 15, 2010, 01:52 AM // 01:52

I am completely missing how the economy is broken. Broken like when 20/20 hilts went for 35k^? The economy is pretty stinkin fair. I am like the rest of the people, and I was bummed that ectos didn't shoot up to 11k at the Rare Mat. Trader. But diamonds are on the rise as are the rest of the gems. The economy is far from broken. If anything I find it the players that don't grasp how selling works. I remember when feathers dipped pretty drastically and people were selling essences for MORE than they were selling them when feathers were 10k a stack on average. I scratched my head on that one, because it means that people can't be bothered to even check with the Material Trader and they just accept whatever people decide to sell things for. Don't hate the game, hate the players.

Perfected Shadow · Mar 15, 2010, 01:57 AM // 01:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by stanzhao

i am almost mesmerized that you think this is an idea even worth mentioning. to be honest i wouldnt apolagise about not using the search function, i would apolagise for not using your brain.

say... for some crazy reason, anet decided that they would give you q8 weaps for every pvp char. then someone else comes along... 'ya know what this game REALLY needs? some q7 weaps.'

I think you're misunderstanding the suggestion. What I want is pvp chars to be able to create weapons that already exist in pve (same requirement, don't care about skin). There are q8 max stat equip in pve so they should be easily available for pvp too. There are q7 15 AL shields in pve so they should be easily available for pvp too, etc.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andemius

low q items give average PvErs an advantage over PvPers, they're supposed to be rarer with nice skins, In any case, ppl who are rich can just buy them anyways.

Your idea of competition with regards to pvp is stupid. About skins, I'm talking about requirements on weapons not skins.

MagmaRed · Mar 15, 2010, 02:04 AM // 02:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perfected Shadow

I think you're misunderstanding the suggestion. What I want is pvp chars to be able to create weapons that already exist in pve (same requirement, don't care about skin). There are q8 max stat equip in pve so they should be easily available for pvp too. There are q7 15 AL shields in pve so they should be easily available for pvp too, etc.

PvP characters already have access to those req 8 and req 7 items that PvE characters do. They may not be able to go farm them with that PvP character, but not all PvE people playing PvP farmed thier own anyway. Just buy them from another player like most people already do. Those req 8 and req 7 items are 'rare', which means they are worth more money. That is part of the economy in the game. PvP players have EASY ways to make money. Just cash in your Balthazar faction for Zkeys and sell them, or win Halls and get rare skin weapons, mini Ghostly, sigils, etc. and sell those.

The only thing I see this doing is removing a part of the in game market. It be like letting people get Wendy's food at McDonalds, without having to pay for it.

Perfected Shadow · Mar 15, 2010, 02:14 AM // 02:14

This is for you magma:

Quote:

Originally Posted by FoxBat

Everyone is SUPPOSED to have the same thing, it's called even competition, it's the point of PvP character creation.

Again, bypassing the economy/market entirely is the POINT of PvP characters.

ShadowsRequiem · Mar 15, 2010, 04:09 AM // 04:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by jazilla

I am completely missing how the economy is broken. Broken like when 20/20 hilts went for 35k^? The economy is pretty stinkin fair. I am like the rest of the people, and I was bummed that ectos didn't shoot up to 11k at the Rare Mat. Trader. But diamonds are on the rise as are the rest of the gems. The economy is far from broken. If anything I find it the players that don't grasp how selling works. I remember when feathers dipped pretty drastically and people were selling essences for MORE than they were selling them when feathers were 10k a stack on average. I scratched my head on that one, because it means that people can't be bothered to even check with the Material Trader and they just accept whatever people decide to sell things for. Don't hate the game, hate the players.

Yeah thats nothing, anyone remember when perfect fort and sundering mods went for 100k+ alone?

I think its a good idea though, this is just like how anet used to nerf the pve items people would use in gvg. Anyone remember that fire wand that used to make you attack faster? but it had a -10% chance to miss. Good times.

Req 8 shields would be a good idea, but they'll never add it. And imo it wouldn't hurt its not like you can sell pvp items XD

Del · Mar 15, 2010, 04:28 AM // 04:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagmaRed

PvP characters already have access to those req 8 and req 7 items that PvE characters do. They may not be able to go farm them with that PvP character, but not all PvE people playing PvP farmed thier own anyway. Just buy them from another player like most people already do. Those req 8 and req 7 items are 'rare', which means they are worth more money. That is part of the economy in the game. PvP players have EASY ways to make money. Just cash in your Balthazar faction for Zkeys and sell them, or win Halls and get rare skin weapons, mini Ghostly, sigils, etc. and sell those.

The only thing I see this doing is removing a part of the in game market. It be like letting people get Wendy's food at McDonalds, without having to pay for it.

it's pretty bullshit to think being able to pay for an advantage is in any way, shape or form, fair.

/signed for great justice

Quail Stomp · Mar 15, 2010, 05:15 AM // 05:15

Shouldnt have to put up with pvers trying to power trade just to get the shields you need to compete with.
/signed

Terrible Surgeon · Mar 16, 2010, 07:40 AM // 07:40

cool idea i think its fair to those who dont have pve accts and screw you farmers. If u farm so well go get me a torm shield and pm me in game plox...i want a q9 torm shield [tactics] have strength already and get me a BDS q9 divine favor and a VS q9 dyed black caster modded....dont bitch about shitty skinned shields that drop out the ass in w/e areas,\.... "ITS GONNA HURT FARMErs!!" SERIOUSLY.....who gives a shake of a fist GORED ENGINE!!!

Tenebrae · Mar 16, 2010, 08:47 AM // 08:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Desert Rose

Being able to create PvP equipment with a lower req but therefor less power would be nice, e.g. q7 shields with only 15 armor.

No. Progression would be R8 15 and R7 14 in PvP. R8 and R7 shields with max armor are rare drop in PvE.
Consider those rare pve drops as it were "rare skin" drops so no , low req weaps are meant for low lvl chars and pvp chars are always 20. If you want a rare shield , buy them where they are , in PvE.

/notsignedlikehell

Yawgmoth · Mar 16, 2010, 09:20 AM // 09:20

Ruininating the economy after 5 years of low req drops being fine is bad. And the whole "problem" isn't serious enough to warrant developer time - seriously, you can buy 15/8 or 14/7 shields dirt cheap (many ppl merch them) and you won't feel the difference. And then when you get some more money you can slowly upgrade to 16/8 and 15/7, and it's always been a very safe investment - they don't lose value! Now such an update would make the PvP players who already bought them LOSE A LOT.
That's why /not signed.