Curse

Tenebrae · May 05, 2010, 07:35 AM // 07:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rikimaru

Ugh.. I guess that was my fault for apparently getting lead into a troll; from that last comment you clearly don't even play an assassin, and you still say stuff like "don't suck".
Anyway, I'm not stupid enough to continue this argument anymore, it's clearly not going anywhere.

Sorry if you read it like that but thats the truth. The mere existance of a counter to something is not reason enough ( and dear god , will never be ) to change something so it has no counters ..... only "disadvantages".

If someone uses its brain with the sin , knows the game , and knows the few skills/players that can turn them into a stupid autoattack players for a while ... then they will adapt its build/playstyle to avoid that stuff. Diversion/Blind/Blocking can piss Assassins ? oh yeah but does not hex removal , interrupts , daze and energy denial piss off Mesmers and Necros ? does not Ench removal , interrupts and daze piss off Monks and dervs and so on ? .... dude , live with it and DEAL with it.
This game is made that way , everything has its counters , thats the way it should be and they should be COUNTERS , not disadvantages of usage like you suggest.

MithranArkanere · May 05, 2010, 07:07 PM // 19:07

PvP is not PvE.

You are not supposed to one-hit kill enemies, not even 3-hit kill.
If you don't pay attention to your surroundings, you won't succesfully complete combos.
That's the downside of their combos. If you can land them, you can keep enemies dazed, blinded, knocked down, damaged, every now and then.
Assassins are not warriors, after all. They require a bit more brains to play.

I wouldn't mind having more skills (and thus more options) for them, but you can't just change the current ones to lose the combo requirements. That would mean decreasing their damage, conditional extras, etc.

T-Strudel · May 05, 2010, 08:47 PM // 20:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magragoc

In the end, assassin skills having such huge +damage numbers is supposedly balanced around having to work for it: By putting together a chain. If you remove that requirement, you just make already powerful skills overbearing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zahr Dalsk

The problem with combos is that the best one is by far to just go for rapid death blossom spam.

100% Agreed to the above.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stealth Bomberman

DPS- conjure x + way of the sin + fast recharging chain w/ DB spam or seeping wound builds are pretty nasty. not to mention assasscasting is still a threat.

You don't even need daggers for a Seeping Wound build, you can roll A/P for that and use a spear, it's still effective, even the new Silent Peacekeepers run that build. You won't hit as hard as Mobius Strike/Death Blossom but you'll spread conditions and degen the hell out of them.

Amy Awien · May 06, 2010, 06:58 AM // 06:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rikimaru

...My suggestion is pretty simple; remove the hard requirement on having to perform the last piece of a combo for the next to be able to hit, ...

It's the price that's paid for (potentially) doing lots of damage, the increased risk of doing not so great, this compromise brings some balance between the professions. Other professions have other drawbacks to their offensive, giving none to the Assassins would be unbalanced.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rikimaru

There's still no stopping an interrupt thrown into your attack.

Some sins I encounter are quite able to avoid or counter my counters, while others don't and go down more easily then the average NPC. You have to make do with the skills you bring, and if you bring a set of skills with which you can't play well, change it until you can. And even then, no single skill bar can handle every situation and every opponent.

Morphy · May 06, 2010, 03:35 PM // 15:35

Assassins are terribly designed. They need a complete rework. The concept of a somewhat more frontline class (NB: WITHOUT the ridiculous shadow steps) with survivability skills and utility in Shadow Arts is definitely a workable concept, though.

Looking at this suggestion if it were implemented like that without changing anything, lol Twisting Fangs?

Nuclfus · May 08, 2010, 01:52 AM // 01:52

Sins are weak when a skill gets disabled in their combo.

/signed

Del · May 08, 2010, 02:10 AM // 02:10

this is only a good idea if the damage output from sins is also nerfed, otherwise this idea is completely and utterly bad.

Terrible Surgeon · May 08, 2010, 02:20 AM // 02:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nuclfus

Sins are weak when a skill gets disabled in their combo.

/signed

Uh last i checked a lot of professions are real weak when a skill is disabled. I understand real well that if a sin has one skill disabled, especially its lead attack, that it can make the player useless for a period of time. But this is no reason to revamp anything as it is not disabled that long normally.
What disables a sins skills? Shield bash and mesmers are what come to mind and the occasional ranger that got a lucky dshot. Shield bash is is nothing big, and mesmers are meant to be shutdown and stop others from casting or attacking. That is what good mesmers do, stop players dead in their tracks.
Assassins are very versatile. They can bring multiple lead attacks, offhands, and dual attacks. A player can choose to fill the skill bar to make one chain or can make a chain that can be spammed in many different combinations.
Anyway, being able to land a twisting fangs without having landed an offhand first is just a bad idea. It would lead to a lot of abuse even if penalties were applied. Such as using horns of ox without having used any lead or offhand first.
Assassins are powerful as they are, no real dramatic changes needed.

Desert Rose · May 08, 2010, 12:36 PM // 12:36

The assassin is a horribly designed profession, and the combo system is one of the reasons for that. Your suggestion would change the assassin for the better, but also creates bigger overlaps with the role of the warrior.
Blindly changing some sin skills may improve the sin itself, but likely will make the game worse on a general level. If you want to change the sin you first have to think of a non broken role (e.g. solo spiker is a broken role) that currently isn't already filled by another profession, then change the sin in a way that it performs that role better than other professions (while perfoming the other roles worse than the other professions).

Reformed · May 08, 2010, 04:25 PM // 16:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Terrible Surgeon

Assassins are powerful as they are, no real dramatic changes needed.

^ Here you go.

Sins are fine--DPS is incredible. Being forced to chain skills and their glass cannon nature are really the only things that justify having the potential for such incredible damage output.

gundam2010 · May 10, 2010, 05:54 PM // 17:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rikimaru

There are a lot of problems with the way combos work.
They remove flexibility and active player skill, they make it far too easy to completely screw over an Assassin's offense, and they limit build creativity/options among other issues.

My suggestion is pretty simple; remove the hard requirement on having to perform the last piece of a combo for the next to be able to hit, and instead add some sort of cost for using an attack out of place, such as increased energy cost, increased recharge, or maybe exhaustion.
Then you could use certain attacks out of place as they are needed, but it would be impractical to do it regularly for fractured combos or attack spamming.
The out of place attacks could also possibly not count as lead/offhand/dual for the sake of combos, so that if you try to follow it with the next piece in the combo the extra cost will be there as well.

Please either post suggestions to improve this idea or your own idea of how to improve combos.

Uhmm no? Go play assasin more before you have such comments like this. I can tell that you don't play sin a lot. They have DOUBLE dmg + CRIT dmg. They are what they are, assasin. What they do is that they SPIKE not pressure like warrior. And no it is NOT easy to break the assasin combo unless you SPAM your skill like homos then yes. Play more sin and be an exp sin user.