Curse

WhiteAsIce · Jun 10, 2010, 02:20 AM // 02:20

Looking at Melandru's Arrows, it seems like a greatly inferior mix of Glass Arrows and Barbed Arrows. There is definitely room for improvement. Going by the theme of the skill's name, it should punish foes affected by an enchantment and possibly a hex.

Changes to implement:
1) Increase duration to 24 seconds
2) Increasre energy cost to 10
3) Arrows deal +1..8..10 damage unconditionally
(keep the Bleeding part)

Against enchanted or hexed foes, your arrows:
A) Deal +7..16..18 damage
B) Are unblockable
C) Cause 1..2..3 energy loss

I think it may be overpowered in PvP if it had all three of the latter changes, so it should have one or two of the three changes I listed. (C) can be particular unfair in PvP if combined with the others, so that could stand on its own, while (A) and (B) can possibly go together.

**Marty Silverblade** · Jun 10, 2010, 02:26 AM // 02:26

From a PvE point of view, you might as well give all 3 of those bonuses. It'll help Rangers be useful. Energy loss is basically useless though, maybe increase the +damage instead or give it some other effect. Maybe even scale the +damage according to how many hexes/enchants the foe has.

WhiteAsIce · Jun 10, 2010, 03:59 AM // 03:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marty Silverblade

From a PvE point of view, you might as well give all 3 of those bonuses. It'll help Rangers be useful. Energy loss is basically useless though, maybe increase the +damage instead or give it some other effect. Maybe even scale the +damage according to how many hexes/enchants the foe has.

The energy loss part, I took it from Deb Shot. I'm going to decrease the numbers to make that part fair.
The current +damage for MA is +8...24 on enchanted foes. I simply split it so that part of the damage is unconditional, while the bonus is the same.
+damage for each enchantment or hex? That can be insanely powerful, especially in hex-heavy teams.

Eragon Zarroc · Jun 10, 2010, 05:33 AM // 05:33

that is an awful lot of bonuses you get against hexed/enchanted foes. prolly just pick one of em. each is powerful in it's own right, especially in pvp. 3 energy loss every hit would be too much. the unblockable, maybe. the most useful one in pve though would be the +dmg against hexed/enchanted foes.

Olle · Jun 10, 2010, 05:59 AM // 05:59

Since its melandru, and we got the avatar making you get no conditions, make it each attack "shoots" 1...2 conditions to target..

Divine Ashes · Jun 10, 2010, 01:18 PM // 13:18

I always thought Melandru's Arrows was fine. I use it as my elite when I'm running discordway. Easy low upkeep spammable condition. Combine that with Asuran scan and you got a good set up for Discord.

Xsiriss · Jun 10, 2010, 02:00 PM // 14:00

I personally wouldn't mind seeing it turn into a sort of IA but with bleeding and + damage.

But yeah as a preparation it should be at least 24 seconds long. In theme with the natural/melandru thang work against. That's probably enough of a buff actually, that and keeping it at 5e. Coolies.

Morphy · Jun 10, 2010, 03:30 PM // 15:30

Barbed Arrows is overpowered and needs a nerf, powercreeping Mel Arroos can only end in tears.

ac1inferno · Jun 10, 2010, 06:33 PM // 18:33

[[Melandru's Arrows] could use a buff. When compared to [[Glass Arrows], it just isn't as good. The advantages aren't that good. Unconditional bleeding doesn't help that much and while it does provide higher bonus damage, it is only against enchanted foes, which could very well mean all ready protted.

I like your ideas and for me it would be the combination of:

- last 24 seconds
- Deal +1..8 damage unconditionally
- Unblockable by enchanted or hexed foes

**Marty Silverblade** · Jun 10, 2010, 11:34 PM // 23:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by WhiteAsIce

+damage for each enchantment or hex? That can be insanely powerful, especially in hex-heavy teams.

I didn't necessarily mean +8..16 damage. Numbers can be tweaked. The point behind the suggestion was to try and find a niche for Rangers to deal decent damage in. Besides, you don't generally stack that many hexes onto a foe anyway. There is usually a key hex or two, like MoP and perhaps AP, but hex stacking isn't really PvE-meta.

Tenebrae · Jun 11, 2010, 07:59 AM // 07:59

18 sec is enough. I would change it to make an easy condition to met and a good bonus one for the enchanted/hexed part , something like :
MArrows [E] preparation 5e , 2 , 12sec
- Your arrows deal +5 ... 15 damage against Enchanted/Hexed foes. If foe has a condition too , your bow skills hit for +5 ...15 damage.

Compared to glass arrows ..... expertise , easy to max ( unlike Wildernesss pfff , who has WS 15 lol ? ) uncondt max damage +20 ( yeah , MA would have 30 but needs 2 condt and second is only on bow skills , not infinite energy ) effect if blocked ,( MA would have none ), and its duration is almost double ( 35 vs 18 ).

Amy Awien · Jun 11, 2010, 09:24 PM // 21:24

It has to move out of Wilderness Survival and into Marksmanship or Expertise. It's just not good enough to (a) use the elite and (b) warrant spending points into WS. Glass Arrows is more effective, not because of it's bonus damage but because it is in Expertise and that leaves more options open.

Xsiriss · Jun 12, 2010, 10:45 AM // 10:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tenebrae

18 sec is enough. I would change it to make an easy condition to met and a good bonus one for the enchanted/hexed part , something like :
MArrows [E] preparation 5e , 2 , 12sec
- Your arrows deal +5 ... 15 damage against Enchanted/Hexed foes. If foe has a condition too , your bow skills hit for +5 ...15 damage.

That use to be scavenger's niche, hitting for +damage against conditioned foes. They then scrapped it, with reason. It has to be 24 seconds long because it's elite for god's sake, that's one of its biggest weakness'.

Tenebrae · Jun 12, 2010, 11:58 AM // 11:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xsiriss

That use to be scavenger's niche, hitting for +damage against conditioned foes. They then scrapped it, with reason.

No, you cant mantain scavenger but you can mantain mel arrows. Scavenger is a skill so allows a prep , this one doesnt.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xsiriss

t has to be 24 seconds long because it's elite for god's sake, that's one of its biggest weakness'.

6 seconds is a big weakness ? i dont think so . The other reasons why glass arrows is superior are far more important than those 6 sec imo.

It shouldnt be moved to marks or exp , meladru resilence is also in WS , both belong there. I dont think a change is coming but bleh , why not imagine.

Amy Awien · Jun 13, 2010, 12:48 PM // 12:48

I share your 'feeling' on Melandru and Wilderness Survival, but Melandru's Shot is in Marksmanship and Melandru's Assault in Beastmastery... MA in WS consumes the third attribute line, and rules out Beastmastery and Conjures - which can be combined with Glass Arrows - and there's not much else in WS for a damage oriented build (which is why you'd pick MA).

Melandru's skills used to have a link with 'enchantments', maybe something completely different, make it a skill and have it remove enchantment (for x arrows) from foes.

Btw, I assume you meant arrows for the part with foes suffering from a conditions, not skills. Though restricting it to bowskills could make for an interesting way to tone it down, if so desired; Your next 1...9 bowskills ....

distilledwill · Jun 15, 2010, 03:06 PM // 15:06

I like the idea of removing energy. Perhaps something like -1 with each attack (whilst suffering from a hex) or -4 with each attack skill (whilst suffering from a hex). Then put in the +damage and I think its a fairly good skill, its balanced (from what I can see - it can be negated with all the normal physical counters and also from decent hex removal).

headlesshobbs · Jun 15, 2010, 07:47 PM // 19:47

I was giving thought on interrupting spells if foe was suffering from a condition. This would make a hell of a fun skill against casters.

Amy Awien · Jun 15, 2010, 09:55 PM // 21:55

Mhh, that'd be strong. The functional equivalent requires two skills - {Practiced Stance} +Choking Gas - to be maintainable. That one is AoE though.

Jade Zephyr · Jun 15, 2010, 10:34 PM // 22:34

Nerf RC and WoH to appropriate levels and it will be fine.

WhiteAsIce · Jun 18, 2010, 12:35 AM // 00:35

Well, consider that Mel's Arrows is in the WS line. Incendiary Arrows is in the WS line, and it's still good, but it just requires heavy speccing into WS. Since Mel's Arrows is a WS elite, it needs to be so good that it becomes worth it to spec into WS. Also consider that means any profession would be able to use it, which is why I said to increase the energy cost to 10 to discourage other professions from using it.