Originally Posted by lursey

as everyone in gw pvp knows that, the only effective countering to an interruption is by skill canceling, interruption in itself is overpowered with ping issues which affect the fairness of pvp

the art of skill cancelling is important and it creates dynamics play versus interruption, but the problem now if too much skill cancelling will deplete your mana, causing this dynamics being obstructed and not utilized enough for drawing the ping issue fairness closer..

so the question is raised here that, what is the rationale behind of player abusing skill cancelling if it doesn't incur the cost of mana?

I find there is not.....and

I think too much cancelling will already render the player useless if they keep on standing and cancelling skills, even without the need to use mana depletion..

Originally Posted by lursey

and beside, cancel cast is not one of your 8 skills on your bar...it is a button that all other classes can use to make the game fairer....

Originally Posted by Fate Crusher

I haven't read the whole thread but I think I've read enough from this and your latest posts.

Everyone has said that you're juking rupts. Everyone has said wait for fast cast.

Faking in the backline is easy. Rits don't worry about energy management so they can cancel till FC for a whole game. Monks when cancelling are gambling with potentially 10/15 energy, big deal. As a backline, or even mid liner, you already have field observation and can identify if they're watching you and you don't need to worry about cancelling. "wasting time" cancelling is by far a lot better than losing that skill for 20 seconds. I think you forget you start faking early, so you don't "waste time" when redbars get low, even with pre protting and weapons.

In srs HA, it's always about taking the weapons first. Strip his e-management and force him to cast. This is how you win. It's easy. How does your suggestion improve this? It doesn't.


Would it be fair for rupters to use energy and recharges on skills but you can fake them out for free?

50% energy return is a funny suggestion. How about just half the energy cost of everything?

Originally Posted by lursey

do you see the problem?.. mesmer did nothing.. and you cancel cast waste 10 en just because the mesmer has that interrupt skill..

Originally Posted by lursey

to make the game fairer....

Originally Posted by lursey

it is not just +0.5 sec

Originally Posted by lursey

you know the mesmer can just stand there and lol at you cancel casting

Originally Posted by lursey

it will be fair, because the rupter can cancel cast his rupt too....

Originally Posted by floor

No i dont see a problem, good players move out of range of the mesmer, if he follows you then hes probably watching you, so u fake etc. The majority of players with a brain dont just sit there randomly faking tons of stuff and draining all their energy... Your idea basically just makes the game easier for bad players.


Note: I am quoting you slightly out of context here, but im gonna do it anyway.

The game is never unfair. Even if some builds are broken and unbalanced, those builds are equally available to you as they are to your opponent, therefore its totally fair. Theres no point making cancel casting 0e cost, or even reduced energy cost, just to accommodate bad players lol, people should just focus a bit on actually trying to improve at the game. Its impossible to fake out every interupt, but by using your brain a bit you can certainly avoid many of the key interupts that might cause you to die.



you cast a skill, cancel it at 0.25-0.5s, this draws an interupt provided you used your brain and know the mesmer is watching you, then you cast another skill. Please explain to me how this process takes longer than half a second??



Most mesmers who are watching you, when they see you try and cast, will try to interupt it. To a degree this is simply human nature. Provided the monk or whoever actually pays some attention to their surroundings and identifies that the mesmer is probably watching them, you cancel cast, and they cast an interupt + miss. GG!




Imo the ideas u posted about reducing energy cost to 0, or to 50%, are totally unnecessary. People should just try and get better at the game in order to deal with interupts. This might not be easy to do, but in order to succeed at anything in life (or in virtual life ), it always takes practise.

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LOL. Sorry for double post but this honestly made me laugh.

Originally Posted by lursey

it will be fair, because the rupter can cancel cast his rupt too....it is just giving the control back to the cancel caster than making interruption is the ultimate weapon

because your example of HA is wrong on every level that you are not using interruption, and are relying on meta and hypothesis too much, that the hypothesis can be refuted in many ways, because it is just only an assumption...that it doesn't do anything about the dynamics which is something above the 8 skills, like maps, kiting, etc.

Originally Posted by Fate Crusher

And this is where you don't know me nor do you know HA tactics. Why should I explain in detail how every player should do their job? Kiting, understanding the map and utilising weapon sets, cancelling, field observation, linebacking, snaring, watching ghost: All of this, once you reach a decent level of competency, is expected. Winning a game is not down to Kiting. Epic fail on your part buddy. You question me and tell me I should do the basics properly? A little insulting.

Its a hypothesis? Tell me this, how does one counter weapons in any other way? They cannot be stripped and anyone with a weapon will not go down, it negates SO much damage, not to mention PwK and Life are godly.

In a high ranked dogfight, the one who wins will be whoever can shutdown the weapons. Everyone is expected to do their job right, so you never blame your offensive capabilities simply because everything worth killing has been weaponed. Unless it's completely obvious, but then you're clearly not playing with high ranked players.

You keep trying to improve your ideas, but this is an example of your suggestions:
Rit will constantly cancel cast until he gets a fast cast, camping on his 40/40. Doing this does not trouble him because he's essentially using 5 energy to fake a weapon (And only 2/3 energy for 5 energy monk skills like HB and prot skills.... LOL). It means instant regen with no cost.
Ranger/Mesmer is trying to rupt said Ritualist, but because he can cancel until fast cast, he has to try to rupt fast casts and only fast casts, which are impossible unless you're lucky. More to the point, the rupter (somehow) will have SuperDuperAwesome reflexes that if he presses a rupt, he can realise the skill was faked -> choose to cancel it within the 0.25 second cast time -> be ready to try to attempt the impossible.

I don't know how to explain this to you any better, but you're essentially allowing casters to abuse this cancel system to wait for a fast cast (for free), give rupters an impossible task and then challenge their reflexes to create immaculate conceptions with their fingers (I'm talking about cancelling 1/4 rupts LOOOOOOL).

I'm done here, floor has also made some good points but it's time to move on. Its nice that people come up with these ideas, but you should really accept defeat and think of a better alternative, rather than attempt corrections to your original, basic idea.

Originally Posted by lursey

this is ridiculous, why is it a must to use an interrupt to counter weapon? that means you are only using the meta, and negating other skills possibility, there are blackout, diversion, shame, en burn, kd, other skills that affect recharge and besides, there is no fast casting for spirit, if you know the game more, obviously you have not played enough...

so if the free concept is bad, then how about the 50% en return, that you really didn't have any persuasive argument countering that.. that is cancel casting having a double cost of en plus the time spend of standing and not using the potential en when cancel casting.. changing to make cancel cast in a more viable states, then putting there, no one is using, players may as well just cast through than really use the cancel cast, because the cost of cancel casting is more than you casting through it.

as many lol you can put in your argument doesn't mean that the argument has a lot of substance...

Originally Posted by floor

Im not sure you have any idea about what your posting actually, putting it in the nicest way possible. Ofc you need interupts to shutdown weapons lol.

KD's + blackout are not even viable options, because any rit with half a brain is gonna stand quite far behind his team, just spamming weapons and dropping spirits. So for any kind of KD/blackout you would have to overextend a long way to go and get the rit = you get killed.

Diversion and shame, doesnt really shut down weapons either lol. It can prevent a rit from casting for 6 seconds. So the rit just stands there and doesnt use any energy, no big problem. Not to mention the fact that if diversion/shame get d shot, u now have NO shutdown at all = weapons up all game = you never kill = you lose.

Also why do you say "you are only using the meta", ofc people use the meta!! i mean its pretty obvious why, stuff becomes meta because its the best! not rocket science is it...



You're not seeing the bigger picture either here, lets assume now that your idea gets implemented, and canceling a skill costs 50% energy only. Monks entire bars apart from infuse/spiritbond/aegis (which u cant interupt anyway) are 5e skills, they can cancel these pretty much constantly if it only costs 2 energy to do so.

*This means a mesmer is probably going to waste 75% of his interupts on faked skills.
* This means that the mesmer is not really doing anything.
* This means that people wont take mesmers.

Your idea is silly because it would basically remove the mesmer from the game in all regards except as a spike character. Which is stupid cos the ridiculous damage/spike ability of mesmers that you can see atm was never intended, its just an unfortunate consequence of power creep.

Much like fate, im gonna stop posting here, because you dont seem to understand how guild wars works so argueing with you is just a waste of time. you cant see that you are wrong and clearly are not gonna back down.

Originally Posted by Fate Crusher

It is already viable.

Read this very carefully: your suggestion will make players abuse cancelling until they get a fast cast . Read it. Now reply to that, instead of falsely accusing everyone for not having an argument, you have never addressed any of the issues and just said we don't understand what we're talking about. Think again.

What kind of argument is patient spirit? much like you say mesmer isn't defined by rupts, a monk isn't defined by Patient Spirit. 1 sec cast guardian is what rupters look for, which is why you cancel guardian.

Go observe. For gods sake, just go observe. And stop wasting our time by trying to save face, you claim none of us have arguments and yet you hold zero credibility, since your only reasoning to both me and floor is that you think we don't know anything. We take our time to reply to each point you make and explain to you in detail what would happen if your idea gets implemented. You just carry on as if our valid points don't exist and your idea is the redeeming light in a game where you get all your skills interrupted because you're a bad player.

Learn weapon sets, learn when to cancel and stop trolling.

EDIT: I know I said I'd stop posting here but this was my last hehe. This was a better sign off

Originally Posted by urania

skill cancel has been nerfed in the past (gole cancel, for example), because it was widely (ab) used to get a fc effect 1 or 2 s casts to avoid rupts.
what you are suggesting is even funnier and by far more ridiculous than the gole cancel spam used to be. it would make more sense had you suggested to remove rupts from the game. it is often down to luck when you cant fake, as well as the interrupters connection (esp if they are a twitch rupter), but that's part of the game. there's far too many skills that need a counter in the form of a rupt. I suppose you can look forward to gw2, which will have no rupts of any sort.

but making a suggestion such as this is so completely devoid of thought that the thread should've been closed already.

i mean, seriously?

Originally Posted by Our Virus

So make the game easier for casters? Nah. I'd like it better if people just learned to position themselves better, and don't cast in a rhythm