Curse

urania · Oct 27, 2011, 03:48 PM // 15:48

Recently I've been playing CB a lot and I (would have) enjoyed it a lot too, if it wasnt for the team reshuffle after each match as well as the huge amount of people who can't tell one skill from another, let alone display any rational decisions whatsoever when it comes to tactics.

I am firmly convinced that a permanent organized arena such as cb would not only be a good preparation for GW2 5v5 pvp (after which costume brawl was made, or vice versa), but also attract a great deal of players who miss having a format that would involve both intense skirmish matches (like those of TA) as well as capping, holding, collapsing and movement, all of which are (or more like, used to be) of special importance in AB, HA and gvg. Unlike those three, costume brawl teams would be easier to organise (only 5 people needed) and would allow for exciting matches played on high skill level (unlike AB, where you are grouped with random teams, HB, where you (ab)used and relied on an AI and HA, where you have to baby sit npcs and face ganks/spikes/hexways/123 dervways round the clock).

So, to sum up some facts..the pros for a permanent cb would be:

1) A fresh competitive arena involving both simple and more complex mechanics that allow for various tactical decisions on macro level as well as important skirmish matches on micro level.

2) It's a combination of AB, TA and HB, but better - it'd attract many of the ppl disappointed by the removal of the latter 2, as well as people from other formats who wish for a more sophisticated arena without all the usual button mash the recent updates even escalated.

3) It'd keep us busy until anet makes sure gw2 will have a proper (and not, a rushed) release (and perhaps it'd keep some busy even after that).

4) An arena with such depth of play cannot be random, because randomisation takes away the very essence of it - however, it should not be returned to its original RA-style sync fest either;

5) It can be fun as hell, as long as you have team mates who actually use their brain while playing (currently a rare treat).

There are also a few (cliché) cons that speak against such an endeavour:

1) No reasources available for another new arena - but: maps are there already; making it like CA with daily skill rotations, limited skill pool and a set of rules involving profession/elite skill limitations would be perfect.

2) No point creating another new arena when GW2 is round the corner - I believe we'll be waiting for at least another half a year for it, unless they rush its release, which I hope they wont.

3) They don't care about GW anymore - but they must care about the player base, since we're potential customers.

4) The question of builds - would a predetermined bar be better than a 'limited' skill deck (read 'well-thought out' and not 'random')? in the former's case it'd take extra man power to come up with the combinations that'd reach a middle ground instead of being either OP or utter trash; the rate at which skill bars are changed would be consequently less frequent, too.

5) The question of ad-hoc match-changing decisions vs preset tactics - if teams cannot make a come back vs teams of equal skill because the format doesn't allow for match-turning decisions to have enough of an effect to break a preset tactic, then the whole format wouldn't really be worth it. but it would at least be a valuable exp they can use when tweaking gw2 5v5 arena designs.

Just my 2 cents.

p.s. I created this thread in Riverside Inn because it will get the most attention there.

urania · Oct 27, 2011, 04:21 PM // 16:21

I suggested CB be made not only permanent but also ORGANIZED - no random entering any more, so no syncing either (but could also let players enter alone and join incomplete teams inside or entering) - so basically a TA-style match entering. Syncing in 2nd accounts is a diff matter.

I honestly doubt you can call (an organized version of) CB shallow - its virtually like gvg without the npcs to baby sit and AB without the hordes of baddies that drag you down.

And yea, keep on topic, peepz.

Lordkrall · Oct 27, 2011, 04:34 PM // 16:34

Problem with this would be the fact that it would trivalize the Gamer title, since you will now be able to just farm points all year round instead of only festivals.

urania · Oct 27, 2011, 04:42 PM // 16:42

I suppose making a new title or linking glad title to it would make more sense.

Lanier · Oct 27, 2011, 04:49 PM // 16:49

Has been suggested many times in the past.

Regardless, its a good idea. I don't think it should be linked to the glad title, though. In my opinion, make it a titleless arena (but bring back gamer points during the halloween events).

CagedinSanity · Oct 27, 2011, 05:12 PM // 17:12

It would lose its novelty then, and would quickly become a deadzone like everything else.

urania · Oct 27, 2011, 05:21 PM // 17:21

If you're referring to CA ending up as a deadzone, that is largely to blame on anet for simply being - slow. Too slow (well, too late) with implementing such an arena, too slow with important tweaks, too slow with adding things that keep people going (tournaments/bragging rights list). Moreover, CA is as straightforward as TA used to be, but many prefer an arena with superior tactics than just 'Kill your opponents.'

Missing HB · Oct 27, 2011, 05:35 PM // 17:35

I agree with making costume brawl permanent being a good idea as a replacement of codex , but you know i created 2 topics in the past and nothing was done so....I don't believe enough people will care of PvP at this state of the game so that anything is done anyway...

I however got to strongly disagree with making costume brawl organized if implemented... That will be an other format completly inactive on dead hours because :
- people rather click and go in than wasting time forming
- bars aren't made for "teamplay" at first, thats the fact that you don't know what you will get and face that makes it more fun( unlike RA)...if everyone was asked to either play sin( for example), then all matchs would be mirror, and it would lead to non-fun matchs , about creepling abusing and lucky timekills...
- pugs teams would get rolled too easily by organized teams and even more by serious guild teams( note : that would be a problem on the long term only..)

I would however agree on removing the shuffling after every victory, but like i said at first we would need to make sure they read this...

Fluffy Kittens · Oct 27, 2011, 05:42 PM // 17:42

Bad idea because people would get bored quite fast and it would become dead just like other forms of PvP.
I'd rather have more players in HA and GvG than in Costume Brawl (like it is right now).

urania · Oct 27, 2011, 05:45 PM // 17:45

You even went there once? There's not that many people there, I even got restarts quite a few times once already in.

At Missing HB, some bars have greater synergy with each other than others. Best example would prolly be sin + rit (nightmare weapon is just great for the sin to use).

Kook~NBK~ · Oct 27, 2011, 06:00 PM // 18:00

This was suggested in 2010:
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/c...hlight=costume

and 2009:
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/c...hlight=costume

and 2008:
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/y...hlight=costume

Notice a pattern?

_Deals_ · Oct 27, 2011, 06:09 PM // 18:09

/notsigned, how about a mod simply close this thread since it's already been suggested multiple times already. and there is no new reason to actually bring about this back again a year later like the last 3

Skyy High · Oct 27, 2011, 08:21 PM // 20:21

Add another con: it'd get boring if it's available all the time. It's fun because it's novel, the only way to keep that up would be if they rotated builds frequently (like, once a week), which would require them to actually playtest the arena every week to get the builds balanced.

Reverend Dr · Oct 27, 2011, 08:26 PM // 20:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by CagedinSanity

It would lose its novelty then, and would quickly become a deadzone like everything else.

Unfortunately everyone who keeps making this suggestion will never be convinced of this.

Horace Slughorn · Oct 27, 2011, 08:37 PM // 20:37

I like costume brawl exactly how it is atm, with random teams and set bars.

Gli · Oct 27, 2011, 10:06 PM // 22:06

Seeing as how CB can't even get a good capacity of players at this very moment (I'm having multiple 'no team' messages between matches), I definitely don't think it'll sustain itself around the year. It seems to have lost its novelty value already, not even one week into the festival. I guess the new challenge mission might have something to do with that though.

ErrantVenture · Oct 27, 2011, 10:49 PM // 22:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gli

Seeing as how CB can't even get a good capacity of players at this very moment (I'm having multiple 'no team' messages between matches), I definitely don't think it'll sustain itself around the year. It seems to have lost its novelty value already, not even one week into the festival. I guess the new challenge mission might have something to do with that though.

That's more because of the change in the format (the move to random teams every match) than any loss in novelty.

Randomizing the teams each match drove a LOT of players away from the format because it becomes so frustrating.

Plutoman · Oct 28, 2011, 02:53 AM // 02:53

Honestly, that's a bit sad, because that's what prevents people from syncing. And that people leave because they can't sync is disappointing, to say the least..

Anyways, with the rest, it'd get boring after a while. No need to have it open year round.

Sankt Hallvard · Oct 28, 2011, 03:10 AM // 03:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gli

Seeing as how CB can't even get a good capacity of players at this very moment (I'm having multiple 'no team' messages between matches), I definitely don't think it'll sustain itself around the year. It seems to have lost its novelty value already, not even one week into the festival. I guess the new challenge mission might have something to do with that though.

Well it was suggested at one point we could have a "festival arena" open all the time basically having things like CB, DA and whatever else there is be available for 1 week then change formats. Could include things like FA, JQ and CA too.

And of course if you want CB to be less shitty it needs to not randomise teams after every game. As it is now it's only appealing to the biggest of scrubs(read: pve'ers) who lack both skill and insight. Teams still need to be random otherwise people will simply not bother to play because of the hassle of finding 4 other decent players to have a chance at winning. The random pairing makes for easy access and reduces the possibility of having one dominant team destroying everyone else and thus driving players away. Yes, there is the sync issue but even without a proper fix this problem is less than the problems we have now. (An arena open for 1 week once per year that frustrates the best players and dumbs down everyone else.)

And just a big LOL at the guy being concerned how this would "trivalize" the gamer title.

And for all those who were fortunate to read my first post in this thread before it got(expectedly) deleted: Was I right or WHAT?! I think you missed it, mr ReverendDr, but I am still interested in hearing why you find CB "shallow".

Lanier · Oct 28, 2011, 04:16 AM // 04:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sankt Hallvard

As it is now it's only appealing to the biggest of scrubs(read: pve'ers) who lack both skill and insight.

Why are your posts always arrogant and hateful towards PvEers?

Oh, and whats wrong with an arena that attracts PvEers? I was under the impression that many PvPers were trying to attract more people to PvP play.