Curse

Ensign · Mar 10, 2005, 01:46 AM // 01:46

I think you can knock off two Monks if you gear yourself specifically to do so. Chaos Storm isn't going to be reliable for this, but echo-Drain, Power Leaks, and the like are going to be pretty much required. So is spamming Malaise on everyone. Feast is kinda eh, but I guess you don't want to be taxing your Monks too much. You'd want Power Leak / Energy Drain / Malaise, Shame, Power Drain. I want to work Arcane Conundrum in there but I don't think you can get the attributes to work. Rend Enchantments is needed since you're a Necro...

Eh, basically the build you posted, though I want to cut Chaos Storm for something that will consistently hammer a Monk. Arcane Echo? Feh. Not a whole lot there.

What bugs me about this is that you're really scraping to try and wipe out the second Monk. The first one, fine, Leak/Drain/Malaise, done. For the second one, you can slap 'em with Shame, sure, but after that the tools aren't all that good. Feast is just an annoyance, Tap is slow - you'll have Malaise back up but there's a whole lot of energy in there you need to whack off. Arcane Echo on Energy Drain? That slows you down a good bit, though, you might as well just run Tap. I get the feeling that you're going to have to just hex the other Monk out, because the energy denial you want isn't there. I know a good Mesmer can knock out two Monks - there's certainly enough power to - it's just figuring out the best way to swing it.

Peace,
-CxE

Dovi the Monk · Mar 10, 2005, 02:22 AM // 02:22

this has kind of given me a new idea for a monk build
why not just go in start healing, using energy drainin skills to both annoy and gain back energy. plus with the mesmer primary u wong get as much attention as a primary monk.

mesmer/monk

1. Energy Drain - Steal 8-18 energy from target foe. This is an elite skill. (5 – 2 – 20)
2. Ether Feast - Target foe loses 5 energy. You are healed 8-24 for each point of energy lost. (5 – 2 – 8)
3. Inspired Enchantment - Remove an enchantment from target foe and gain 3-13 energy. For 20 seconds, Inspired Enchantment is replaced with the enchantment removed from target foe. (10 – 1 – 0)
4. Inspired Hex - Remove a hex from target ally and gain 3-13 energy. For 20 seconds, Inspired Hex is replaced with the hex that was removed. (5 – 1 – 0)
5. Sprit Shackles - For 8-24 seconds, target foe loses 5 energy whenever that foe attacks. (10 – 3 – 5)
6. Heal Other - Heal target other ally for 60-252 health. (15 – 1 – 30)
7. Orison Of Healing - Heal target ally for 16-67 health. (5 – 1 – 2)
8. Restore Life - Touch the body of a fallen party member. Target party member is returned to life with 26%-45% health and 42%-80% energy. (10 – 8 – 0)

healing prayers - 12
inspir. - 11 + 2
fast casting - 6 + 1

basically i can go in swinging with orisons to people who need it, with energy drain to cast the big heal other, then i can also take down enchantments, bit more useful now with all the illusionary weaponers going around, and get rid of hexs say goodbye hex'ers. if i dont find a lot of hexes i may go for a conditions removal. sprit chackles if i get in combat with a elementalist trying to kill me, work on warrios to just not as well, becuase of there adren skills.

BlackArrow · Mar 10, 2005, 02:26 AM // 02:26

You won't take down many hexes or enchantments with Inspired Hex/Enxhantment. They just turn into the hex/enchantment you removed for 20 seconds. If you want to remove hexes in the monk line, use Remove Hex. It's much efficient thatn Inspired Hex.

Spura · Mar 10, 2005, 02:52 PM // 14:52

I have been killed on a regular basis by mind wrack lately(despite charles saying it sucks). Usually I get drained by these drain, followed by malaise. Then I get hit by ether feast and energy drain regulary which always puts me from 3 to 0 energy, thus I can't cast anything and I get hit for 100+ damage every 8 seconds. I never reach more than 3 energy so I am unable to do anything while taking massive damage. Add wastrel on top of that combo and I am pretty much smoked. A lot of people in alpha have this mind wrack+drain combo now, since it counters everything but warrior and even they take hefy mind wrack damage.

Cyrus the Mighty · Mar 10, 2005, 04:42 PM // 16:42

I know the discussion has been centered around a M/N type char; but I wanted to bring up one of the best energy denial skills: Debilitating shot (assuming it hasn't been nerfed

). It's just overlooked way too often.

I think this skill is even better than power leak because it's much more likely to hit and the energy loss is spread out for your target, meaning he can't cast as many spells in between you hitting him. Use a R/N with debilitating shot and malaise; and you've got extremely good energy denial with just two skills. You could use the rest of your skills for interrupts and/or damage skills.

Draken · Mar 10, 2005, 05:27 PM // 17:27

They dont really have a counter in for energy denial i mean you can remove conditions and hex's but your screwed if they drain your energy. Some sort of tainted energy pool spell where if they cast a spell to gain energy off you it does something would be nice.

cpukilla · Mar 10, 2005, 08:20 PM // 20:20

I've been thinking about a very similar build and I have a few suggestions. First, mes/ran might actually fit you better than mes/nec. You lose malaise (an excellent skill) but there are 2 great ranger skills you can pick up. Serpent's quickness will cut your recharge times in 1/3 when you need it, so you can energy drain/tap again after just 13-14 seconds; thats better than using mantra of recovery because you can still use energy drain! Also, debilitating shot is excellent. You will be swimming in energy, and trading 10 energy is a good deal; especially when you can spam it every 4 seconds and it doesn't need any attributes.

Also, wastrels worry and especially mind wrack are PERFECT for this build. Why let your target live when you have them kept at low energy? Start spamming mind wrack and wastrels, you will get high damage from them because they cannot use any skills unless they are a warrior; even then you just get the mind wrack damage even easier. Mind wrack and wastrels are low energy but high damage and build exactly for this type of build. They are usually mediocre, but with an energy draining build they are first rate.

I would suggest going mes/ran for serpent's quickness and possibly debilitating shot. I would also recommend mind wrack and wastrels. You can still take energy drain/tap, power leak, and either burn, chaos, or echo.

My take on this character would be :

Mes/Ran similar attributes

Power Leak
Mind Wrack
Wastrels Worry
Energy drain
Energy Tap
Serpents Quickness
Ether Feast
Arcane Echo/Debilitating Shot

Possibly chaos storm orenergy burn in there somewhere. It still keeps the focus on energy but gives you more attack power to finish off the target as well. You lose malaise, but thats about it and with faster recharges on the drains it makes up for it.

Ensign · Mar 10, 2005, 08:26 PM // 20:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spura

A lot of people in alpha have this mind wrack+drain combo now, since it counters everything but warrior and even they take hefy mind wrack damage.

The combo that's winning the fight is energy denial + Malaise. They could finish you off with Ice Spear if they felt like it. Don't make a huge agency error - one on one duels are entirely about energy superiority, everything else directly follows from that.

I personally have trouble taking any dueling character that isn't a Mesmer/Warrior all that seriously.

Peace,
-CxE

walder · Mar 10, 2005, 10:26 PM // 22:26

I saw this very same idea on TGH:

Mes/Nec

15 Domination (+1/+2)
13 Inspiration (+1)
4 Fast Cast (+1)

Energy Burn
Energy Tap
Mind Wrack
Malaise
Energy Drain-E
Ether Feast
Ether Lord
Power Leak

You use skills to lower the pips of regen and then slap on Mind Wrack, finally leading up to a direct energy killing skill. Mind Wrack is somewhat spammable, and as long as you don't let the energy build up too high, almost all of your direct energy killing/stealing skills will bring your enemy to 0 energy(triggering Mind Wrack).

Mar 10, 2005, 10:33 PM // 22:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spura

A lot of people in alpha have this mind wrack+drain combo now, since it counters everything but warrior and even they take hefy mind wrack damage.

Most of the players in the alpha suck, so that isn't saying much.

[RDH]Zedicus · Mar 11, 2005, 04:48 PM // 16:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackace

Most of the players in the alpha suck, so that isn't saying much.

Well that a real useful comment. Especially on a site designed and developed by Alpha participants.

Does anyone know the effects with Mindwrack if the sufferer goes into minus energy numbers. IE opp is at 2 energy with focus item equiped, unequips focus and is now at -8. With a +4 energy regen will MindWrack trigger every sec or only if they hit the magic 0 number again?

Mar 11, 2005, 05:41 PM // 17:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by [RDH]Zedicus

Well that a real useful comment. Especially on a site designed and developed by Alpha participants.

Being that I'm an alpha myself I dont see how this is not a useful comment. People should stop thinking that alpha players are gods of Guild Wars, most of them are no better than people that play in the BWEs.

Narcism · Mar 11, 2005, 05:45 PM // 17:45

I mean, just look at Blackace... he still makes Rangers...

Mar 11, 2005, 05:49 PM // 17:49

when is the last time you've seen me with a Ranger in alpha

[RDH]Zedicus · Mar 11, 2005, 05:56 PM // 17:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackace

Being that I'm an alpha myself I dont see how this is not a useful comment. People should stop thinking that alpha players are gods of Guild Wars, most of them are no better than people that play in the BWEs.

I never said that the alpha players are Gods or that all were great players, but I still dont see how it is useful. To say that most players at anygame suck can be true if you are one of the great players but it is still not useful.

Mar 11, 2005, 06:02 PM // 18:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by [RDH]Zedicus

I never said that the alpha players are Gods or that all were great players, but I still dont see how it is useful. To say that most players at anygame suck can be true if you are one of the great players but it is still not useful.

Spura said most players in Alpha use a MW+drain combo. I and others have said that the combination is useless/bad/sucks or whatever. I said that most players in alpha suck anyway, so saying something is good because people that get to test the game use it doesn't make sense if the people testing the game arent that good to begin with. This doesnt go for all alpha players since there are some good ones, but majority are just horrible.