Curse

PhineasToke · Jun 18, 2005, 03:19 PM // 15:19

I have thououghly enjoyed the bitching in this thread and how big bad Arena Net has treated some poor souls. What it distills down to is simple; they know what you are doing at all times, and if you screw with their game world, you're busted. It's that simple. You bought a game LICENSE to play in their sandbox FOR FREE. The enjoyment of the many far outweighs the egos of a few. If you don't want to play the game straight up on an equal playing field, maybe this isn't the game for you.

Hysteria · Jun 18, 2005, 04:42 PM // 16:42

People had to deliberately quickly exit out of game to capitalize on this one. It wasn't like you could play normally by just killing the doplanger over and over again through normal play and get the xp. No matter how people want to twist this it was a clear exploit hence the way it was accomplished.

TiC · Jun 18, 2005, 04:49 PM // 16:49

I don't even understand why there is an argument here. ArenaNet's and NCSoft's word is law - period.

If you agreed to their terms (which you did if you're playing the game) and you get caught exploiting, then they have every right to kick your ass out of the game indefinitely. Says so right in their terms and rules of conduct.

Those who exploited and weren't banned should be happy that ArenaNet took the time to distinguish between those who were and were not the heavy abusers, instead of just banning everyone. I can't say I would have shown the same restraint in the same position.

Ultimately, ignorance is no excuse. The people who wanted to abuse this glitch did, and wound up getting caught and banned. Good riddance, I say.

Numa Pompilius · Jun 18, 2005, 04:56 PM // 16:56

I nominate this for "stupidestest thread evar".

For the record, it's the clearest example of an 'exploit' (as in taking unfair advantage of a design flaw or bug I've seen since the map-bug in Medal of Honor which let you hide under the ground and shoot at the enemy. If anyone, truly, is so dumb they do not realize an 'infinite exp' bug is just that, and that taking advantage of such a bug is an exploit, that's just more reason to ban them.

As for me, this only makes me respect Anet all the more.

smitty-gw · Jun 18, 2005, 05:46 PM // 17:46

Well, since I didn't get the benefits from the exploit, nor did I try to, I say sure, ban those who prospered over me.

Kuptain · Jun 18, 2005, 06:14 PM // 18:14

Players against the banning of the latest exploit seem to be arguing on 2 points.

1- "We are innocent!!!" - should read Gaile Gray's post.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

It's really important that you guys know that we didn't ban people who hit upon this exploit accidentally or who were merely trying to complete the mission. We banned people who did this intentionally and on a repeated basis. We have complete logs of everything that these players did, and it's enormously obvious who was trying to exploit the bug and who wasn't. Those who were not, and even those who were simply marginal, were not banned. If there was even the slightest question of their involvement in intentional exploitation, we left the account unbanned. In other words, only the worst abusers were banned.

If you have questions about this, you might read the EULA and the Rules of Conduct. I'm not saying that nastily, like Read the Flippin' Manual! I'm saying it because I read it myself, just today, to make sure once again that all that we were discussing was on the up and up. The RoC calls out explicitly that players should not use exploits and that there are appropriate repercussions for their use. No one undertook this exploit (sometimes dozens of times) in an "innocent" fashion.
For the good of the game, those who used the exploit -- and again, at the highest levels of abuse -- have been banned.

We're sorry it was necessary.

2- "We didn't know!!!!" cannot be justified as an excuse.

It is just like visiting a foreign country, you are responsible for knowing their laws.

eventhorizen · Jun 18, 2005, 06:23 PM // 18:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by StandardAI

PS. If you don't know the definition for entrapment, go look it up.

Yeah cos im sure a.net INTENDED all its players to find and use these bugs, so it could ban them all.

If you didnt know the defination of common sense, go look it up.

Eclair · Jun 18, 2005, 06:29 PM // 18:29

This exploit is different from the previous "bugs" because for this one you had to alt F4 out of the game at the right time.

NightStalkerXT · Jun 18, 2005, 06:47 PM // 18:47

For Christ sake I read three of the six pages of this post and some people just dont seem to get it.

First of all to those up in arms about "you don't sign a TOS/EULA when you buy the game just after you install it and stores don't take back opened software....bla bla bla" How many games have you purchased games!?! Is the TOS/EULA ever different on any of them? The wording my be slightly different but the bottom line of ALL TOS/EULA is the same! So there is simply NO EXCUSE for violating them!!! And when you get caught then all I have to say is that you will find sympathy in the dictionary between shit and syphilis!

Now for a reminder about something:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

It's really important that you guys know that we didn't ban people who hit upon this exploit accidentally or who were merely trying to complete the mission. We banned people who did this intentionally and on a repeated basis. We have complete logs of everything that these players did, and it's enormously obvious who was trying to exploit the bug and who wasn't. Those who were not, and even those who were simply marginal, were not banned. If there was even the slightest question of their involvement in intentional exploitation, we left the account unbanned. In other words, only the worst abusers were banned.

If you have questions about this, you might read the EULA and the Rules of Conduct. I'm not saying that nastily, like Read the Flippin' Manual! I'm saying it because I read it myself, just today, to make sure once again that all that we were discussing was on the up and up. The RoC calls out explicitly that players should not use exploits and that there are appropriate repercussions for their use. No one undertook this exploit (sometimes dozens of times) in an "innocent" fashion.

For the good of the game, those who used the exploit -- and again, at the highest levels of abuse -- have been banned.

We're sorry it was necessary.

I took the liberty of adding the bold text to the quote of Gaile Gray.

Celes Tial · Jun 18, 2005, 06:58 PM // 18:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theus

Think about it for a second..

When you do a quest..do you go do it again?

No.So the people who were exploiting obiviously knew they were.

Yes. Underworld and Fissure quests can be done as many times as you like. Also, beating your mirror involved a bonus goal, and in every mission before that one you most likely had to redo the mission later to get the bonus. I fully understand that some people might have done it twice to try and fulfill the bonus goal.

However, after realizing you just got 50k exp TWICE... then it becomes pretty obvious that at least that part is unintended.

TheDave · Jun 18, 2005, 07:07 PM // 19:07

I agree with banning ppls accounts for this totaly but isnt this NCSofts, and ANETS fault in the long run, i mean after u finish creating a game it shud be checked for bugs, i know u cant findd them all but this to me is a major bug and flaw in the game, y was this not taken out, although i never did this exploit i wouldnt mind ppl doin it twice maybe 3 times tops, but anymore than that deserves a ban, ppl have tried weeks and weeks to kill there mirror self, and never going back to it because it was frustrating, then u get ppl doing it over and over again to get more xp, i feel for the ppl who tried ages to kill there mirror, and i agree totally with the banning.
Also read the fine print before even doing stuff like this, RETARDS!!!!!!

Dreamsmith · Jun 18, 2005, 07:16 PM // 19:16

Hmm. I might have taken this thread more seriously if it hadn't been started by the same guy who started a similar thread on the Guild Hall after having one of his characters deleted because he was botting.

"Waa! ArenaNet won't let me cheat! How dare they?"

StandardAI · Jun 18, 2005, 07:33 PM // 19:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by NightStalkerXT

First of all to those up in arms about "you don't sign a TOS/EULA when you buy the game just after you install it and stores don't take back opened software....bla bla bla" How many games have you purchased games!?! Is the TOS/EULA ever different on any of them? The wording my be slightly different but the bottom line of ALL TOS/EULA is the same! So there is simply NO EXCUSE for violating them!!!

Sorry, after being a gamer for years you expect a certain standard in the TOS/EULA from the game you buy, You don't ban a person for using something you put in the game.

http://www.xfire.com/xf/modules.php?...e=standard ai
Of all of these games I play, only ArenaNet bans people for their own mistakes.

Luggage · Jun 18, 2005, 07:58 PM // 19:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by StandardAI

Sorry, after being a gamer for years you expect a certain standard in the TOS/EULA from the game you buy, You don't ban a person for using something you put in the game.

http://www.xfire.com/xf/modules.php?...e=standard ai
Of all of these games I play, only ArenaNet bans people for their own mistakes.

Thank god for progress.

StandardAI · Jun 18, 2005, 07:59 PM // 19:59

Alright, I'm done posting in this thread.

Inde · Jun 18, 2005, 08:02 PM // 20:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by gwden

I hope the guy who was bragging about the exploit in the other post got banned, too. See, this is why you have to share these things-- if too many people did it, ANet wouldn't ban anyone.

Disagreed (to an extent). It is in-game mechanics - as such, if there is an 'exploit', its because the game world allows it.

Its a two edged sword. Sure abusing it makes someone lame, but really, its part of the game.Personaly Im stuck in the middle - I see why developers ban it, but I also see why players do it (hey, if the game allows for it, wahoo!)

Easy-rune farming method? Should not be a ban.
Duping items? Ban.

Lasareth · Jun 18, 2005, 08:04 PM // 20:04

Of all those games you played, I think I saw about 6 hours total on online RPGs/adventure other than GW. Games with constant feedback from a large playerbase need to make changes and react as Anet has.

Anet has been, in fact, lenient, in banning only people who had no doubt of blatant exploitation of the bug.

Go play ffxi, then you'll be glad exploiters are banned in this game. (and for an added kick, try claiming Fafnir, Nidhogg or King Behemoth!)

Numa Pompilius · Jun 18, 2005, 08:05 PM // 20:05

I see that this thread continues to chart new depths of stupidity.

1) Only law-enforcement agencies can commit entrapment. Last I checked Anet wasn't one.

2) ALL exploits are "put in the game". Hacks etc are not exploits. An exploit is when you take unfair advantage of a game design flaw or bug. Exactly like in this case.

3) Is anyone seriously claiming that anyone could play the ascension quest 15 times in a row the exact same way and quitting before finishing the quest by mistake? Come on!

4) "Only ArenaNet bans people for their own mistakes". I seriously doubt that not other publishers ban people for exploiting.

What one may discuss is whether intentionally profiting from exploits is sufficiently bad that the people doing it should be banned.
It's harsh punishment, but clearly grounds for ban, and certainly worse than naming ones avatar a naughty name like Hugh G Rection.

Anet clearly runs a tight ship, and perhaps that's the only way to avoid chaos.

mfalcon80 · Jun 18, 2005, 08:44 PM // 20:44

It takes a player greater than 50 seconds to complete the ascension quest, therefore they did not obtain the bonus. Because of this they keep doing the ascension quest to try and beat their guy within 50 seconds. It is not there fault that the game kept awarding massive amounts of experience if they were only trying to get the bonus points. However if they were doing the ascension quest over and over again to gain the large amount of experience than that is wrong and they should be punished. However; is permanently banning them from the game really an appropriate punishment? Maybe they should have just docked the players two level of experience. Any thoughts?

ManadartheHealer · Jun 18, 2005, 08:46 PM // 20:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Numa Pompilius

I see that this thread continues to chart new depths of stupidity.

Sadly, I agree. People are arguing the same points even though they have already been refuted with hard evidence or simple logic