Curse

PieXags · Jul 14, 2005, 03:10 PM // 15:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dax

Honestly though, do you think they make changes to peeve people off on purpose? I mean they may have to wiegh the benefit of everyone over a few but still...

I mean they can only hope that it will help, and if it doesn't they can change it again. I guess it gives us a sense of well being and a chance to get it out of our systems, but I'm pretty sure they make changes to improve the game.

I agree that since Anet has been pretty good about communicating to the community it would be a nice to have a statement though.

You're right, and I know they don't want to piss people off.

But that's what I'm here for, to do what I can to let them know how a side of the people think so that hopefully these suggestions can be put into movement along with and in cooperation with others to make the game better as a whole. (Because I NEED something else to do in this game...)

Thanas · Jul 14, 2005, 03:11 PM // 15:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSecorsky

I don't mean to come across as flamebaiting, but after seeing Diablo basically flat out ruined because it was impossible to complete unless you had uber-everything... well, ANet needs to prevent that. Rare items should be rare. Heck, they are for me anyhow.

Seems the whining is that everyone wants everything now with minimal effort. This is and should be the wrong game for that. Besides, if you can't beat or compete without uber-items, perhaps it's not ANets fault you can't compete.

It's a game of skill, not things.

Very true, it has been re-inforced over and over that this game is skill orientated and not item based.

Aniewiel · Jul 14, 2005, 03:11 PM // 15:11

Creston, while I do not have moderator powers (darn it

), please, I am asking you for the second time, stay on topic. If you want to open a discussion about Chinese sweatshops or whatever, start a new thread. Please.

Dax · Jul 14, 2005, 03:11 PM // 15:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSecorsky

I don't mean to come across as flamebaiting, but after seeing Diablo basically flat out ruined because it was impossible to complete unless you had uber-everything... well, ANet needs to prevent that. Rare items should be rare. Heck, they are for me anyhow.

Seems the whining is that everyone wants everything now with minimal effort. This is and should be the wrong game for that. Besides, if you can't beat or compete without uber-items, perhaps it's not ANets fault you can't compete.

It's a game of skill, not things.

I think I'd be inclined to agree, though I think this thread was whether or not they should give the community a statement or not.

....but it wouldn't surprise me that's the part they are struggling to try and balance

Dax · Jul 14, 2005, 03:12 PM // 15:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by PieXags

You're right, and I know they don't want to piss people off.

But that's what I'm here for, to do what I can to let them know how a side of the people think so that hopefully these suggestions can be put into movement along with and in cooperation with others to make the game better as a whole. (Because I NEED something else to do in this game...)

I see your point

Evan montegarde · Jul 14, 2005, 03:12 PM // 15:12

The bottom line is that the nerfing has reached rediculous levels. I recently ran a couple drakes in Gates of Kyrta solo (Only killed 8 or so before I died), but I got terrible items, like 3 whites and 1 pile of gold. The other 4 dropped nothing.

I got better items from the chests I found in the mission.

What is there to stop me from doing chest runs to slowly make money, and not something that actually requires a bit of thought?

Acan Vishnu · Jul 14, 2005, 03:13 PM // 15:13

I don't think its necessary, no real testing has gone into figuring out whats going on -- so far only knee-jerk reactions have been posted about the update. I personally like it when the community can get together and figure out whats going on, whats best to do and whats not, etc. I've got a theory or two that I intend to check out more fully tonight, and I'd like to think that other people are willing to think their way through whats going on.

MSecorsky · Jul 14, 2005, 03:14 PM // 15:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thanas

Very true, it has been re-inforced over and over that this game is skill orientated and not item based.

However people's mindsets are item based, therein lies the rub. My Ranger has ascended with basically a piece of guano bow and is still moving on. While I keep my eyes open for something better, the world isn't going to stop and the sun won't go nova if I can't find that uber-gold max damage Bow of Instant Death When You Show It To The Enemy.

drizzt134 · Jul 14, 2005, 03:14 PM // 15:14

would u be happy if u could get your FoW armor in a day? i guess you would... then I think you would stop blaming ANet for their updates. Gush guys, whatta heck? Then whta re you gonan do with the game besides tellign your tales to your friends... Its a game dammit, its just a simple game... You play it for fun and in return you dont expect to get anything back. no one owes you an explanation, that's correct. no one will also not change anything for you just because u want to go in god mode from the first day, thats the other truth... game is the same game and you can still beat it with any weapons or armors you can get from loots. so stop wining please and just play the game. c u in the game...

NiGht_HaWk · Jul 14, 2005, 03:15 PM // 15:15

yeah u know, i think it would be a lot better for EVERYBODY if people made threads in the Sardelac Sanitarium about the update. We should actually try to find solutions for the problems people are having instead of just bashing them, like THX has said.

Damon Windwalker · Jul 14, 2005, 03:16 PM // 15:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aniewiel

My personal thought is as yours, Algren. I don't think that ANet owes us anything. But sometimes it is actually in -their- best interest to give a 2 line statement. "We did this, this and this. Like it or lump it."

I gotta agree.

If the game is going in a direction that I don't like (killing PvE and focusing on PvP), then I'd like to know not to waste any more time and money on it.

Not that tehre's anything wrong with PvP - but it's not my thing - I bought this for a PvE game that could actually be true multi-player, with some chance to PvP added in for a little variety. I bought 2 copies of the game (1 for me, one for my wife) so we could both play.

Now, we've all bought games that turned out to not be what we expected - so we put them on as shelf and moved on to something else. This isn't a whine about that - but I would like to know where things stand, and where they are heading.

Principa Discordia · Jul 14, 2005, 03:18 PM // 15:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aniewiel

Creston, while I do not have moderator powers (darn it

), please, I am asking you for the second time, stay on topic. If you want to open a discussion about Chinese sweatshops or whatever, start a new thread. Please.

I do have those powers, Creston's rants/flamebait have been deleted.

Quote:

Originally Posted by NiGhT_HaWk

yeah u know, i think it would be a lot better for EVERYBODY if people made threads in the Sardelac Sanitarium about the update. We should actually try to find solutions for the problems people are having instead of just bashing them, like THX has said.

Quoted for truth.

EmperorTippy · Jul 14, 2005, 03:18 PM // 15:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acan Vishnu

I don't think its necessary, no real testing has gone into figuring out whats going on -- so far only knee-jerk reactions have been posted about the update. I personally like it when the community can get together and figure out whats going on, whats best to do and whats not, etc. I've got a theory or two that I intend to check out more fully tonight, and I'd like to think that other people are willing to think their way through whats going on.

I have tested Nolani Academy, Divinity Coast and Gates of Kryta. The nerfing is inline with the posts on this forum. As for the economy what would be an acceptable test I would be glad to attempt it. I have tried out a few theriores even going so far as to attempt to solo Hells Precipice wth my best farming build (I killed the first 2 groups of Titians) I got nothing. I personaly never new that Hells Precipice was a farming spot so the changes apear to be global. (May well be a mistake in the update).

Damon Windwalker · Jul 14, 2005, 03:20 PM // 15:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by drizzt134

would u be happy if u could get your FoW armor in a day? i guess you would...

Nope - but I don't want to spend 5 years on it either. There has to be a realistic balance.

I think that one thing that ANet needs to realize is that (at least on the PvE side) they have created a world - with an economy, with laws of supply and demand, and tampering with it carelessly can lead to a depression.

Reduce the number of drops, and the amount of gold I can get - fine! But I want my Fissure armor someday! I'm not a pro farmer - I'm not one of the people who say they can farm 10k per hour - heck, I don't think I've ever even had over 10k - it's not greed or anything fior me - it's practicality....

silvertemplar · Jul 14, 2005, 03:22 PM // 15:22

Quote:

When the game was released, that first week, I thought it was awesome. It's been downhill ever since. Boss nerfs. drop nerfs. rune nerfs. area nerfs. more area nerfs. enchantment hate all over the maps, to try to combat botting (laughable). more area nerfs. more area nerfs. more area nerfs. more area nerfs. Are you getting my gist?

Reading that sentence , Anet is literally screaming "Stop your UltimaOnline/Everquest PvE antics , go PvP ".

Now i just wonder, if we look purely at PvP..does the "going downhill" still apply? I don't see any threads criticising PvP-core mechanics specifically [only criticism stems from either PvE related unlocking of stuff or are actually fixed/updated very fast ].

Quote:

They say "you'll get better loot playing the game normally".

Maybe "normally" = PvPing with limited PvEing to familiarise yourself with a build and the various skills. Really, i think someone should define what GWs definition of "normal" play is , something tells me PvP owns the LARGER part of "normal play" than PvE.

Quote:

Anet said, quite awhile back, that they would look into "allowing people to unlock / gather these items through normal course of play".
Really? Where are these miraculous quests then that now give you enough gold to buy a decent armor, or a half decent weapon?

I wouldnt be surprised if they meant through PvP. If we can't unlock all armor/weapons via PvP already then i'm sure that we eventually will be able to.

Algren Cole · Jul 14, 2005, 03:23 PM // 15:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damon Windwalker

Nope - but I don't want to spend 5 years on it either. There has to be a realistic balance.

I think that one thing that ANet needs to realize is that (at least on the PvE side) they have created a world - with an economy, with laws of supply and demand, and tampering with it carelessly can lead to a depression.

Reduce the number of drops, and the amount of gold I can get - fine! But I want my Fissure armor someday! I'm not a pro farmer - I'm not one of the people who say they can farm 10k per hour - heck, I don't think I've ever even had over 10k - it's not greed or anything fior me - it's practicality....

if you've never had over 10K why are you even contemplating purchasing fissure armor??? you're about 300K short.

Dax · Jul 14, 2005, 03:26 PM // 15:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Algren Cole

I had no participation in the creation of this game.
I have no participation in the continued efforst of ArenaNet to update the game
I had no input, no contribution, none of my time was spent building this game

I paid only 50 bucks....and I will never again pay any MORE money to play this game.

ArenaNet doesn't owe me an explanation for why they are doing things....they don't owe you one either.

Thats the thing, they really don't need to explain everything. If I decide to stop playing they are not losing out on my money.

I'm probably on the side of this game needs to be better balanced. If next year the new update comes and I hear that it has become another diablo I'd probably not spend money on it.

Though they have set a precedent of responding to the community so I can understand people's concerns

Evan montegarde · Jul 14, 2005, 03:31 PM // 15:31

Anet has tried to fix the PVP/PVE balance, but failed, if you ask me. If the game is infact skill based and not an endless grind (like the oh so evil other MMOs), why do I have to grind forever to get enough faction for 1 rune, or to gather unidentified armor to unlock runes?

I always thought the point of GW from the betas, previews, etc was to have an awesome PVP component with international tournaments, strategy needed for teams, etc. On the surface they've succeeded here, PVP at higher levels (Team Arena, GVG, Tombs) is a great way for people to battle it out and actually know what they're doing. The other side was the PVE, which was good. For a while.

The PVP weapons PVP characters chose from are good weapons with good base mods. Why should any joe schmo have access to that from the get go but a PVE character has to grind for hours to get a similar weapon? And the chances of that happening are now very small, unless they get a collector weapon. Collector weapons are the single saving grace of PVE's nerfing, if you ask me, because I can still get a +15% bow. Even if it still requires grinding, although less than any other way.

Borealis · Jul 14, 2005, 03:34 PM // 15:34

If I wanted a "pvp" experiece playing against real people I wouldn't be playing this game, I've got 4 RP chars. created and don't have the interest for pvp at the moment. I bought a RP game so I could play a RP game,

Heh....300k for fissure armor? What dream world are you living in? You're about a million or two off from the actual cost of it. If I'm correct in needing 105 ecto for a full set you're looking at over a million right there....

Damon Windwalker · Jul 14, 2005, 03:41 PM // 15:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Algren Cole

if you've never had over 10K why are you even contemplating purchasing fissure armor??? you're about 300K short.

Wow - thanks for the brilliant insight.

As I said - I hate farming. I have been concentrating on gameplay. But at some point, when I have exhausted the gameplay, that is the only remaining objective.

I thought I made that rather clear?