Curse

OverlordTyrael · Aug 25, 2005, 12:41 AM // 00:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithie

This is why you need to post these items on auction places on forums like this one. I would easily pay 5k for that flamberge, maybe more.

Sucks, don't it?

I would easily pay 700k for that flamberge, seeing as it has impossible stats...

Numa Pompilius · Aug 25, 2005, 01:08 AM // 01:08

And there goes another thread off the rails. God, I hate nitpickers.

Xanatos786 · Aug 25, 2005, 01:37 AM // 01:37

Quote:

IMO the problem isn't inflation, it's mudflation.

It's just that the people complaining about inflation want a gold max perfect everything storm bow, eternal shield, chaos axe, or fellblade (because they LOOK good). Nothing else. And they want it cheap.

I wholeheartedly agree with this, and I want to split my response in two, half to address the "perfect only" argument and half to address the "cheap" argument. First, let me ask a question. What's the difference between a +29 and a +30 fortitude mod? I mean, in this game, 1 hit point really doesn't matter. And yet a +30 can easily sell for 20K more than a +29...why? For that matter, why is a 14-27 bow hideously worse than a 15-28 with the same mods? The answer is it's not...I think there's an epidemic of high level/maxed players selling unnecessarily powerful stuff in low level areas. Back when I was a new player just starting out in post-Searing Ascalon and Yak's Bend, I couldn't sell any of the gold, modded weapons that I got as drops because they weren't max damage, and as soon as I showed them to a potential buyer, I got flamed...you don't need a max, perfect weapon in low level areas. I realize it's none of my business how other PvEr's play, but considering that Anet clearly intends trade and business to be a serious aspect of the game, it's really annoying and offputting until you get to the toughest areas in the game (which give crap drops now that they've mostly been nerfed).

Addressing the second point...here's a true story. I once got a gold wingblade drop...max dmg, 11 swordsmanship, dmg +12% hp>50, enchantments last 15% longer. I had people flame me for asking 20K for it. Someone actually had the balls to offer me 1.5K. I finally managed to sell it to someone for 38K. I don't really have much of a point with this story, other than it's germane to what Numa is trying to say and it really, really pissed me off...

Larry the Hippo · Aug 25, 2005, 02:09 AM // 02:09

as someone who has made around 500k selling and buying, i would have to say the problem is you, not the economy. example: gold max fire staff, +56 life, improves cast 8%. now, by your logic, this would go for little, maybe not even 10k since it is not perfect. FACT: i sold it for 40k 3 days ago.

heres another example, max flamberge, with something like +7 armor vs physical and some other not-so-great stat(it was blue). going by what was stated here, it would go for 1, maybe 1.5k. sold for 5.5k. i could go on.

as for my selling ethics(which i fear may come into question), i DO NOT do bidding(or in other words possibly jack up prices with fake bids), and i do not even ask for offers.

Xanatos: this is a game played with real people, which opens the door for people to be assholes. dont complain about "getting flamed" for trying to sell something, it will happen no matter what you sell no matter where you are.

Xanatos786 · Aug 25, 2005, 02:56 AM // 02:56

Gee, Larry, too bad I've made 300K in two months of this game, currently have 122K in my account, that's after 15K armor, black and silver dye, gold and purple weapons, etc etc...

You wanna play a game of brag? Fact: I bought a silver dye for 1.5K at the height of the stock boom (when silver was trading at 7 plat) and black dye for 11. Sold them both for 23K. Fact: I sold a Mursaat Hammer, 18-34 req 8, dmg while hexed, for 20K, after getting moron offers of 500g for it. None of what you write impresses me. I can play the economy as well as most, that doesn't mean I think it isn't broken. In fact, what's even the point of your "examples?" Am I supposed to be impressed or something? Because I'm not...

There is absolutely no reason why anyone should be sending me editorials about my prices. Disagree with what I want for an item? Don't buy it. There's no reason why I should put up with that kind of crap...I bought this game to have fun, not to have people who sound like 8 year olds harass me. Why shouldn't I complain about it?

Savio · Aug 25, 2005, 03:08 AM // 03:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larry the Hippo

heres another example, max flamberge, with something like +7 armor vs physical and some other not-so-great stat(it was blue). going by what was stated here, it would go for 1, maybe 1.5k. sold for 5.5k. i could go on.

+7 is perfect, I thought. That would have come from a gold sword then. But that aside, nobody said that you had to have max damage items. Close to max doesn't count either. We're talking about lower level items, the blues and purples.

Xanatos, I hear ya, but this isn't the thread for it. Just drop the subject, ignore Larry.

Sayshina · Aug 25, 2005, 03:22 AM // 03:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dax

That's the part thats broken, no one is interested in midlevel items. Why buy them? Everyone only cares about certain items.

If in fact there were some level restrictions on things there'd be a more robust economy.

Hey everyone says they don't wanna grind, collect items, or worry about levels and this is what they get. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

The problem with your analogy is that we never got our cake. Where is that damned cake?

There are lots of examples of broken issues in the economy. Try trading off that Mesmer sup rune for an essentialy equal Monk sup? Not very likely. It's not because Mesmers are junk, they actualy do very well PvP, and better than many think in PvE. You can blame the total lack of availability of Monk runes at any price on the 105/55 keebler elves running around, but not the cost disparity.

How about selling dye's? I wouldn't bother to dye anything, and would sell it all off if was worth anything at all. I only started dying my crap because there wasn't any other use for it.

This economy is broken down into 2 catagories, those items that command a rediculous price and everything else. It's all Ferrari's and Yugo's. Never mind finding a Porsche, I'd settle for a few Toyota's. Economies like this one are not really sustainable. Unlike real life, the have-nots tend to just go away.

Savio · Aug 25, 2005, 03:30 AM // 03:30

Mesmer runes vs Monk runes is a bad argument Sayshina. More people play Monks than Mesmers, partly because of the 105/55 build, party because beginning players think they're weak.

Dyes are a gold sink, and they let players individualize. If you sold to other players, you could get a more decent price than the dye trader.

And the "cake" is the mudflation of maxed out weapons.

Arturo02 · Aug 25, 2005, 03:40 AM // 03:40

Inflation is a different animal in GW. There won't ever be a point where everything is above most people's means to buy them.

The way we get money in the game will always be something that increases. We can go out and get gold anytime. In rl your wages often will not keep pace with rising prices.

This is going to be a huge problem for people in the next 20 years in rl. In the game, we never have to worry about it. That I am thankful for.

SOT · Aug 25, 2005, 03:46 AM // 03:46

If someone cannot afford the best of the uber god wept best, then they are either not saving their gold, not selling to the player rather than the undercut merchant, or they are lying through their addle brained teeth.

I got a max damage weapon. I KEPT it. I did not continue spending my gold on whatever it is people seem to be spending it all on.

SAVE, and see how much of the economy is shoddy for you.

And no, telling me that 100k items are the problem is not in line with my statement. The items are there, to drop, if you look. You can find them from decent players for REASONABLE prices, and a good place to look is in the trade section of these very forums.

Stop bitching and take the reigns of your game back into your own choices and be cognizant of those choices, and stop blaming a phanton issue.

Warskull · Aug 25, 2005, 03:52 AM // 03:52

The key to the Guild Wars economy is stupidity. The whole thing is fueled by stupidity. On a PvE character you can get by with practically anything. People have no clue what the value of things really are. They are obsessed with getting a "perfect" item so they can own everything. The thing is anything works fine, grab any max damage sword (even a white one) and you are fine. The real damage output comes from skills and the best items are almost all available from collectors (20/20s.) To fix the guild wars economy something to normalize prices and provide a marketplace for intelligent players to trade efficiently in is necessary. Ask anyone and they will tell you trading is like being in the center of the world's largest special ed class.

SOT · Aug 25, 2005, 05:23 AM // 05:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warskull

The key to the Guild Wars economy is stupidity. The whole thing is fueled by stupidity. On a PvE character you can get by with practically anything. People have no clue what the value of things really are. They are obsessed with getting a "perfect" item so they can own everything. The thing is anything works fine, grab any max damage sword (even a white one) and you are fine. The real damage output comes from skills and the best items are almost all available from collectors (20/20s.) To fix the guild wars economy something to normalize prices and provide a marketplace for intelligent players to trade efficiently in is necessary. Ask anyone and they will tell you trading is like being in the center of the world's largest special ed class.

[/signed]

burai · Aug 25, 2005, 07:37 AM // 07:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shagsbeard

Guild wars is not a game about collecting gear.

It's not for you, but it is for others. There are items in the game, and almost a trading system - hence part of the game is certainly about collecting items. The NPC collectors also hint that collecting is part of the game - or can be if that's what you want.

The game is about what floats your boat. For some it's all about standing in front of a frog all day and chanting 'frog'

My boat just sank, Still, I needed a better one anyway - oohh! maybe a gold one this time!

Xanatos786 · Aug 25, 2005, 10:35 PM // 22:35

Quote:

The key to the Guild Wars economy is stupidity. The whole thing is fueled by stupidity. On a PvE character you can get by with practically anything. People have no clue what the value of things really are. They are obsessed with getting a "perfect" item so they can own everything. The thing is anything works fine, grab any max damage sword (even a white one) and you are fine. The real damage output comes from skills and the best items are almost all available from collectors (20/20s.) To fix the guild wars economy something to normalize prices and provide a marketplace for intelligent players to trade efficiently in is necessary. Ask anyone and they will tell you trading is like being in the center of the world's largest special ed class.

Well it's these stupid people that help me make money

Sayshina · Aug 25, 2005, 10:59 PM // 22:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Savio

Mesmer runes vs Monk runes is a bad argument Sayshina. More people play Monks than Mesmers,...

Dyes are a gold sink, and they let players individualize. If you sold to other players, you could get a more decent price than the dye trader.

If you have the patience to hang out spamming sales adds for red dye, which will still get you butkis, more power to you. Tell me, have you managed to sell a yellow for anything near enough to justify holding onto it?

The Mo vs. Me MIGHT possibly have a point. But my primary point was that there are a few items worth money, and everything else is worth NOTHING. They don't just have a low value, they're worthless. You can't sell a sup mes rune. People won't buy them if you offer them for 50g. You can't sell a sup necro rune either. In fact, there are 87 runes in the game. The 5 monk sup's have value for now, but I wouldn't count on that lasting much longer. Swords, absorb, fire, air, vigor, and major absorb and vigor are the ONLY runes worth anything. And it's not like most of them are worth all THAT much either.

Non-maxed items are worth whatever the trader will give you for them. Some maxed items are worth a little bit, a very few are worth any real cash. And in any case you must spend more time trying to sell the damned thing than it would have taken to farm that much gold running say birds.

The economy is broken because there is no middle ground. There is only the top and everything else. And everything else equals trash.