Curse

Sentinel · Jun 28, 2005, 07:51 PM // 19:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mormegil

Even in PvE you'll find monk templates.

1- Noob Healer (opposite of the boon healer).

This guy will overheal you in the first ten seconds of the fight to show he's good. You'll lose 20 life and be healed for 80-100 hp every time. The problem is, he'll run out of mana sooner or later. When that happens, your whole group will be gang-banged horribly, and no-one will ever know what happened, because the monk will come up with something like "I was backfired", "cant stand those friggin mesmers" and so on.

I have done that in more than one occasion. But I'm not doing it to show off.
I'm trying to convice the tankers to not use their little worthless healing signet in the middle of a fight just because they lost a 1/5 of their health. It's my way of telling him.."I've got you dude...just keep on hacking and don't worry about a thing"

But when the whole group is in trouble I go into energy conservation mode and use my spells as efficiently as I can. But then it's when you have to deal with the other thing. Luck of trust.

I let people drop in health so that my next spell's points get all used up as efficiently as possible but people start panicking and run around scared or using there own secondary heals instead of focusing on their jobs.
But that doesn't bother me too much. Trust is earned and if a group sticks together for more than 1 mission, people learn to trust me as I do them.

Speaking about noob/absent minded/not elite monks...lol...
Yesterday I was getting ready to do Elona's with this group that was asking for a monk. I finished a couple of secondary quests in the desert just prior to that where I was using my Els skills along with henchies. Redeployed my atts
and took my normal healer skills (or so i thought) and off we went.
Well, the mission starts and the 2 Ws manage to aggro every "mad cow" in the map at once. We managed to some how survive with only one casualty.
That's when I realised I didn't bring a rez with me

I mean isn't that the most appauling thing you ever heard in this game..."A monk without a rez??"
I felt terrible and I apologized several times and the group was very nice about it. I thanked them for their understanding and on we went to beat the map....ahhh...on the second time.... where the noob monk had the right skills...lol

Sent.-

Stark Ravin · Jun 28, 2005, 08:01 PM // 20:01

Hehehe... The first thing I tell any PUG, "Stay offensive... I got your back." Once we reach our first confrontation as I'm watching the health meters the tanks will start getting down a quarter of the way and they'll pop back up to full without me doing anything... It's almost like some of thes players out there have never played with a monk before.

JoDiamonds · Jun 29, 2005, 05:20 PM // 17:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZigZag Rollmeister

Having read some of the earlier posts here.....I find it incredibly hypocritical that the monks here would flail people for typing "Heal plz"....or "Res Plz".

You monks should know as well as anyone how many idiot newbs are out there aggroing multiple groups on missions. In fact, many of you have documented that in this very thread.

Seriously....doing missions with other players involves a certain level of anxiety since it seems like almost every group has at least ONE BAD NEWB.
(( yelling snipped ))

Of course not all healers are experts.

But it's fairly pointless to request healing, anyway. By the time it's really necessary, you are either getting it or you are going to die. If you think you are in serious danger (this is especially true for all caster classes), you should already be running. When my Elementalist primary starts getting beat on, it's time to hoof it, not request healing.

If you have ways to take care of yourself, you should know when to use them. Protection should always be used early, of course, and every class has some kind of self protection. If you are the only warrior getting seriously hurt, the healer probably has you covered. But if the party is getting thrashed, it might be time to run or use your own emergency healing, if you have some.

JoDiamonds · Jun 29, 2005, 05:28 PM // 17:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZigZag Rollmeister

Actually, I've never once asked for a heal. My problem here is that this thread makes it sound like all monks are good players, and it's simply not true. So you can't expect everyone to say : "OMG it's a monk, he MUST know what he's doing? And when my health is almost at zero, while everyone elses havent even budged from full, then we'll just assume that our beloved monk is paying attention and heals me before I die. (On the next hit)"

If you are one hit away from dying, there's no point in asking for a heal. It's too late. Heals aren't instant, and likely the healer is in the middle of something anyway

Quote:

Are you trying to tell me that monks never get distracted in battle and stop looking at health bars for a few seconds?

Sure they do. What do you hope to accomplish by chatting?

It is definitely insulting to tell someone to do what they know they should already be doing, especially in a selfish, "don't let me die!" manner.

If two healers are working things out, fine. If the leader is trying to give some kind of direction, fine. But saying, "heal plz" doesn't accomplish anything useful. At the least, as a healer, I'd actually prefer you ping your life. At least that's merely informing, rather than demanding or requesting something. It leaves open the idea that the healer can figure out what to do themselves -- and sometimes the right thing is to let you die so that others may live.

Whenever an elementalist starts taking massive damage and the rest of the group is in danger, the elementalist usually dies. I'd rather heal the warrior, because it will actually save him. The elementalist is dead anyway.

Storn · Jun 29, 2005, 05:41 PM // 17:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Creston

One of the most important abilities for a monk is energy management.

When the battle begins, your 4 pips of energy regen aren't doing anything, assuming you are full of energy. So cast something.
Healing breeze on the warrior or something. Or a protection spell, if you have one.

10 energy down, your pips start working, the warrior is not an issue for ten seconds (provides he's not gettin ganked by 7 ataxes

), and by the time it's finished your energy is almost back up to full.
Creston

I overheal, but I do so with my 5 pt energy Heals, which I have 3 of in my bar. I overheal on purpose, you never know when someone is going to get hit right before they get your heal. I would rather keep everyone topped off as much as possible instead of scrambling. Good tankers make my job much easier as if only one or two folks are getting pounded, this lets me concentrate on them.

But in the early seconds, Seed of Healing goes out to a warrior or whoever is tanking or taking the most damage.

Mid fight, between the wee 5 pt heals, which like Dwayna' Kiss can add up to big pts when it stacks on enchantments, I look for anyone who slips under 50%, they get the whopping 161 pts of heal from Heal Other.

I rarely, RARELY have energy problems. I can toss 5 pt heals for a long, long time. I also carry the Healing Sig, which is slow, but by the time it goes off, I have another 5 pts to throw Dwayna's Kiss.

Dom Demonic · Nov 29, 2005, 05:22 PM // 17:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Episodicfreak

Nice

I think I'll adopt the same. I guess a lot of monks aren't the same as me, but I'll admit that I've got a hot temper, and unfortunately it comes through too fast. But I'll start to do that instead of being mean now. You may have saved some people's /death tallies...

Thanks so much for your words of advice. I too have been subject of the same verbal badgering. All to often I would take it personally and threaten to leave the game...God love my boyfriend for supporting me and telling me that dying party members were not my fault.

I love my monk and the power she posesses. Now I simply turn a deaf ear on the critisim that comes from those that do not know any better, to consider the source and go on.

Griff Mon · Nov 29, 2005, 05:57 PM // 17:57

As I am bringing a monk along and expect to be in Lions Arch in the next day or two, I look forward to having some of these experiences you are sharing. Most of my time is as a warrior, and I never ask for anything, politely wait for rez, and may announce I'm dead after the battle is over.

The abuse of monks is something I rarely see, but I have seen a lot of monks leave the party before we get going, in the middle of battle, or once when he realized we were going to FoW instead of Underworld - and yes we were already in FoW less one monk.

I'll see how it is when I am healing for idiots. Right now I just use henchies.

JMFD · Nov 29, 2005, 06:12 PM // 18:12

help for 5 people

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jibikao · Nov 29, 2005, 07:59 PM // 19:59

As sad as it sounds, when there is "healer" in the game, that healer instantly becomes the MOST important thing. I've played so many RPG games and you always need at least one healer in the party.

I've made a few threads about this. Personally, I think Healer ruins the balance of the game but it's just my opinion.

I am sure most of you have played D2. I love D2 because there's not much healing in the game except for healing potions. Every class has equal chance to heal and deal great damage without worrying being shut down by a healing freak. That's one aspect of D2 I love but of course D2 has a lot of flaws. lol It's just an example why having a true healer can ruin the balance of the game.

I still don't think GW is as BALANCED as most of you think. Monk is still the most important aspect of the game because Monk is useful in ANY situation whereas some builds may not be useful in certain situations. Healing can cover a lot of mistakes and become the most annoying thing in the game.

I think the biggest problem we have in Guild Wars is not enough counters to Monks. We need more enchantment stripping skills. Every class should have one IMO. We have enchantment removal skills but all of them have very long recharge time, whereas Monk's protection spells are super quick, cheap energy cost and highly effective.

Oh well, I have nothing against Monks. I can harrass them long enough for my team to win.

Esprit · Nov 29, 2005, 09:05 PM // 21:05

I think it would be useful to have healing potions in the game. As it would cut down on the necessity of a monk.

If you need a monk, especially later in the game, whisper them to see if they are interested. Do NOT do blind invites, because most monks (and other players too) will become more disinterested in group with you.

I whispered a monk to join my group for Thunderhead, and the player joined soley because I asked before inviting.

sybban · Nov 30, 2005, 02:44 AM // 02:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tarrant

Now that I've gotten to the upper levels in PvE (ascended, etc.), everywhere I go it's "group seeking monk" and "need monk" and "looking for healer" while most others go begging. They're very useful, of course, but there's just something wrong when the game turns into a grab-a-monk contest. I've seen groups wait 20 minutes trying to get a monk. It's to the point now I just grab 7 henches and go; I'm sick of the whole group-forming scene as it has become. I'm bringing up a monk of my own, so it's not like I'm anti-monk. And yes, this problem or something similar crops up in most online games of this sort. But are there some fundamental elements of player psychology that developer after developer fails to account for? Or do they just not care if supply-and-demand issues clog up group-forming?

Probably because Mhenlo is dumb. The Protection monk isn't that great by herself either. I tend to go all henchman or all people. They don't mix very well. If you have all henchmen then everyone listens. If you have 1 healer hench and 6 idiots, then AI is trying to figure out why everyone is attacking someone different and doesn't know who to prioritize.

twicky_kid · Nov 30, 2005, 02:52 AM // 02:52

my solution: henches ok? sure. invite, invite, walk out of town.

i have died on most mission 5x faster from having a real monk then the henches.

borkbork · Nov 30, 2005, 02:55 AM // 02:55

Yeah.. I don't know why people waste hours looking for a real monk. Most (more like 99% of) PvE monks are horrible...

Mhenlo + Lina do the job quite well.

Xenrath · Nov 30, 2005, 11:20 AM // 11:20

This has been raised in the another similar thread, but monks probably get more criticism than any other class as well (I've one too) As mentioned above, it does essentially boil down to watching some red bars moving left and right and sometimes changing colour. After a while you want to do something else

burai · Nov 30, 2005, 12:25 PM // 12:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by borkbork

Most (more like 99% of) PvE monks are horrible.

I suspect that this applies to all the other professions as well. IMHO you are just confirming the view that when things don't go to plan - it's always the monk that's to blame.

Just maybe it's down to the 99% of horrible non-monks.

Storn · Nov 30, 2005, 01:37 PM // 13:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gedscho

when i play a monk i always say thank you to a tank that knows how to keep aggro off the squishies.

Me too. And I also praise a well timed, well placed, AoE spell if I see it. Often, like many have said, I'm watching the health bars... so I miss stuff that is being typed.

One trick is to compliment early in the mission. Give people a nice feeling and then it is reciprocated. Also, you set the tone early, most folks will respond... defenses between players goes down a bit, communication goes up.

I've had absolutely awesome PUGs at times... as well as the disasters. But treat folks the way you want to be treated. Karma is very powerful in Guild Wars... I respect it.

mishop · Nov 30, 2005, 02:40 PM // 14:40

I made a primary monk to help out my guild. Needless to say, I don't have a problem when I want to join a group. I enjoy monking but I agree with a lot of the comments I've seen in this thread. I'd like to add a couple and apologize if I'm repeating anyone:

- Henchmonks are excellent, they heal and protect very well. However, they currently have a little trouble in the late missions. The henchmonks have a tough time in fire islands because they don't run away from the seal energy degen. They are also not very good at staying out of the aggro area.

- Monks are not necessary, but they allow the player base in pve to make unbalanced characters. Without monks, the non-monk players would need to be more intelligent with their skill and attribute selection. Essentially, monks bring the other characters quality down by allowing them to make fragile, heal-needing builds.

That being said, I also felt bad last night waiting for my guildies at abbadon. As a monk, I got 8 invites in the first minute I arrived and watched people desparately fight over monks for at least 15 minutes. The henchmonks aren't very helpful there because of the degen seals.

Loch · Nov 30, 2005, 03:21 PM // 15:21

When I'm doing a fire-island mission and I feel like PuGing instead of henching the whole thing, here's how I get a decent group:

1.) Invite Mhenlo and Lina
2.) Advertise my Group Looking For request and specifically state I'm using monk henchies

There, now any half-decent player who's sick of waiting for monks can join me. The only ones to join will be those who understand that monk henchies actually work.

quickmonty · Nov 30, 2005, 03:26 PM // 15:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenrath

This has been raised in the another similar thread, but monks probably get more criticism than any other class as well (I've one too) As mentioned above, it does essentially boil down to watching some red bars moving left and right and sometimes changing colour. After a while you want to do something else

Couldn't wait to complete the game. Now my monk just farms and the only red bar I have to worry about is my own.

Zephyr Jackson · Nov 30, 2005, 03:55 PM // 15:55

i am personally a monk, i was being yelled at because i could not heal a guy fast enough because he was standing in Seige range attaking a Stone Summit.

We had 2 monks, the other was a lvl 10. gg nubs