Curse

Kabale · Jan 05, 2006, 10:41 AM // 10:41

I've been wondering what it's like in the PvE world.. I basically stopped playing PvE completely after the AOE nerf which was a pretty long time ago. I didn't participate in either Halloween/Xmas events...mostly because I'm fed up with the bad quality of the average player in PvE.

But anyway, I've got a question for monks in particular. A while back it was discovered that using Zealot's Fire (even at 0 smiting) would scare off anything trying to attack you...Does anyone actually do this? It could work for any /Mo softie like nukers, etc... to basically remain untouched... I dunno.

Defender Of Orth · Jan 05, 2006, 11:44 AM // 11:44

So would symbol of wrath, or any other AoE that only works from around you.

Keyote · Jan 05, 2006, 12:48 PM // 12:48

The quality of PvE players is still just as bad. Even at the highest level many players have no idea what they're doing and cant follow simple instructions.

Drops are so bad that recently even the most difficult areas dont give you max damage white weapons. Anet seems to have only 1 direction at the moment, to make all random loot useless.

They did a great job on the xmas content. Everything else is basically the same as it was.

Kabale · Jan 05, 2006, 12:53 PM // 12:53

Geez I would have expected them to change the AoE nerf for it to make more sense...I.e. if a monster is standing in an area where a *considerable* amount of damage is being made, then he should move...but if it's only a little then would you care if you're in AoE? So much for realism if you ask me.
If they did this then stuff wouldn't scatter all over the place from things like Firestorm and Ignite arrows... it's just plain silly to have them disperse like that. Ugh.. I wouldn't mind a bit of PvE in the high end areas but seriously what's the point if you're not into the cosmetics cos that is what seems to be the only thing left for 90% of GW players.

Keyote · Jan 05, 2006, 12:55 PM // 12:55

Yeah I expected them to do something as well. The just left it as it is, and it hasn't done much except make many people delete their eles.

Willy Rockwell · Jan 05, 2006, 01:05 PM // 13:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keyote

The quality of PvE players is still just as bad. Even at the highest level many players have no idea what they're doing and cant follow simple instructions.

LOL, I hate it when some moron starts issuing "simple instructions." You see this now in the 5 man groups forming to farm IDS, they ask you to list your skills and then order changes. Exercise your need to dominate others within your guild, if they will put up with it. The rest of us don't have to.

Keyote · Jan 05, 2006, 01:12 PM // 13:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Willy Rockwell

LOL, I hate it when some moron starts issuing "simple instructions." You see this now in the 5 man groups forming to farm IDS, they ask you to list your skills and then order changes. Exercise your need to dominate others within your guild, if they will put up with it. The rest of us don't have to.

Huh?

I'm not talking about telling people what to do with their skill bar, I said simple instructions. Things like stop to regen, drawing on the map for people who dont know the way, calling targets etc.

If nobody does that and everyone in the group just runs around with no direction, well good luck with that...

Auntie I · Jan 05, 2006, 01:20 PM // 13:20

Personally I've always found the attitude of PvP players worse that PvE.

I'm not sure what problem you have had with the AOE changes but my Ele is doing just fine and still enjoys using Fire Magic to "punish the evil monsters"

Any of the PBAOE skills are effective for causing mobs to run away. Standing in your own Firestorm or Maelstrom work too, since the mobs won't enter. The scattering works on a percentage basis. A certain percentage of the time a particular skill will cause a mob to run away. From my observations each skill has a different percentage and each Mob has a modifier that makes them more or less likely to move. In other words not everything will run away everytime you use a AOE skill. Not every AOE skill causes the same scattering effect. I do think that some of the AOE skills are a bit too sensitive and should be toned down. Ignite Arrows comes to mind. Mobs seem to react a bit too much for a relatively minor addition of damage. It's possible that Arenanet needs to look at individual skill and tweak them but generally the reaction to AOE is appropriate.

Dazzen · Jan 05, 2006, 01:29 PM // 13:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keyote

Things like stop to regen, drawing on the map for people who dont know the way, calling targets etc.

/sign

No wonder many people fail miserably in Thunderhead keep then

Anyway for Kabale, yes zealot fire is a life saver now for me ^^. I use it in a solo build when my health is getting low, thus leaving a 1 second gap to heal or cast those spell that i don't want to be interrupted. This actually make it possible to solo more mobs at once.

Willy Rockwell · Jan 05, 2006, 01:46 PM // 13:46

Sorry Keyote, you are right. Everyone should know when to stop and when to agro. These days it is common to team with martinets whose idea of a successful mission is that everyone do what they say. Usually these little generals turn out to be 11 and 12 year olds.

Keyote · Jan 05, 2006, 02:04 PM // 14:04

I know what you mean. I'm not against someone who wants to lead agressively if it gets the job done, but when you're a casual player playing for fun it would be annoying. Telling me what to put on my skill bar would definitely be crossing the line.

Zobi · Jan 05, 2006, 02:19 PM // 14:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keyote

Telling me what to put on my skill bar would definitely be crossing the line.

This is all people tend tpo do in PvP far more than PvE. The standard of PvE player is far above that of PvP player, except for the top guilds, of course.

I am fed up of PvP players saying PvE is easy and go around shouting R8 Ranger LFG. A Ranger that doesnlt know how to interrupt, or trap or anything other than spike, for example; it is laughable.

FalconDance · Jan 05, 2006, 02:24 PM // 14:24

Since I don't PvP, I don't know what 'quality' of player is there, but I do know my lower-level monk was doing the Surmia mission yesterday with a group comprised of a warrior, another monk and a necro who informed us all he was an "really good in PvP and usually was on the team that won favor for America". I always take boasting with a grain of salt, and this was no exception. We all started out.....except him. After a few fights, I asked where he was and he replied he was doing homework at the same time. I (as party leader) asked him top please attend to the mission first and he promptly ran up into battle and died (against devourers! No amount of healing we did could save him). After snipping that a shield did not make him a frontline warrior (yep, a shield from pre and a wand of some sort), he demanded to know why I was "being like Rurik". ????

At any rate, he continued to do homework whilst the rest of us fought and although he did't gain any xp from the kills or any drops, we knew that he would gain the mission and bonus without having done anything. Apparently he became tired of being called a leech because at the cutscene, he finally decided to fight as part of the team.

While I'd like to say this is a lone example of the not-good about PvE and pugs, I can't. I've noticed in the past month or so that the ones who are the first to drop out of a party (while some may be disconnects) are the healers---and thats's when you can persuade one to come along without having to pay them.

Drawing on the map is annoying. A simple arrow for the way to go is sufficient but then you get the morons who pretend it's an Etch-A-Sketch and doodle all over. And pinging. OMG. Strategy? Most I have quested with don't know what that is unless it involves charging blindly into the fray and then bitching because they're lying dead (or letting the foe by so the healers and casters are lying there instead--then you discover that the tanks have no ressurect at all).

(Sorry about the soapbox rant. And the typos)

There ARE some very good players in PvE. I always ask to put them on my Friend's List since I would quest again with them in a heartbeat. And the AoE 'nerfs'? All they require is that the player actually *think* about what they're doing rather than sit there and play a cookie-cutter, rote 'toon.

labsenpai · Jan 05, 2006, 06:15 PM // 18:15

Getting back to the original query...

PvErs that started when the game was released have likely enjoyed the best experience. Last summer there was a greater percentage of players engaged in the story missions, dedicated to uncovering every aspect of the game. My monk enjoyed this "golden season", which started to fade about a month after the SF update. By the time I was working on a second character, you could detect a souring effect everywhere in post. Contributing factors? Here is a partial list: Mission areas transformed into farming communities. Player backlash against nerfs. Inexperienced players diluting groups because they are rushed ahead. Lack of useful rewards beyond the last 15-attribute point quest. Distinct advantages to adventuring solo or with minimal players.

I enjoy PvE, but I am "looking back" at most of it. Currently, many players need a bonus to "cooperation skills" and a nerf to "volatility".

(Yes, Zealot's Fire has a quasi-interrupt effect now that can help Mo's)

Baratus · Jan 05, 2006, 07:04 PM // 19:04

I have been playing PvE since the release of the game and I miss it. The constant nerfs and drops that aren't for shit are my biggest complaints. Primarily on a character I spent ages building up and then getting Drok's armor for, my sword-warrior. For a while he dominated and was very useful in parties. Now sadly, most monks and elementalists can dish twice as much damage from a distance. The biggest example is that when my Mo/N was lv13, I was soloing around Lion's killing off those lv10~13 Caromi. My warrior can't handle more than two or three at a time because he can only dish around 20 damage average with a max damage fellblade and everything in strength and swordsmanship. Now he just sits collecting dust.

Somebody mentioned whites earlier, and those are something that I have never seen. I regularly get blue and purple drops, but it is insanely rare for a gold and I have yet to get a green. I did get a gold last night while capping SoJ for my monk, the first in ages. I also have not recieved a dye drop in over two months, outside of pre-searing.

My final big quarrel with PvE is lack of rewards, as mentioned already. I have explored many areas way outside the scope of what the story or even farming requires. I did it because I like to explore in hopes of finding a high-level item, random or not. ANet doesn't reward you for exploring though, or going the extra mile. That alone disappoints me. I mean why not put a random exceptional drop for said areas in places like the area behind Althea's Ashes? I spent an hour or more exploring that area with my warrior when he was comming through, and I didn't get JACK for it! A Kryta-level item in there woulda' been awesome to have drop off of one of those hydras, for instance.

Basically, every time a PvP player rages about a character being unbalanced, they're gonna' nerf that effect and PvE will suffer. Don't go out of your way because you won't get shit for doing so, and good luck getting a decent drop. I can deal with the immature players. See I either play alone, or with friends on TS. Problem solved!

BBoy_Manchild · Jan 05, 2006, 07:28 PM // 19:28

if you can only do 20 damage to a lvl 13 monster with a sword, thats your fault for making a crappy char, there are plenty of sword wars that can do enough damage to be usefull

twicky_kid · Jan 05, 2006, 07:35 PM // 19:35

PvE is much harder now than ever. Not only do they flee from duration aoe spells you cannot hold arggo forever on a tank. The AI will go after soft targets instead of holding on tanks. Tanks are now pointless and I never invite more than 2 in an 8 man party. Personally I like this part.

Drops are rediculous. Troll, frost griffons, minos, tengu, and ettins drop absolutely nothing. I got a group of 15 trolls together and killed them all and got 3 drops. 2 of which where horns and a candy cane shard. After 2 hours of frosted griffons I came out with 4 purples. Griffs outside rock are the only good drops left on game. Sad thing is this is a brand new accout that has not be tainted by loot decrease. If this is what its like to be a new player I wouldn't buy this game now.

The only 4 quest I do is Fires in the East, Cities of Ascalon, and 2 15 attribute quest. No point in spending an hour for 500 xp when you can get that in 5 minutes. Quest rewards don't make it worth your time.

Condition removal on henches is way overdue. Most real monks are about worthless. For example, doing THK about half way through mission 1 monk drops. I don't care b/c you can still do it with 1 monk. Problem is that the monk was holding king and now he grabbed on to a war. We got to keep and heritic cast his degen on king. The entire time the king was never healed and died from degen only. He didn't get hit once. I can live without hex removal from henches but they really need condition removal.

MoeSyzslak · Jan 05, 2006, 07:37 PM // 19:37

"What's it like in the PvE world?"

As far as drops are concerned, I have landed 2 black dyes in the last week after not seeing one in weeks. Also a couple of good if not stupendous items farming UW (i.e. clean max dmg req 8 storm bow.)

The people are a mixed bag as always. I've done a number of late and early stage things with PuGs lately and there are the usual blend of leavers, chat spammers, bossy jerkoffs, Leeroys, and some nice people.

In general, things do improve as the game progresses.

Actually had a good experience re-running Abaddon's Mouth this week to do some skill capping even after one of the group's 2 monks left. A couple of Northern Shiverpeaks missions were a very different story.

Baratus · Jan 05, 2006, 07:41 PM // 19:41

BBoy, you speak out of ignorance, and reveal your age. Had you read other posts of mine, you'd know I have Drok's armor, max damage fellblade +11% > 50%, max shield, and I have swordsmanship and strength above the limit thanks to runes. The only possible way to do more damage would be to hack the server and force it to make me do more.

Jetdoc · Jan 05, 2006, 07:42 PM // 19:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baratus

The only possible way to do more damage would be to hack the server and force it to make me do more.

Utilize attack skills?