Curse

Nightwish · Apr 03, 2006, 11:03 AM // 11:03

Rare skins = good

Variety of mods = good

Rare uber mods = bad

I do not mind another person having a rare & good looking sword, just don't let it be some sort of godly weapon that can kill my character in one hit =.=

dreamhunk · Apr 03, 2006, 03:29 PM // 15:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by baz777

I like the idea regarding rare rewards for achievement, particularly in PVE, but make it reasonably accessible for all and do not create another elitist item/armour.

You are ready have elitist in the game look at rank! the phinex Rank is rare! that kind of rare thing is in the wrong place!

It is funny to see pvp players want new rare emotes but don't want to see any thing good for pve players!

This is is another reason alot rpg players want things seperate from pvp.

Like a said before pve is really a waste of time! the weapons and gold pve is fluff! There is no value in GW PVE

In rpg lendary weapons have a reason! It goes to show what people know about RPG!

Alleji · Apr 03, 2006, 03:54 PM // 15:54

Um... there is already plenty of rare stuff in the game. FoW armor? ~1M gold. 15^50 Dwarven Axe? ~10M gold. How much more hardcore do you want it to be? Do you have a ballpark estimate of how long it would take to get 10M gold? (except finding a 15^50 dwarven axe and selling it, of course >.>)

For PvP players there are emotes. You have to be pretty hardcore to get a tiger. If that's not enough for you, try for a phoenix. There aren't any rank 15 people yet in the entire world so I'm guessing Anet has set the bar sufficiently high.

Winstar · Apr 03, 2006, 04:10 PM // 16:10

I really don't understand why pvp and pve players can't get along as in many cases, including my own, pvp players also play pve and vice versa. The difference that might arise is in the choice how you choose to play the game after you have finished the main quest. I tend to spend more time doing farming like activities but I also like to unlock elites via skill capping for my pvp characters. I enjoy hunting them down. Furthermore I don't see why any non-noob pve player will have a weaker understanding of the skills portion of the game. Figuring out ways to farm areas or do quests more effectively and whatnot requires understanding the skills portion of the game just as much as pvp does. Its simply a different focus. I imagine a noob pvp player will be just as bad. Anyway why can't we have the best of both worlds! Good new stuff for putting time into pve and good new stuff for putting time into pvp.

fiery · Apr 03, 2006, 04:26 PM // 16:26

I agree 100%, let this be D2 LOD all over again, heck open B.net at most.

Alleji · Apr 03, 2006, 04:35 PM // 16:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Winstar

I really don't understand why pvp and pve players can't get along as in many cases, including my own, pvp players also play pve and vice versa. The difference that might arise is in the choice how you choose to play the game after you have finished the main quest. I tend to spend more time doing farming like activities but I also like to unlock elites via skill capping for my pvp characters. I enjoy hunting them down. Furthermore I don't see why any non-noob pve player will have a weaker understanding of the skills portion of the game. Figuring out ways to farm areas or do quests more effectively and whatnot requires understanding the skills portion of the game just as much as pvp does. Its simply a different focus. I imagine a noob pvp player will be just as bad. Anyway why can't we have the best of both worlds! Good new stuff for putting time into pve and good new stuff for putting time into pvp.

Most PvP players can get along with PvE players just fine. The problem is highlighted - most PvE players are just that, noobs. To further the differences, a decent PvP player's defenition of "noob" will be much higher than a PvEer's.

I use my PvE characters to play PvP, so I had to go and cap a few elites in Ring of Fire and Abbadon's Mouth recently. Now, I haven't touched pug PvE groups in several months and I was kinda taken aback by what I saw. Most of my group had NO IDEA what they were doing. We had a good minionmaster and one decent monk, but the other 5 people played like they just stepped out of Ascalon. I think the crown jewel of our group was an E/Mo "nuker" with an energy storage headpiece, meteor shower, firestorm, searing heat and 5 healing spells.

I had no problem with the people, they were pretty cooperative for a pug (as long as you don't hold high standards) a couple of them took advice and I think I convinced our monk to stop using p&h, but the problem is, most PvEers don't know how to play the game. Why? The game is too easy. THK is supposed to be the "noob-filter" of the game, isn't it? Well, what good is a noob filter if people can get through it with p&h monks, half-baked nukers and god knows what else? If you can get through the game with a bad build, you'll never learn that your build is bad unless somebody else shows you a better one.

Yet, I'm pretty sure that if I asked them individually whether they consider themselves "noobs", every single one would say no.

EDIT: Meant to comment on your comparison to PvP noobs, but kinda got carried away with PvE. :P
Yes, a PvP noob will be just as bad. Even worse, likely. But PvP by its nature is more organized and close-knit, so you can weed those out while making you group and you won't have to deal with them.

Loviatar · Apr 03, 2006, 04:47 PM // 16:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alleji

Most PvP players can get along with PvE players just fine. The problem is highlighted - most PvE players are just that, noobs. To further the differences, a decent PvP player's defenition of "noob" will be much higher than a PvEer's.

IYet, I'm pretty sure that if I asked them individually whether they consider themselves "noobs", every single one would say no.

But PvP by its nature is more organized and close-knit, so you can weed those out while making you group and you won't have to deal with them.

as i am just as certain if i asked you if you consider yourself an elitest you would say no as well.

yout post to me says i am superior all over it (elitest)

Alleji · Apr 03, 2006, 04:55 PM // 16:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loviatar

as i am just as certain if i asked you if you consider yourself an elitest you would say no as well.

yout post to me says i am superior all over it (elitest)

Heh.

No, you're wrong on that one. I wouldn't argue that I'm being elitist. At least around PvE. Of course, I'm not superior to everybody in the game. When I'm invited to a higher-ranked group for tombs, I shut up and play the build they tell me to without arguing about it. Why? Because better players are right in 95% of the cases. :P

There's always bigger fish in the pond and I consider PvPers to be a bigger fish than PvEers.

(Not without a reason, mind you. PvP = tougher competition. Tougher competition = better player)

dreamhunk · Apr 03, 2006, 04:57 PM // 16:57

Alleji thank you helping me proving my point!

also here is another thing for people who don't under stand RPG!

In RPG the most powerful weapons tend to be the must (anoying)coursed weapon! There reason for power rare weapons in rpg! that is what makes it fun.

Loviatar · Apr 03, 2006, 05:06 PM // 17:06

[QUOTE=Alleji]

There's always bigger fish in the pond and I consider PvPers to be a bigger fish than PvEers.

QUOTE]

note that i hold no resentment as i know thare is always a bigger lilypond with a bigger frog in it.

i am simply content to have fun muddling along having fun and let the squabbles/animosity pass by.

cheers

Winstar · Apr 03, 2006, 05:31 PM // 17:31

Alleji,

I guess I am in agreement in the following respect. It is certainly easier to get through the pve element of the storyline while being a bad player while it is not easy to have sucess in pvp while being a bad player. But when comparing experienced pve players and pvp players, I don't think there is a significant difference in skill, albeit there may be a difference in what skills and strategies one is most familiar with due to the differeing demands of higher level pve and pvp. I think anyone good at pvp (or pve) would be able with a little time to transfer their skills to to become good at pve (or pvp). Once you know the game its just a matter of a little research, thinking and practice.

As for items, I don't see why we can't have both rare stuff for both and why pvp players would begrudge pve players getting stuff or the other way around.

cheers!

Zui · Apr 03, 2006, 05:33 PM // 17:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alleji

I use my PvE characters to play PvP, so I had to go and cap a few elites in Ring of Fire and Abbadon's Mouth recently. Now, I haven't touched pug PvE groups in several months and I was kinda taken aback by what I saw. Most of my group had NO IDEA what they were doing. We had a good minionmaster and one decent monk, but the other 5 people played like they just stepped out of Ascalon. I think the crown jewel of our group was an E/Mo "nuker" with an energy storage headpiece, meteor shower, firestorm, searing heat and 5 healing spells.

Most PvE PUGs are just as bad as rank 8000+ guilds that goto RA to get 4 people to guest

I'd write a reply to what people have said here, but Alleji has basicaly said what I would, so I'm not going to type it all out

eudas · Apr 03, 2006, 06:15 PM // 18:15

dreamhunk, i've encountered you in another thread, and my advice to you is: find a new game to play. Go pick up Final Fantasy 17 or WoW or something, because this isn't the game for you. Really.

eudas

dreamhunk · Apr 03, 2006, 06:17 PM // 18:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by eudas

dreamhunk, i've encountered you in another thread, and my advice to you is: find a new game to play. Go pick up Final Fantasy 17 or WoW or something, because this isn't the game for you. Really.

eudas

Truth hurts does it not! off topic but I like the truth more than a lie! Why are you pvp players not open to pve players and what they want! all you do is put them down!

I have a following only because I speak the truth! You still see alot of my comments aroundand people spreading them. Why because it is close to home. To must players it is about havinf fun!

eudas · Apr 03, 2006, 06:44 PM // 18:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by dreamhunk

Truth hurts does it not!

it would, if you were even paying attention to it.

Quote:

off topic but I like the truth more than a lie!

good, try listening to it.

Quote:

Why are you pvp players not open to pve players and what they want!

i'm not a pvp player. i'm a pve player. i may one day delve into pvp, but that day has yet to come.

the basic issue though is that what you want is not what guild wars was designed to be. you don't want guild wars. you want baldur's gate. you want everquest. you want final fantasy. you don't want guild wars.

Quote:

all you do is put them down!

incorrect. i put down people who are idiots who don't listen.

Quote:

I have a following only because I speak the truth!

1) you're delusional. you don't have any kind of following. you have people who go off on tangents from what you said, whom you then perceive to be in agreement with you (but really are not).
2) the only truth you're speaking here is that you want something that guild wars is not going to ever deliver. skip to the end, and find a different game.

Quote:

You still see alot of my comments aroundand people spreading them.

yes, there are a lot of poorly informed people out there. also, see (1) above.

Quote:

Why because it is close to home.

no, because tangential ranting and raving is amusing to some, and the internet is the real-life equivalent of an Infinite Number of Monkeys Pounding On Typewriters. Eventually someone is bound to agree with you no matter *what* you write. That doesn't make you right, it just makes you a victim of statistics.

Quote:

To must players it is about havinf fun!

yes, but as we have already covered in another thread, you have to constrain yourself to the limits of what fun the game design can accomodate. guild wars was designed to attract RPGers in with the initial PVE content, and lead them towards an end-game that takes them into PVP, because PVP is proven to be the longest part of any game's life cycle.

you are deluding yourself about what guild wars is and was designed to be, and complaining unhappily that reality doesn't match your mistaken perceptions.

eudas

ExDeity · Apr 03, 2006, 06:54 PM // 18:54

eudas, game, set, & match. Nothing left needs be said.

Weezer_Blue · Apr 03, 2006, 07:29 PM // 19:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by dreamhunk

You are ready have elitist in the game look at rank! the phinex Rank is rare! that kind of rare thing is in the wrong place!

It is funny to see pvp players want new rare emotes but don't want to see any thing good for pve players!

This is is another reason alot rpg players want things seperate from pvp.

Like a said before pve is really a waste of time! the weapons and gold pve is fluff! There is no value in GW PVE

In rpg lendary weapons have a reason! It goes to show what people know about RPG!

Rank emotes don't affect how quickly and effectively you can kill or subdue opponents. überomgwtfbqq weapons do.

There is no line between PvE and PvP players. Most of their requests don't conflict with each other as long as there is a mutual understanding that nothing can be done to effect balance. The problem arises because of the line between competent players and incompetent players, and also players that just shouldn't be playing this game. Players that would prefer a WoW, Diablo, Everquest, or whatever else game where whoever has played longer always wins. If you fail to understand that above all, the PvP side of the game revolves around perfect balance, uninstall GW and save everyone a lot of trouble.

Pandora's box · Apr 03, 2006, 07:36 PM // 19:36

No, THK isn't supposed to be a 'noob' filter. There is no such a thing in a good PvE game. The fact that some players get along without learning much about their skills is simply the consequence of cooperative play: As long as other players in your party cover you up one can get pretty far!

Which brings me back to the topic: For the same reason any player can hitch-hike to high level maps in a good party, it does not seem to make much difference what you wear or wield. So, talking about PvE, one way or the other it would be great if rare items DO make a difference. If that 'noob' suddenly realizes: 'hey, its not that bullwarior next to me, its not that fire throwing elementalist, but its ME actually killing this monster with my rare sword...' Than maybe he would get interested in finding out how to improve gameplay, and learn something about skills!

Alleji · Apr 03, 2006, 07:45 PM // 19:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Winstar

Alleji,

I guess I am in agreement in the following respect. It is certainly easier to get through the pve element of the storyline while being a bad player while it is not easy to have sucess in pvp while being a bad player. But when comparing experienced pve players and pvp players, I don't think there is a significant difference in skill, albeit there may be a difference in what skills and strategies one is most familiar with due to the differeing demands of higher level pve and pvp. I think anyone good at pvp (or pve) would be able with a little time to transfer their skills to to become good at pve (or pvp). Once you know the game its just a matter of a little research, thinking and practice.

As for items, I don't see why we can't have both rare stuff for both and why pvp players would begrudge pve players getting stuff or the other way around.

cheers!

Agreed about good PvE players. I've met a few, in fact, I tried to guest a couple for GvG or tombs, but they say they just don't like PvP. These are a rare breed, though, because most of the experienced PvE players eventually exhaust the game and move to PvP and basically end up playing both games. It's not a coincidence that heroes' ascent is the place where you see the most people in FoW armor, by far.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dreamhunk

Alleji thank you helping me proving my point!

Sorry, you had a point? Seemed to me like a bunch of unconnected statements with "elitism is bad" thrown in somewhere.