Curse

Fitz Rinley · Nov 06, 2005, 01:07 AM // 01:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dax

Perhaps the problem, and I'm just throwing this out, is the game isn't really about accumulation of items and wealth (I think I remember reading that somewhere) but rather action/combat.

Despite the fact that most people say that they prefer this over grinding over gold/crafting/levels in traditional MMOs- what people 'say' they want and what people 'really' want are often 2 different things. It seems to me we're trying to find complexity in a simplistic economy.

Quite frankly, I have no idea how much gold I have.

In gold I have just over 11 k. I have taken 20 levels to earn it. I have Ventari armor. I have a great deal in storage that I have never used or sold, like dye because I can't tell if I will get a result I want. There is an insufficient amount of support for me to know if the investment in TIME is worth it. When I create a character, that is what I want to play. I don't, want to spend the next 35 levels attempting to piecemeal and tack together a patchwork hodgepodge of never quite was it.

I shouldn't have to hunt to be what I am: I don't want to have to get my gear from a philanthropist, but in a better world that would be possible. I want to be able to get what is appropriate for me. As I recently posted, I ran a Mesmer for nine levels and never received a decent Mesmer weapon, chalice, or chakram. I got an 8-11 bow, but I was not a ranger! I got a 6-9 sword with regen bonus, but that will only get me killed. I erased the character, his 3 k, his 4 silver, 2 blue, orange, and red in disgust.

Facts:

1. You can't play the roles of the character's background from the start with any value.

2. The majority of one's time is spent bolstering to fight monsters in hunting expeditions for junk to SS.

3. The body typing of the male necro will never be out of my posts until they cease to look like crystal meth addicts.

4. The ranged henchies dont know this unless you also are ranged, so a warrior must fight with a bow to remind Alesia she is not a Tank.

Fitz Rinley

Dax · Nov 06, 2005, 02:21 AM // 02:21

I'm not quite sure what this has to do with my point you quoted, I've read it over a couple of times.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fitz Rinley

In gold I have just over 11 k. I have taken 20 levels to earn it. I have Ventari armor. I have a great deal in storage that I have never used or sold, like dye because I can't tell if I will get a result I want. There is an insufficient amount of support for me to know if the investment in TIME is worth it. When I create a character, that is what I want to play. I don't, want to spend the next 35 levels attempting to piecemeal and tack together a patchwork hodgepodge of never quite was it.

I shouldn't have to hunt to be what I am: I don't want to have to get my gear from a philanthropist, but in a better world that would be possible. I want to be able to get what is appropriate for me. As I recently posted, I ran a Mesmer for nine levels and never received a decent Mesmer weapon, chalice, or chakram. I got an 8-11 bow, but I was not a ranger! I got a 6-9 sword with regen bonus, but that will only get me killed. I erased the character, his 3 k, his 4 silver, 2 blue, orange, and red in disgust.

Even in a perfect world, most people have to work a bit to get what they want you can't get around that.... so technically you do have to hunt and quest to get what you want. The game should have a bit of a challenge shouldn't it?

It's nobody's fault but your own that you erased your character in disgust, as you could have easily tranferred it the items to a new character or sold them. A few gold here and there over time add up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fitz Rinley

Facts:

1. You can't play the roles of the character's background from the start with any value.

huh, you can't?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fitz Rinley

2. The majority of one's time is spent bolstering to fight monsters in hunting expeditions for junk to SS.

Well most RPG's you spend the majority of the time hunting monsters. I do agree that most items are deemed junk....that is a problem.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fitz Rinley

3. The body typing of the male necro will never be out of my posts until they cease to look like crystal meth addicts.

4. The ranged henchies dont know this unless you also are ranged, so a warrior must fight with a bow to remind Alesia she is not a Tank.

I'm not sure what these have to do with the economy (or they are really facts) but that's a interesting viewpoint..

Ironsword · Nov 06, 2005, 02:27 AM // 02:27

In the original arguement he said we should have a gold cap for the entire communtiy. well thats good in theory but in reality you get a situation where the richest among us will sit on all the money and the rest of us fight over the scraps left over and that sure isn't fair to someone who's just starting out. the only way something like that would work is putting a sales tax on trade goods and dump all that money back into the game. I think if that were to happen and the tax would be a percentage alot of the godly prices would go down because a buyer isn't gonna want to pay 30k for 1 item and on top of that pay a 10% sales tax to boot. unfortunately for most people the ideas that have been set down to control inflation are going to be more detrimental than helpful. another suggestion would be to have the vendors buy items at fair market value instead of 100x less than they're worthit's really frustrating when you pick up a black dye and the vendor sells it for 7500g (i think) but it's only valued at 1g for you so you have to go to the community and try to sell it but for some items that don't have a large market it's extremely hard to unload those items

overall I don't see much of a problem with inflation in GW simply because you have the same resources as anyone else in traditional MMOs you have people who specialize in 1 thing or another and if you want those items you must buy from those people otherwise you're SOL but in GW you can go out and collect the materials and gold you need to make/buy whatever you want if you want a green item go to SF and fight for it if you want runes ectos shards you can go get those too you're not restricted by your profession as to what items you can get or craft other than the armor and runes you can use

Dax · Nov 06, 2005, 02:33 AM // 02:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by w00t!

Guild Wars economy isn't driven by need, it's driven by vanity. Personally, I have 15k armor for my female warrior because it looks neat, whereas my monk uses normal Droks armor. I'd never buy any fissure armor (except the warrior helm) because I like the 15k better.

And I'm one of the stabilizing forces in the economy in that I regularly go to Old Ascalon and GIVE AWAY nice stuff. I gave a near max +10% ench chaos axe to a new player the other day, just cause he seemed like a nice guy. His appreciation was worth more than any vanity item I could own.

Oh, and I never charge for running people anywhere, and do not accept tips. My wealth, like it was in Runescape, is measured in goodwill, not in the accumulation of "perfect" items.

Imagine what would happen if some of the the wealthiest people in GW decided to become philanthropists.

Actually if the everyone gave stuff away, there would be no value to anything would there not? That doesn't help any economy.

plastichead · Nov 06, 2005, 06:50 AM // 06:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carinae Dragonblood

Everyone is missing the point of the OP.

The problem is that when monsters drop gold, that gold isn't being recycled, it's being CREATED.

The amount of gold in the game is directly related to the total number of mosters that have been killed in the game. It's not a fixed amount, and this is a serious problem.

One possible solution would be to introduce a 'tax' for all players, and have the revenue from that tax 'fund' the gold drops from monsters.

Excellent suggestion. sounds like real life.

but where will the cap be? 1 million? 1 billion?

if there is only so much gold what is to stop people from hoarding, also like real life? how to redistribute the wealth gathered by the elite (thereby kept away from the, for lack of a better word, "poor"?

a death tax seems obvious at first glance. Although if you think about it, you would have to implement it based on the dead character's. total value (gold on char. and in storage, as well as items) and percentage of that (1 to 5%??)
the problem here is that 5% of a "poor" persons value could only be 500, but a well off character it may be 5000 or more if they have lotsa of ectos. this would encourage hoarding and discourage risk-taking, i.e. there not gonna risk death if its gonna cost them more then they would get.

what would happen if the "elite" stopped dying?
will the gold and drops just dry up?

Lagg · Nov 06, 2005, 02:12 PM // 14:12

You realise there already is a gold cap?

(100,000 gold x the number of characters in the game world) + (1,000,000 gold x the number of accounts)

More gold simply cannot exist.

Sure, it would still drop, but if everyone has all his gold reserves maxed out (and his inventory and storage space filled with stacks of 250 ectoplasms, for example), no one would be able to pick it up.

Give the game a thousand years (or maybe a million), grant endless endurance and immortality to players, and you will get there.

Hence: time is Guild Wars' primary commodity.

Fitz Rinley · Nov 06, 2005, 02:38 PM // 14:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dax

I'm not quite sure what this has to do with my point you quoted, I've read it over a couple of times.

Your right. I forgot to make the main point after beating around the bush:

Because all of your time is spent trying to accumulate gold for improving your bean counted points the economy has become the focus of the game instead of gaming. The number of hours logged per individual to acquire 3-4 gold here or there is seen as a boon by someone.

If you by a salvage kit for 100 g @ 25 uses that is -4 g off of each item recovered. If you buy 6 phantom keys at 750 g ea to SS 6 purple or gold worthless objects at an average 35 g ea that is a 4,290 g loss. (Have not made this mistake yet, I buy a couple keys in an area for entertainment but consider them trash and a waste of time.)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dax

Even in a perfect world, most people have to work a bit to get what they want you can't get around that.... so technically you do have to hunt and quest to get what you want. The game should have a bit of a challenge shouldn't it?

No one has come back from a perfect world with that kind of discription. The challenge is in being what you are trying to be: Persona. The challenge is in being a Warrior who wields sacred powers for sacred obligation. The challenge is in being a Mind Bender from the haunting depths of the bloodiest soul. The challenge is in being a Survivalist avenging nature judiciously. (Hence: W/Mo, Me/Ne, & R/Ele).

Since secondaries are worthless (especially for warriors) we are left with powering up primary attributes and weapons for "challenges." This is done thru hunting (slaying large vloumes of monsters for gold and items) and farming (getting killed by monsters to raise their level until they will be worth more in drops and exp. when killed).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dax

It's nobody's fault but your own that you erased your character in disgust, as you could have easily tranferred it the items to a new character or sold them. A few gold here and there over time add up.

You completely miss the point because you focussed on what took the longest to say, not the issue. At 45% of the way toward being max level the character had not found a single weapon or artifact worth using in his primary class. While Fast Casting may transfer over to Necrotic skills (and I have no reason to believe it should, Strength does not benefit Monk skills), he was being given warrior and ranger based drops.

No, you can't play secondary attribute areas with any value. The secondary class is worthless. Especially if you are a warrior primary. The inclusion of adrenaline based skills for the warrior was offset by reducing its energy to the point of making all other classes useless. This effect is less strict on distance casters like Necromancers, Mesmers, Elementalists, Rangers, and Monks - if they can keep their distance. (Very unlikely in this game.) These five can combo more effectively, especially if they are pure casters and don't suffer the Ranger's slot loss. This is another reason for needing to maximize every potential you have in the specialty of one's primary. That means more incentive to hunt or farm and less incentive to game.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dax

Well most RPG's you spend the majority of the time hunting monsters. I do agree that most items are deemed junk....that is a problem.

In many RPGs hunting for experience has been the only functional format for over 30 years. I have been present thru them, playing many of them. Castle Faulkenstien was superior in granting no character development for kills. It was played using regular cards and one received plot points to activate story devices among fellow players. Obviously this will not work in a pre-written pre-programmed adventure arena. This does not mean that the personas we create in game are androids to have their brains ripped and reprogrammed at a whim because the character cannot have sufficient energy, attribute points, or access to stylization to represent the play. Divine Warriors are a joke in this game. Dark Warrios are a joke in this game. And if the Primary attribute of spell casters (Rangers energy bonuses, Elementalists energy storage, Mesmer fast casting, etc. benefits other classes, but not the Warrior's Primary has no equal benefit that leaves the class with a major disadvantage to the rest in comboing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dax

I'm not sure what these have to do with the economy (or they are really facts) but that's a interesting viewpoint..

There are many women who play, I know this. I strongly suspect there are many men who play women warrioresses. Warriors of some ilk are the primary class in the game, and easiest to find. They are they only one build like a football player, if male - (or a non-dandy/drug using punk in the case of certain casters). Their appeal is in their "health" (Connan/Red Sonja) as much as anything else. When the class is weakened deliberately because people want to play something appealing to them, and don't play what is not to them as appealing, then THIS economy becomes pushed by hunting, farming, and running. These are the three sports the warrior is most capable of doing. (Elite Rangers are good runners but lower level rangers have virtually no running skills.)

This is a fantasy game. People play it in order to be part of a fantasy. In order to have that fantasy (someone said vanity) they have to get things that will provide them this. Dye is so rare I won't waste any of it on a character until I can prove I can get the color I want. Until I find 50 or so of each color (especially black as it will be crittical to making anything that isn't pastel or for an ad campaign) I have no reason to bother with it. I currently have 1 black. This is all part of the economy.

Fitz Rinley

(I haven't logged in today, but the last I tried to make a Necro Male - he still looked like a modern day drug user from a leather bar instead of a Necromancer.)

Fitz Rinley · Nov 06, 2005, 02:41 PM // 14:41

Oh, and I do give stuff away. Anything that is not my class that a lower level can use I give away. I take newer players to where they can bet better equipment or help them get better equipment. I am quite willing to ruin the economy.

Fitz Rinley

Deadlyjunk · Nov 06, 2005, 02:58 PM // 14:58

I don't think the Guild Wars economy is in any immediate danger of becoming unreachable for new players. As with any game, the backbone of the Guild Wars economy is supply vs. demand. Seeing as more players join the game evrey day, and they start finding rare items within a week of that, supply keeps growing. Demand is slinking if anything. A single person can find dozens of rare weapons, yet will only need one or two per character. Thus the supply is bigger than the demand, and prices get lower. This has been going on for weeks, but has been especially noticable since sorrow's furnace.

Green items crashed the prices of fully upgraded perfect weapons, perfect weapon upgrades and perfect damage mods. The only things I've seen going up in price lately are ectos and runes. This is only because it's harder to get them then it used to. The UW gets nerfed for the 100th time, ecto rises back to over 10K for the first timein months. Runes are going up because the farming areas for them have been nerfed. Thus it is a healthy economy, in which new players can buy good stuff with their 10k (like a perfect monk staff: Yakslapper sells at 10K these days). The really elite items will always remain pricy, but only the really elite players need them. For example, a Vampiric Crystalline of Enchanting 20% with +15% wile hp>50% will still cost 100K and 250 globs of ecto. But who needs it? For PvE it hardly makes a difference, and for PvP you can get a weapon like that for 2000 faction...

DeVeck Harough · Nov 06, 2005, 03:13 PM // 15:13

I thought the post was rather intelligent and probably pretty close to how the game should work.

Any unlimited amount of money means the money's value goes bye-bye.

Excellent post...now if we can only convince Anet of this...LoL

DeVeck Harough · Nov 06, 2005, 03:20 PM // 15:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fitz Rinley

No, you can't play secondary attribute areas with any value. The secondary class is worthless. Especially if you are a warrior primary.

I'm a W/R and I use my ranger skills about 70% of the time, Either for my ranged (to lesson the amount of life of an on coming creature) or my creature...So i don't know where you got this info from but its wrong...

Fitz Rinley · Nov 06, 2005, 03:21 PM // 15:21

With all do respect Deadlyjunk,

I am 20th level, and near half way to the next. I have just finished Villainy of Galrath. I have Ventari armor. I have near 10 k in storage. I have a max sword given to me by a RW friend's character. (Otherwise I wouldn't have accepted it, and yes I have turned them down from others.)

I do see a problem with the economy. It is not set up to support characterization, but then neither are game mechanics (ie. secondary classes).

An example is shields. They can't be modded. A W/Ne carrying a skull shield makes sense. A W/R carrying the Ascalon Shield in Ascalon Armor makes sense. Instead one may beat the game and obliterate the charcter to find that shield while getting ready to finnish up with a Mo/Me.

Fitz Rinley

Fitz Rinley · Nov 06, 2005, 03:39 PM // 15:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeVeck Harough

I'm a W/R and I use my ranger skills about 70% of the time, Either for my ranged (to lesson the amount of life of an on coming creature) or my creature...So i don't know where you got this info from but its wrong...

No, its not wrong. I hide behind a bow and use Stefan and Thomy the same way. That keeps the spell casters alive, because then Alesia doesn't pretend she's a tank. I can switch to sword at last minute. This is the format I've taken to when exploring/mapping an area before adventuring in it.

Also, as ranged you can run away. This is an option most warriors don't get in combat. Alesia in particular, but often Thomy - or many, many real players run in every direction and agro everything onto the warrior leaving him the option of dying or mapping out. If a warrior had sufficient power and regen to use his healing, smiting, elementalist, etc. powers while in combat he could represent what he is and has (a secondary). As a W/R your using your pet as cannon fodder and then the bulk of the problem is handled for you. By the time you are required to use any real energy your enemy is damaged or near dead. No other Warrior combo has the pet, which the two slot loss is supposed to make the difference of.

The secondary class has no role value. Your pet is doing your warrior work for you but that is not making you a ranger as I can do the same with henchies and resurrect them when I am the only thing left standing. My number of deaths at this rate is over 200 and growing because I no longer care. I can only be killed down to 60%. Healing spells are the job of the monk (Alesia). Healing enchantments are only another way to get killed - they are useless. (The problem with dying is just like the economy, it isn't the dying it is the loss of time moving back to where you were so you can continue progress.)

Fitz Rinley

wolver1ne · Nov 06, 2005, 04:12 PM // 16:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dax

Actually if the everyone gave stuff away, there would be no value to anything would there not? That doesn't help any economy.

It doesn't help that much, but then again it does no harm as well. I give out a lot of items to beginners simply because I think the prices for items are just ridiculously high. According to Anet statistics, on average each player has no around 20k. So please explain to me how on earth that average player would buy a 200k item if it's wanted by that player.

Dax · Nov 06, 2005, 04:40 PM // 16:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolver1ne

It doesn't help that much, but then again it does no harm as well. I give out a lot of items to beginners simply because I think the prices for items are just ridiculously high. According to Anet statistics, on average each player has no around 20k. So please explain to me how on earth that average player would buy a 200k item if it's wanted by that player.

Why indeed.... Because it is a goal to reach?
It's not a good goal, but since everyone can use just about anything in the game (in thier character class), why should they try to get it themselves?

Like I said if everyone gave people things that would devalue items and also the goals. Look at the "What are your goals in GW" thread alot of lists have some item and a amount of gold they would like to reach. You could argue that's not the point of GW, well for alot of people (the people who may buy chapter 2) it is.

That's sorta the point I was trying to make earlier point, since most mobs during quests drop lots of seemingly worthless stuff, the only goal is to save enough money to buy the high level uber weapons and/or save to get run and upgrade to the best armor. Which is kinda funny because seems like most proponents of this complain other MMO's have too much grind... and this to me seems like a grind to me. If there was only more value put into items (weapons, raw materials, armor) in the lower level areas there would be more things to look forward to down the road. Also it would create a wider variety of reasonably tradable items. Have the some dependancy where the low level player can participate.

If you were just to play PvE game without rushing to get the best stuff, you could easily play through the game without having to deal with anyone else trading or selling except for merchants. If you want to play PvP I guess it's a different story.

Dax · Nov 06, 2005, 06:35 PM // 18:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fitz Rinley

No one has come back from a perfect world with that kind of discription. The challenge is in being what you are trying to be: Persona. The challenge is in being a Warrior who wields sacred powers for sacred obligation. The challenge is in being a Mind Bender from the haunting depths of the bloodiest soul. The challenge is in being a Survivalist avenging nature judiciously. (Hence: W/Mo, Me/Ne, & R/Ele).

Well once again, you can role play but the basics for most popular RPGs (in the computer/console realm) is to quest progress through the game, craft (if in the game) and accumulate items/money/skills in doing so. A game can dress it up anyway they want, but you are doing the essentially same thing. If everything is handed to you in GW, things would be boring real quick. Even if you want a persona, you still have to aquire the proper skills and items.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fitz Rinley

You completely miss the point because you focussed on what took the longest to say, not the issue. At 45% of the way toward being max level the character had not found a single weapon or artifact worth using in his primary class. While Fast Casting may transfer over to Necrotic skills (and I have no reason to believe it should, Strength does not benefit Monk skills), he was being given warrior and ranger based drops.

Well just playing through the game, not having people tell me what I should have, I was doing fine. I'm sure if there was a better weapon or item someone convinced me was better I'd be worried that I needed it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fitz Rinley

No, you can't play secondary attribute areas with any value. The secondary class is worthless. Especially if you are a warrior primary. The inclusion of adrenaline based skills for the warrior was offset by reducing its energy to the point of making all other classes useless. This effect is less strict on distance casters like Necromancers, Mesmers, Elementalists, Rangers, and Monks - if they can keep their distance. (Very unlikely in this game.) These five can combo more effectively, especially if they are pure casters and don't suffer the Ranger's slot loss. This is another reason for needing to maximize every potential you have in the specialty of one's primary. That means more incentive to hunt or farm and less incentive to game.

Once again, I had no problems. As far as farming, some folks consider farming part of the game experience. Still I'm not sure how this helps the economy or not. You have to consider that not everyone wants the same thing out of a game as you do.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fitz Rinley

In many RPGs hunting for experience has been the only functional format for over 30 years. I have been present thru them, playing many of them. Castle Faulkenstien was superior in granting no character development for kills. It was played using regular cards and one received plot points to activate story devices among fellow players. Obviously this will not work in a pre-written pre-programmed adventure arena. This does not mean that the personas we create in game are androids to have their brains ripped and reprogrammed at a whim because the character cannot have sufficient energy, attribute points, or access to stylization to represent the play. Divine Warriors are a joke in this game. Dark Warrios are a joke in this game. And if the Primary attribute of spell casters (Rangers energy bonuses, Elementalists energy storage, Mesmer fast casting, etc. benefits other classes, but not the Warrior's Primary has no equal benefit that leaves the class with a major disadvantage to the rest in comboing.

With all due respect I think you are talking apples and oranges. Perhaps the problem you have with GW is the gameplay not the economy. I can't say I blame you, but you are talking completely different games. GW is a relatively casual game.

Amazing KaZoO · Nov 06, 2005, 07:31 PM // 19:31

Hello, Well I guess you were wrong about people not reading your post

Well, first of all your post was very interesting and not as dull as you implied.

The recommendations you made to fix the economy problems were very reasonable and should be taken in consideration.

Guild wars economy is a problem that most players come by sooner or later in the game. So as you, I have spent my shear amount of time pondering the situation.

Well here's what I liked to add to your resolutions:

If the top of the leader items that all player crave for were a little easier to come by, perhaps as a bonus of some new final and very challenging missions, it would certainly devise the attention of money owners to other aspects of the game. What I mean is that if what drove economics of the game was lets say fashion (and I have to say that the armors in UW and FoW surely are an example of that), than players could have the items that would make them to the top (in storyline characters and not only PvP) with not more than a fair effort and time spent gaming. Then the attention would be devised to get the same level armor and weapons but with other designs and colors.
In other words, instead of having one craved item that has a gazillion chance of dropping campaigning, there could be hundreds of equally powerful items, diverting the attention of elite traders, allowing some space for the small people to breath and adding the special touch in the game that so many players crave for, making your own unique character, look the way you want her to.
Well I guess this could help balance economics, the most basic law of search and offer, adding a little of Sims (not that I like the game) in the game. After all, guild wars has 5 set of armors (which common folk can purchase), one of witch has no bonus. Is it only me who find it fairly limiting? Even if you can dye it?
Of curse this would make most players very happy and play a little while more. But the elite gamers, the ones that will stay on even when no one remembers the game, would be very disappointed. If you could reach all the objectives with a lot less effort, then they would achieve all goals in the game and have no more reason to play.

So bottom line is who does the game want to favor? Because as online games grow older this always happens, no one wants to play in a game were they will never reach the top and still others wont play a game were they can’t shine.

Fitz Rinley · Nov 06, 2005, 11:17 PM // 23:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dax

Well once again, you can role play but the basics for most popular RPGs (in the computer/console realm) is to quest progress through the game, craft (if in the game) and accumulate items/money/skills in doing so. A game can dress it up anyway they want, but you are doing the essentially same thing. If everything is handed to you in GW, things would be boring real quick. Even if you want a persona, you still have to aquire the proper skills and items.

There's no role playing in GW as there are no options for roles. Don't get stuck believing that having what you need to be efficient and effective at what you are (or look and feel the part) is something one should do after the fact. Here go fight the Iraqi Insurgency. Flac-jacket, helmet, rifle, bullets...let me see... Well we can drop you some fishing line, a hand cranked egg beater, a rusted key saw, and an oil drum lid. That should do for the first 45 to 65% of your tour. You have a primary of Infantry and a secandary of cook. Of course we use civilian cooks and that isn't going to be necessary, but at least we gave you the egg beater in case you can scramble someone's face with it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dax

Well just playing through the game, not having people tell me what I should have, I was doing fine. I'm sure if there was a better weapon or item someone convinced me was better I'd be worried that I needed it.

See item drop situation in paragraphe above. It isn't about people telling me what I need. It's about getting what is proper to the role of the character. A Mesmer/Necromancer isn't meant to run around with a wand of +4 energy, 2-4 light damage, improves casting speed of earth elemental spells. This is not worth going to Post with. It is not worth adventuring in Pre with. It is the kind of thing you get.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dax

Once again, I had no problems. As far as farming, some folks consider farming part of the game experience. Still I'm not sure how this helps the economy or not. You have to consider that not everyone wants the same thing out of a game as you do.

The greater the amount of hunting the greater the depreciation of the economy. The more people who farm realize their efforts are wasted in hunting ventures for time returns the less time they will spend hunting. End result, the current ressession will end but be regenerated when new items become available altering the expectations of the market.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dax

With all due respect I think you are talking apples and oranges. Perhaps the problem you have with GW is the gameplay not the economy. I can't say I blame you, but you are talking completely different games. GW is a relatively casual game.

GW is a cut-throat game that inspires cliques and competitveness at the highest venue. I understood there to be a supported role playing side to the game. (Caused by an entry screen, I am certain.) It avoids role playing completely. It barely maintains a stroy line as a hook and wouldn't need one for what goes on in this game. This is a game of market economics, and power grabbing for competition - personally or in guild. Those that would play a role are very few. Those that appear to even have a concept of what a role means - even in a limited electronic environment are very few; perhaps less than 3%. So, it is a elaborated Pong with androids as the paddles and the ball.

Fitz Rinley

Siren · Nov 06, 2005, 11:50 PM // 23:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fitz Rinley

While Fast Casting may transfer over to Necrotic skills (and I have no reason to believe it should, Strength does not benefit Monk skills), he was being given warrior and ranger based drops.

I'm very surprised that nobody here has countered this at all. Fitz, read the description for Fast Casting. I don't even know what you're trying to say there, anyway.

Quote:

No, you can't play secondary attribute areas with any value.

Try a Fast Casting Mes-Rez. Or any Fast-Casting Mes-Monk combo. Fast Casting+Smiting is deadly, and hey...that's a secondary attribute that is invaluable.

Or Fast Casting Curses Mes-Nec.

Or Elmo Smiters.

Or hell, even Fast Casting Echo Nukers--or any Mesmer/Ele combo.

Hell, even a Nec/Mes doing Curses and Dom Interrupts is stunning (I use one myself), and the Dom Interrupts are just as devastating when played well as if you were Mes/Nec.

I could go on and on for just spellcasters. Let's not forget HamWar/Eles using KD/AS. Even though I avoid that precise combination, it's still using the secondary attribute areas with tons of value right there.

Sergio Leone · Nov 07, 2005, 12:38 AM // 00:38

I'd like to compliment you on your post. It is very intriguing and very well backed up. The information you produced gave a good insight and sparked my mind into what will Anet do about this problem.

I do althought think you had some drastic statements saying that ectos would get to 50K+ each. If it does get that way it will take a long while. Now I have faith that it will never become this bad. Although if it does I think a better way of collecting gold/high value items will be implimented.

Even if all this does happen the number of new players entering the game will be decreasing considerably for the lack of this games popularity to awaiting gamers.

Ok that's all I have to say once again good job a very informative article.