Curse

LifeInfusion · Jul 03, 2006, 03:21 PM // 15:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by twicky_kid

What does it matter? Its far less effective than -2 dmg. After 15 attacks you would have reduced 30 dmg. You could take more attacks than that withing in 30 seconds.

Life increase is only good vs spike and does nothing in the long haul of a match.

QFT.

I hate when people keep thinking that HP is better than damage reduction.
If you do the math, 60HP is not that much compared to you taking -2 from EVERY attack.

Ecomancer · Jul 03, 2006, 03:48 PM // 15:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by LifeInfusion

QFT.

I hate when people keep thinking that HP is better than damage reduction.
If you do the math, 60HP is not that much compared to you taking -2 from EVERY attack.

Okay since you want to do some math, lets do it. Lets say for sake of argument that an attack deals 5 damage constantly every second, and that you have 50HP. Lets say you had a shield that reduces the damage by -2, now with that in mind, the damage dealt is 3 every second. In order to kill you, it would take appx 17 seconds (50/3).

Now, same scenario but 5 damage constant and +60HP, so that would be the equivalent of 110HP. It would take 22 seconds to kill you.

If you want to give an example, by all means.

winkgood · Jul 03, 2006, 04:02 PM // 16:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by twicky_kid

What does it matter? Its far less effective than -2 dmg. After 15 attacks you would have reduced 30 dmg. You could take more attacks than that withing in 30 seconds.

Life increase is only good vs spike and does nothing in the long haul of a match.

-2 damage is conditional whereas the +30 HP is constant. You also aren't taking into account that when you are healed, you are often healed for more than your maximum hitpoints so there is a lot of wasted heals in the game and in many cases your life is maxed out through a heal. The extra 30 hit points helps to reduce the amount of wasted healing on you. Every time your life is maxed out, you are getting the benefit of having 30 extra hit points and you will be that much harder to kill in the future. -2(stance), -2(enchanted), -5(20%), and -3(hexed) still have their uses, but an extra +30 HP always would imo be a superior shield in a lot of cases in pvp.

JR · Jul 03, 2006, 04:34 PM // 16:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by twicky_kid

What does it matter? Its far less effective than -2 dmg. After 15 attacks you would have reduced 30 dmg. You could take more attacks than that withing in 30 seconds.

Life increase is only good vs spike and does nothing in the long haul of a match.

If that was the case then everyone would be running two superiors and armor mods instead of fortitude mods.

Oh wait, they don't.

Divinus Stella · Jul 03, 2006, 05:16 PM // 17:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ecomancer

Okay since you want to do some math, lets do it. Lets say for sake of argument that an attack deals 5 damage constantly every second, and that you have 50HP. Lets say you had a shield that reduces the damage by -2, now with that in mind, the damage dealt is 3 every second. In order to kill you, it would take appx 17 seconds (50/3).

Now, same scenario but 5 damage constant and +60HP, so that would be the equivalent of 110HP. It would take 22 seconds to kill you.

If you want to give an example, by all means.

Thats right, because we all run around GW with 50HP.........
Do the same math, but with 455 starting health.
With the -2 reduction you would die in 152 seconds.
With the +60HP you would die in 103 seconds.

Anyone can play with numbers and re-arrange them to suit their POV, but the great thing about guildwars is that you can have both armor and hitpoints, it just takes skill to gain the maximum advantage from each.

I'm an armor fan myself, but against an armor ignoring spike i always find it better to swap to +HP armor beforehand and a +HP weapon, when im not against such a spike and under attack or be in danger of an attack i will be using +AL equipment until i reach a low health level then il swap to +HP for a health boost, by doing so ive had the damage reduction and the extra health.

Shantel Span · Jul 03, 2006, 06:00 PM // 18:00

Excellent job of hijacking the thread, which i'm sure was originally intended to confirm (or not) the existance of such a shield.

twicky_kid · Jul 03, 2006, 06:14 PM // 18:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR-

If that was the case then everyone would be running two superiors and armor mods instead of fortitude mods.

Oh wait, they don't.

Exactly why they don't. Its only good vs spike. You cannot expect to run into a spike group every battle. You can expect to get get dmg in small and large amounts every battle. That -2 reduction treats them all the same.

Right now you can get 75 hp boost from sheild and sup vigor. Getting a 15 hp isn't going to make a difference vs spike or any other type of dmg.

The issue of being overhealed is your monk's fault. Overhealing is very difficult to learn how to manage but every great monks knows how to make the most of their heals.

Ecomancer · Jul 03, 2006, 06:23 PM // 18:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Divinus Stella

Thats right, because we all run around GW with 50HP.........
Do the same math, but with 455 starting health.
With the -2 reduction you would die in 152 seconds.
With the +60HP you would die in 103 seconds.

Anyone can play with numbers and re-arrange them to suit their POV, but the great thing about guildwars is that you can have both armor and hitpoints, it just takes skill to gain the maximum advantage from each.

I'm an armor fan myself, but against an armor ignoring spike i always find it better to swap to +HP armor beforehand and a +HP weapon, when im not against such a spike and under attack or be in danger of an attack i will be using +AL equipment until i reach a low health level then il swap to +HP for a health boost, by doing so ive had the damage reduction and the extra health.

I know exactly why I picked 50HP instead of 455, because you are never going to hit someone for such a long duration in order to make a kill - especially in PVP. So damage reduction really does not come into play in this scenario. I have never seen anyone hitting the same target for such prolonged duration.

What I should have done however, was to compare degen over time vs damage reduction. To make a fair test, compare degen vs damage over time and factor in damage reduction and HP and you will see, in short periods, as most damage in PvP comes from short periods or sustained short periods of degen added with damage, HP is far better than damage reduction. Other things that can have detrimental effect to damage reduction is things like deep wound. With deep wound damage reduction basically becomes laughable, again, if a person is staying on a target for longer than 60 seconds, there is something wrong.

Damage over time can always be kited nor will every hit be successful. There are many things to factor here and by far HP is superior to damage reduction having factored those other things.

Jetdoc · Jul 03, 2006, 06:30 PM // 18:30

I knew that this thread would eventually degenerate into a +30HP versus +5Armor thread...

Again, I have found that +30HP works well in almost every situation (spike, DoT, and even plain old damage), while the additional armor/-2 damage reduction works better than the HP mod for "plain old damage" situations.

I'd rather have the utility of the additional health to be ready for most situations...but that's just me.

Skuld · Jul 03, 2006, 06:47 PM // 18:47

Not reading this but anyway, it was a hoax.

Chilly Ress · Jul 03, 2006, 06:48 PM // 18:48

Im an ele, usually flagger, warder etc. in gvg. But I have both a +60 staff, +10 armor staff, +30/+5 and of course the +30/+20% enchant. I just switch, they all have their uses.