Curse

Rusty Deth · Jul 06, 2006, 01:33 PM // 13:33

Well after playing Factions PvE, Prophecies is a cake walk...

The mobs are closer together, the bosses have insane attributes, and you really got to stick close together as a party to survive. Overall I have to agree with most people here, take less people, mess with your attributes and armor to make the game more difficult.

I play mostly PvE and I'm still not sick of it. I been in those kind of groups wheres its 5 left, 3 left and still came out victorious. I think the difficulty of PvE comes from the individuals.

Some people find it easy, others are stuck forever at the desert or Thunderhead.

If Anet really wanted to increase the difficulty, they wouldn't make bugger mobs or higher level enemies, but they'd even out the playing field.

The only advantage every player has is the skills and secondary profession. Imagine fighting Charrs with a full skill bar and a secondary profession. People would be changing their builds at every outpost.

Because of that skill advantage thats why you can still have a low man team, and come out victorious.

But again I agree with others, wnat to make more difficult bring less skills, even the playing field on your end, but some people need a bigger learning curve so making the overall game more difficult would turn alot of people off.

Hollerith · Jul 06, 2006, 01:59 PM // 13:59

Mhenlo and Togo add to the easiness as well.

I'm a big proponent of making groups smaller. I always only bring 5 or 6 henchies to

a) make my effectiveness easier to discern.
b) make the mission harder, because 7 henchies makes the game easier than 7 real players.
c) mad lewt, man.

I would love for PvE to be incredibly hard, where it would become beneficial to coordinate group builds. Funnest (and most devestating) PvE group I've done was a Warrior/Orders group in FoW.

WasAGuest · Jul 06, 2006, 02:10 PM // 14:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hollerith

I would love for PvE to be incredibly hard, where it would become beneficial to coordinate group builds. Funnest (and most devestating) PvE group I've done was a Warrior/Orders group in FoW.

Same here, but this can't be done untill players have an alternate way of finishing missions without the need of coordinating groups of real players. Making them too difficult without balancing the fool henchies makes it so that only early adopters of the chapters are able to make it through.
When Chapter 3 comes out, I would imagine getting a full group for VSquare will be more difficult then it is now. And that one is nearly impossible with henchies cause they are to flat dumb to heal Togo as it is now.
It is possible, but it borders on boring and frustrating rather than fun and you can forget getting the title if you have to use henchies in their current state... course you can pretty much forget the title using PuGs of late as well... ugh

Jetdoc · Jul 06, 2006, 02:26 PM // 14:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Russell.Crowe

Every mission before then is easily henched...

Try soloing without henchmen. Then come back to me and tell me how easy PvE is.

dreamhunk · Jul 06, 2006, 02:28 PM // 14:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by -Loki-

You were around when they made the AI move out of AoE radius weren't you? You don't remember the 3000 page long petitions to put it back how it was, and how many people said they were leaving because of it? I'm all for making PvE difficult, but alot of players can't and won't adapt to change.

I can tell you for a fact this pvp players saying pve is weak!

I will tell you what is sad, that I have a hard time getting in to a group in tombs with my favraite class elemental or sorrows.

There is no monks in some places, the henchies don't cut it.

it takes hours to get into a group in some missions

people only look for cookie cuter builds!

Pve is is a mindless hack and slash and fedex run!

WasAGuest · Jul 06, 2006, 02:40 PM // 14:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by dreamhunk

I can tell you for a fact this pvp players saying pve is weak!

I will tell you what is sad, that I have a hard time getting in to a group in tombs with my favraite class elemental or sorrows.

There is no monks in some places, the henchies don't cut it.

it takes hours to get into a group in some missions

people only look for cookie cuter builds!

Be ornery like me; take your favorite character to an area and try to get a group. If no one takes you, try starting one. If after a few minutes if it's a no go. Take your monk (if you have one) and get to that zone. Watch how fast you'll get a group. Once in a group tell them "Oh finally a group, let me go get my X; been trying to get into a group with him/her for ages" and drop the group. You'll natually not get back into the group, but at that point, who cares. lol

On the subject of no monks around; I'm one of those monks who will not, never ever, no way in ____, ever PuG any quest or mission. I've had one too many fools think they are invinsible with a monk behind them and then scream and curse when they get themselves killed.

Anet, are you reading this? We need better henchies. The idea that poor henchies makes for people getting groups easier is not working and many areas are becoming void of players. Hello?

dreamhunk · Jul 06, 2006, 02:46 PM // 14:46

Yea know what I want people to take a good look at tombs, sorrows,ha

telling me how meny elemtals you see! really I want them to count!

Effendi Westland · Jul 06, 2006, 02:53 PM // 14:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by WasAGuest

Anet, are you reading this? We need better henchies. The idea that poor henchies makes for people getting groups easier is not working and many areas are becoming void of players. Hello?

Poor henchies? So on 3 missions out of 24 the henchies dont work that well for the avarage players. I think the avarage PUG has a record that is much worse.

Henchies > pugs, always.

Argen · Jul 06, 2006, 02:53 PM // 14:53

I thought the idea of the PvE was a training ground for PvP. Than ANet came out with additional zones of higher level critters UW, FoW, SF, and ToPK for more PvE challenge. Until you get to those zones, henchies seem to work pretty decently. I henched THK a couple of times and pugged it a couple of times. I dig get a full group at Hell's Precipice.

There are some new zones in Factions that are a bit tougher because of the time restrictions.

I play more PvE than PvP now... but find both aspects of the game to be entertaining, the challenge maybe less in PvE, but you can sit back and relax a bit more, sometimes PvP gets a bit too high-charged.

If you are complaining about it being too difficult, than SLOW down, learn your skills and experiment a bit. During the school year I have about 8-10 hours a week to spend playing, but I managed to set aside a bit of my game time to make me a better player by learning skill combinations, some basic strategies, and how to make the henchies work. If you spend the time doing the same, you'll find that PvE is more than workable.

Lasher Dragon · Jul 06, 2006, 03:01 PM // 15:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Russell.Crowe

I enjoy a challenge more than I enjoy slaughtering easy monsters all the time, and I know more people feel the same.

Want a challenge? Learn to solo. The Southern Shiverpeaks is IMO one of the biggest pain-in-the-ass places to solo.

Eviance · Jul 06, 2006, 03:02 PM // 15:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kijik Oni Hanryuu

Shiro falls to cookie cutter rama, but he can hurt a balanced build. Also I think Raisu was the last mission, that mission is pretty hard. Oh and umm DOWN WITH STUPID BITCH LEAVERS!

QFT! I am sitting here reading all the Shiro is so easy things, but honestly with our balance group and not really knowing what to expect... OW OW OW! (2-3times OW your party was defeated!) We felt like such nubs lol. We finally picked up an extra warrior for damage and blocking and he went down in seconds! We felt so stupid lol.

And don't get me started on leavers.... It's come up several times on the board and well, I have some not so nice things to say for leavers -_-

Anyways me and and two guildies beat it with pretty much just the 3 of us... The henchies were DPed out (2hits to devona and she was GONE!) and we had lost someone lol... We had some scarey agro and it didnt go near as smooth as yours did, but we managed.

dreamhunk · Jul 06, 2006, 03:02 PM // 15:02

rpg players want rpg not more hack and slash! monster ai could never ever really get better really good luck with that.

make things too hard there will never be fresh blood to this game. This game will be like ha

gw is nothing more than fps. really!

Lasher Dragon · Jul 06, 2006, 03:05 PM // 15:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by -Loki-

Quote:

the only thing the AoE radius thing did was nerf elementalists

Trappers?

AOE nerf actually helps trappers.

WasAGuest · Jul 06, 2006, 03:08 PM // 15:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Effendi Westland

Poor henchies? So on 3 missions out of 24 the henchies dont work that well for the avarage players. I think the avarage PUG has a record that is much worse.

Henchies > pugs, always.

Yea, poor henchies; as in henchies being below par for most players. This was referencing some comments by Gaile a few weeks back about henchie AI and Anet not wanting the game to be an AI vs AI battle ground.

I 100% agree with you that henchies are often better than most PuGs. The problem is, that the henchies aren't "fixed" in a way that allows them to work like they should - take VSquare for example. I've never seen Togo be healed by a henchie healer, so, the mission is a bust the second Togo falls under attack unless there is an actual player monk around. And we all know monks are rare about these days; and I even said I wont take my monk into a PuG... ever.
But it also goes for the other henchies as well. With no way to control them, or issue commands (like a well behaved merc should be able to have done); they border on being a problem rather than an aid.
Thinking way back to Bloodstone Fen and trying to get the bonus there with henchies... henchies auto attack the druids even as you attempt to run past them - failed the bonus.

So it's not about the game being difficult, it's about it not possible to be done with alternate options. PuGs are the worst these days. People running off for map unlocks; capping their needed elite then dropping without warning; and many times there just isn't enough people around. That leaves the fool henchies to baby sit.

scrinner · Jul 06, 2006, 03:13 PM // 15:13

You guys wanted hard PVE? Hello, are we already forgetting about RUJIYO? OH yeah how about solo tombs... if thats too little, how about you solo The thunderhead keep mission..... With the bonus..

dreamhunk · Jul 06, 2006, 03:21 PM // 15:21

if I was anet I would make a invisible boss that you cannot beat. the ony way to be beat him is not by hack and slash it is by thinking and play like rpg player

you see all the pvp hardcore noobs sitting for hour try ing to beat really ,lol

Silent Kitty · Jul 06, 2006, 03:23 PM // 15:23

I challenge the GW programmers to come up with a solution like this: Make monsters as tough relatively to the party size and guild size. When you have a party of 8 guildies, make the monsters godly, and when you have a party of 8 PUGs, make them less than godly.
When one partymember leaves, monsters AI goes down too. With all this make the drop quality go down too, so when you solo a quest, you get almost only whites and blues.

WasAGuest · Jul 06, 2006, 03:40 PM // 15:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silent Kitty

I challenge the GW programmers to come up with a solution like this: Make monsters as tough relatively to the party size and guild size. When you have a party of 8 guildies, make the monsters godly, and when you have a party of 8 PUGs, make them less than godly.
When one partymember leaves, monsters AI goes down too.

I would love to see this kind of system at play. I would love to see the system at play make "tougher" mobs anyway. To me, the fights are too many and don't last long enough. Fewer fights, longer lasting ones would allow for more strategy. So rather than adjust the AI alone, Anet could adjust the health of the foes.
Then fix the henchie AI so players can jump into the game quickly rather than wasting half an evening for time wasting PuGs and we'll have a winner.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silent Kitty

With all this make the drop quality go down too, so when you solo a quest, you get almost only whites and blues.

hehe, with a full group I pull in hundreds of warden horns already and have pretty much given up on me ever finding anything worth keeping. Lessening it more would make my hopeless luck even worse. lol - but yea, I see the point; so solo'ers have a harder time gettnig better drops due to the easier to kill mobs. Good thinking.

Warden Horns FTW!

frickett · Jul 06, 2006, 03:49 PM // 15:49

I like pve the way it is. You will have bad pugs, You will have leavers and leechers. That shouldnt keep you from trying.

Dark Dragon · Jul 06, 2006, 03:52 PM // 15:52

But if drop quality goes down would that not make the leaving situation worse, as when one person finds a item they want, they drop and then its less likely for the rest of the group to get good items.
And if that contiues and like 3 ppl are left then they might as well leave becuase there not going to find anything worth having.

dunno might be a good idea scaling the mobs up depending on the group though