Curse

Zeru · Jul 08, 2005, 09:57 PM // 21:57

The sad part is that the devs made their balance completely aimed at the hardcore pvpers in terms of grind. The casual pvper, i,e the people who don't have access to knowledge about farming spots and can't earn much faction at a time, really can't play more than 1 class effectively unless they devote huge amounts of time. This makes building up a guild from scratch extremely difficult because in addition to having to teach the newer players how to pvp effectively and make good builds, you also have to make bad team builds because people are too inflexible to play good ones.

I wish the devs had made balance adjustments from the perspective of the casual player, rather than the hardcore player

kaya · Jul 08, 2005, 10:47 PM // 22:47

they have kinda made it that way with the low level arenas, and the 4v4 arenas after lvl 20. but, ya it's true just like any other game... the more you play the better you are, and the easier it is to stay better than everybody who tries. often it comes down to time played in the game.

if they wanted to assist that they could make arenas for rank 1 player, and 2, and so on... or however, so that you'd always be playing with people of you same rank or close to it. but... even though i say that, i also should say i dont really care. i like the way they have it set up now. it's challenging at time, and at other times, it's bloody suicide (which is fun too)

speaking of suicide... we went up against a team in tombs yesterday that had 6 ele's and 2 monks. :P they each hit the same target with chain, and killed 3 of us in like 2 seconds... lmao! that was awesome... freekin awesome timing i'd say. anyway the rest was history... but needless to say that build would get waisted in hoh.. and they did. kinda funny though i think hehe!

Mimi Miyagi · Jul 09, 2005, 02:13 PM // 14:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by kaya

they have kinda made it that way with the low level arenas, and the 4v4 arenas after lvl 20. but, ya it's true just like any other game... the more you play the better you are, and the easier it is to stay better than everybody who tries. often it comes down to time played in the game.

if they wanted to assist that they could make arenas for rank 1 player, and 2, and so on... or however, so that you'd always be playing with people of you same rank or close to it. but... even though i say that, i also should say i dont really care. i like the way they have it set up now. it's challenging at time, and at other times, it's bloody suicide (which is fun too)

speaking of suicide... we went up against a team in tombs yesterday that had 6 ele's and 2 monks. :P they each hit the same target with chain, and killed 3 of us in like 2 seconds... lmao! that was awesome... freekin awesome timing i'd say. anyway the rest was history... but needless to say that build would get waisted in hoh.. and they did. kinda funny though i think hehe!

You ran into a poorly designed spiker build. Six Elementalists is overkill, you only need at the most 4. Three is even ok. Three air spikers can do 500+ damage in 1 second, enough to kill anyone if done right. With six air elementalist, it's simply overkill, you're wasting a lot of damage points that just hit an already dead player.

Problem with spiker groups - if the fight lasts longer than five minutes, the elementalists start to wear down due to exaustion. They simply can't sustain that kind of damage dealing over a long fight.

dbledwn11 · Jul 09, 2005, 02:40 PM // 14:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mimi Miyagi

That's stupidity, and reinforces the fact that people are paying for the novelty of an item, not it's intrinsic value to you as a player. Why are Items farmed from the UW or FOW worth more than the same exact item farmed in a drake run? It looks different? Just how does that 25K you've spent in black dye helping you win in the HoH?

People confuse rarity with usefulness. If people want to spend their stupid money on crap like that, be my guest, but don't drag that into a discussion about game balance.

I didn't bother to read on so apologies if someone has already mentioned this.
We're all people and are behaviour in 'normal life' is often reflected in the way we play games (most notably RPG's and in particular these type of MMORPG's). People go out of their way to buy 'novelty' items, things they dont need, things they feel will identify them as more unique etc. (this is the point of western culture - capitalism=individualism (or we'd like to think, but im not getting into that)) with real, hard earned money.

So to call people stupid for that makes u a hypocrite - you are attacking the one aspect of the game that asserts your uniqueness (your bragging rights if u will). I admit it is a rather limited way of doing so, but it still seems to me a very important aspect of the discussion that must be taken into consideration.consideration.

Ginko · Jul 09, 2005, 03:31 PM // 15:31

I have the distinct feeling that ArenaNet never intended for people to play this game so quickly, I assume they were expecting people to ascend every month.

I love PvP, I find it fresh and anew each match, always challenging me, and always rewarding me for victory. I find PvP itself, perfect. However, PvE is the problem. It slaps PvP and dumps a truck load of grind all over it.

I would love for more PvE content to release, just as long as it doesn't contain skills. That's just more grind.

--Ginko

Ristaron · Jul 09, 2005, 04:52 PM // 16:52

I think a few new races, more than one storyline you can do (I mean drawn out ones, not little quests, and still a main storyline), a few new professions, and alot more explorable area will be Heaven in a package for the next chapter.
That, and allowing us to go up to level 30.

If I can have a level 30 Elven Druid I will be happier than a pig in sh*t.
And if my monk gets further divine abilities I will be so grateful to the Gods.

On the note of professions, recycling quests between classes is kind of lame. Different professions should have different quests, like in presearing.

As a personal rant, I really wish they would allow us to explore the far South of post searing Ascalon. All that gray haze covering where my guild's guild hall is in a roleplay we're doing pisses me off.

One of the drawn out mini-storyline ideas I have is some detective work... hunting down old secrets of Tyria. I saw the catacombs mentioned in this thread. Another part of a roleplay I'm doing with guildees explains that the Necromancers created the catacombs - an underground labyrinth, to house one of the greatest secrets of Tyrian history - a century or two before the guild wars began. They populated it with the dead as guardians.
A brilliant storyline would be that one of the Necro-cult tips off your party that whatever is hidden will be needed soon. So you have to travel to the mouth of the catacombs, get your ass kicked, then find out that an artifact in one of the Kings' vaults can turn the undead back. So you go get that, then you go back to the catacombs and navigate the maze... maybe have a point in the catacombs to use as home base... it shouldn't be like 10 minutes to find the "secret", it should take you an hour or so navigating, maybe several tries would do.

I realize the next chapter is well in the working, but some form of sub-storyline is great. Completely independant of the main plot... but not a trivial thing like a single quest.
Perhaps, tying in the different professions have different quests to a larger subplot is good. Give everyone in the party a reason to get to the starting point. The lay-up quest would be a good thing to draw people together (friends, not PUGs, as not all professions have that quest).

Kyy Nisaro · Jul 10, 2005, 01:32 AM // 01:32

Forgive me for being lazy and not reading all of this thread, but here are a few of my thoughts.

About the same time I was getting the endgame areas such as Ring of Fire, I either didn't have as much time to play or couldn't do anything successfully without my Guildmates. Random and 4v4 arenas seemed o have no benefit and and didn't want to waste 3 hours in Tombs for 1 measly Fame point. It also still seems to me that there isn't too much to do when you only have 10-15 minutes to play. Then I discovered farming, with finally gave me both something to do in my spare time and provided me with a potential income. I enjoyed it, as it something that I could idly do in my spare time, or when waiting for other Guildmates to finish missions before grouping up. Now I feel that it has been made pointless because instead of getting a few decent drops in 15 minutes, I could work for an hour and get a purple drop that isn't unidentified. Or, in the case of the oh-so-rare gold armor drop I get a nice shiny Major Rune, which are now worthless with the Rune Trader. I guess the point behind my ranting is this: there are two things I would like to see: a way to make money and get unlocks without unspeakable grinding, and for it to be true that you can actually play and enjoy the game no matter how much time you have to play (unless you enjoy walking to he Rune Trader and seeing that you're Major Rune now sells for 128g instead of 125 and calling that fun. Woo!)

dbledwn11 · Jul 13, 2005, 02:03 PM // 14:03

really good point by kyy there. if these drops are so bloody rare (ie. major, even superior runes) why are they so cheap at the rune trader and why does she not buy them for a better value. basically, why can a level 5 ranger pick up a superior rune of wilderness survival for something ridiculous like 300g whilst regular gameplay from a level 20 takes ages - the value does not reflect the effort.

and for those who mention unlocking, yeh good point, but personally i'm not as bothered about unlocking cause i enjoy using my pve char as a pvp.

ps. may sound wierd but i like to farm elonas reach - does that sound crazy?

Sammiel · Jul 13, 2005, 03:28 PM // 15:28

Because it isn't that rare to get a rune drop, its only rare to get one you, in particular, don't have and want. So all the other runes end up on the rune trader. There isn't a huge demand for Ranger runes, but there is a supply, so it turns out their price drops through the floor. I don't really get why people are so angry. The previous price imbalance was only there because of the effort required to sell a rune. It wasn't due to any inherent rarity in them. And who cares if you don't get as much money from farming. Money at the high end is largely irrelevant, and it will give you a long term goal to work towards. So you still can 'get things done' in 10-15 minutes by farming.

Dax · Jul 13, 2005, 04:16 PM // 16:16

I find gold (in game) almost irrelevent, I wish there was more emphasis on raw materials and crafting rather than jusr runes and uber items. I'm starting to hate the term 'gold sinks' because it's just infers something to waste money on. I rather have feeling that all the stuff I pick up runes or not actually is worthwile and of some interest.

Malchiel · Jul 13, 2005, 04:27 PM // 16:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mimi Miyagi

People fail to take into consideration one little fact - the game has been out for two months. We won't get an expansion pack for almost a year. That means, from now until the middle of 2006, we're stuck with what we currently have.

In the two months I've owned this game, I've been able to set myself up to play the following roles:

Smiter Monk
Healer Monk
Protection Monk
Sword Warrior
Hammer Warrior
Spiker
Nuker
Warder
Spirit Spammer
Interrupter
Shutdown Mesmer
Minion Master

And others I haven't even bothered with. I have unlocked most of the superior runes, including vigor, and if there isn't one I have, I can buy it for 2K (or sometimes much less). I've also unlocked lots of stuff, most of which I'd never use. Sundering, Furious, Fortitude, Cruel, Poisonous, Ebon....the list is endless. A guildmate of mine was bragging that he was able to unlock a 30 health staff head via faction points - and I told him I had unlocked a 28 health one though normal play.

I have a total of four different characters, all at least to the ring of fire, if not outright finished. I can do just about anything anyone wants me to do for PVP. Want me to make a PVP character that is a smiter ranger? No problem. Oh wait, switch to a Smiter Earth Elementalist? OK. Whatever, dood.

In two months.

Just wtf is going to challenge me, for the next 9-12 months?

That +21 Health staff head is statistically no worse than the +30. When I have 450-500 HPs, the difference of 9 HPs is meanlingless, when I'm facing a group of three spikers all sending about 600+ elemental damage my way in two seconds. Yet people will spend 60K MORE for those 9HPs?

That's stupidity, and reinforces the fact that people are paying for the novelty of an item, not it's intrinsic value to you as a player. Why are Items farmed from the UW or FOW worth more than the same exact item farmed in a drake run? It looks different? Just how does that 25K you've spent in black dye helping you win in the HoH?

People confuse rarity with usefulness. If people want to spend their stupid money on crap like that, be my guest, but don't drag that into a discussion about game balance.

Amen!

Asil Moon · Sep 20, 2006, 10:47 PM // 22:47

I'm lost , but then again I always am.

Loviatar · Sep 20, 2006, 11:11 PM // 23:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asil Moon

I'm lost , but then again I always am.

this is over a year old with nothing you added.

reported for closure

Savio · Sep 20, 2006, 11:13 PM // 23:13

A part of me dies every time someone bumps a year-old thread and doesn't understand or disagrees with a post. Closed.