Curse

NJudson · Oct 26, 2006, 03:07 PM // 15:07

I read a lot of posts here, but cant read them all so I don't know if this was covered yet. What does this "called target" update do for PvE groups?

Called targets now remain active for up to 30 seconds after being attacked by their caller, and do not go away when the caller changes targets.

I've been in a lot of PUG before where people were fighting over which targets to attack and maybe I'm wrong, but it sounds like with this update noone can't switch to a new called target until 30 seconds after a target has been called (and attacked by caller)??? Or is it that only the person who called the target can't switch for 30 seconds, but maybe another player can call a new target? I'm confused....

Does this hurt or help PvE now?

HolyHawk · Oct 26, 2006, 03:13 PM // 15:13

It means (or should at least), that if you press "T" under 30 seconds after the first call, this very target will remain recorded, but you can switch targets freely, but if you press T again, it will go back to the first call. It used to be like 10 seconds, or so.

Amity and Truth · Oct 26, 2006, 03:14 PM // 15:14

I've done some tests. It's not an AOE Nerf. It's an overall damage nerf. I tried putting Spoil Victor on an enemy. He took two hits and then broke aggro and came for me - and i was two aggro circles away.
I tried hitting a mob with a sword. After he took a few hits, he started running away. I tried hitting a mob with fricking Flare. He took a few hits and started running.
Please, please tell me this is just a bug and not intended. Chasing mobs is no fun and you can't tell me anyone actually enjoys running after enemie again and again with each mob in GuildWars...

dreamhunk · Oct 26, 2006, 03:44 PM // 15:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amity and Truth

I've done some tests. It's not an AOE Nerf. It's an overall damage nerf. I tried putting Spoil Victor on an enemy. He took two hits and then broke aggro and came for me - and i was two aggro circles away.
I tried hitting a mob with a sword. After he took a few hits, he started running away. I tried hitting a mob with fricking Flare. He took a few hits and started running.
Please, please tell me this is just a bug and not intended. Chasing mobs is no fun and you can't tell me anyone actually enjoys running after enemie again and again with each mob in GuildWars...

Now you how people who are playing the elemental class feels!!!!!!

All I am going to say on the subject. It took nature to make human minds how long?????

Now you have programers trying to make ai act like humans. not even the us army have free thinking program that act like a human!!!!!

SirJackassIII · Oct 26, 2006, 03:49 PM // 15:49

<.<

Also fun is an apparent bug when using a runner. I had a guildie run me from Ascalon to LA, and mobs that broke aggro from my guildie didn't really react (read: did didly squat) when I passed walking by...

Theus · Oct 26, 2006, 03:49 PM // 15:49

Because clearly no class has the ability to slowdown these fiends!

Shut the Red-Engine up and adapt you noobs.

SirJackassIII · Oct 26, 2006, 03:51 PM // 15:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theus

Because clearly no class has the ability to slowdown these fiends!

Shut the Red-Engine up and adapt you noobs.

Because when fiends slow down, they'll still attack with SS, VwK, and (yes, I tried) Retribution? All these skills and more make them run away like pansies, reducing damage of all these skills to nothing. Yeah, criplling them helps -.-"

Amity and Truth · Oct 26, 2006, 03:58 PM // 15:58

If i'd report half the flames and downright flamebaits today, i'd be doing nothing but reporting. Seriously folks, as much as it pisses you off to read someone elses opinion, no need to flame him/her just because he is thinking different.

@dreamhunk
I've been around for a longe while. I've played before and under the first AOE Update. I never liked it. All it did was prohibit the use of some spells. Now we have another AOE Update which basically prohibits the use of any skills or weapons.
If running is the new GuildWars, then snares MUST be buffed.

Dazzler · Oct 26, 2006, 04:02 PM // 16:02

I played my ele last night through Dunes and Dragon's Lair, and while the mobs ran around a little more than usual when I set them afire, our PUG had no trouble dispatching everything in a timely manner.

It was annoying but still playable.

Tango · Oct 26, 2006, 04:02 PM // 16:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by arcanemacabre

Seriously, let's see a reasonable argument against this update.

I'll give it a shot, with the stipulation that by and large I like this update. The AoE implications are the only aspects that are potentially troublesome.

If the AoE change has an effect that renders certain disciplines or professions useless then it's probably a bad change.

The last time AoE was changed it made many fire elementalists spells useless in PvE (searing heat, firestorm, etc...) You really couldn't use those skills in a pug group and as such those skills died. With this new change it looked like you can add fireball and similar such skills to that heap.

In general I believe that worthless skills are bad for the game because they are just dead weight. If you can't use a skill then the skill is no fun.

For example, when I used to play my monk I really enjoyed mixing in Zealots Fire into my build. It wasn't a game breaking build. I just had satisfaction in knowing that I was doing a small amount of damage to the mobs attacking our warrior while I healed the warrior. Now that skill will likely be worthless because I don't want to break aggro (for obvious reasons).

More-over, the question brought up earlier regarding the Dervish character is a very good one. If the Dervishes attack and all of his enchantment stripping triggers now cause AoE break then it's probably going to be the the most worthless class in game history. I mean at least with assassins they only passively caused harm to your party by sucking up the healing. With Dervishes they'll be actively making the parties job more difficult.

Then there are the farmers. A subset of the player base really enjoys farming in solo and dual teams. If anet wanted to stop that then I'm sure they realize that they will be reducing their player base. If that style of play was the reason that anyone was playing the game then it stands to reason that they may stop playing the game if that avenue is no longer open to them. If the number of people who leave the game because of this loss of play style is greater than the number of people who are drawn to it because of the same change, then it's a bad change.

In the end I think the largest consideration is wether or not this change will marginalize a large number of skills. If the net pool of useful skills is decreasing then I think Anet needs to revisit the change and impliment it in a more suitable fashion.

Tango · Oct 26, 2006, 04:05 PM // 16:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hell Marauder

Scattered monsters are too busy running for their lives to attack you, which means you squishy casters are now safer from mobs. This should be a good news, so why complain?

Unless they changed how creatures choose their targets, scattered monsteres = monsters looking for new more squishy targets, so casters are at much greater risk.

Unless there is a bug in the new code I'm guessing you'll see casters having to dedicate a slot or too toward running skills or skills that cripple would be attackers.

Arsenic · Oct 26, 2006, 04:09 PM // 16:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tango

Unless they changed how creatures choose their targets, scattered monsteres = monsters looking for new more squishy targets, so casters are at much greater risk.

Unless there is a bug in the new code I'm guessing you'll see casters having to dedicate a slot or too toward running skills or skills that cripple would be attackers.

Casters are in more danger than they've ever been. Tanks can't hold aggro, so those casters are going to be slaughtered and the tank left there going "dur hur? where'd everyone go?"

Sir Skullcrasher · Oct 26, 2006, 04:10 PM // 16:10

The question is.. who here use AoE spells for farming purpose? If almost everyone answer yes than there you go. The reason why A-Net is so up tight with AoE is probably to stop the damn bots and famers.

Tango · Oct 26, 2006, 04:15 PM // 16:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by aspectacle

Solo and duo farming filled in the time between chapters for me when I felt that all the other content was done. So I am sad to see it go (in it's current known form at least). It is possible that without the farming I'll simply put down Nightfall when it is done and play another game rather than extending its life as has happened so far.

And this, in truth, should be the biggest concern of Anet because I know this is true for many people.

I never farmed until I finished Factions with my 2nd Factions character and then to kill time I decided to try some light farming. I wasn't really concerned about the drops, I just liked the challenge. It was fun.

I suspect other farming techiques will arise, and my primary farmer build isnt' really effected (that much), but this change does seem to greatly reduce the options available in farming so far as variety goes which tends to support your argument.

Once people finish the game with a character or two they will move on to other games faster. That seems like an undesireable side effect.

Tango · Oct 26, 2006, 04:16 PM // 16:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir Skullcrasher

The question is.. who here use AoE spells for farming purpose? If almost everyone answer yes than there you go. The reason why A-Net is so up tight with AoE is probably to stop the damn bots and famers.

On some of my builds, yes. On my favorite build, no.

blastm · Oct 26, 2006, 04:18 PM // 16:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir Skullcrasher

The question is.. who here use AoE spells for farming purpose? If almost everyone answer yes than there you go. The reason why A-Net is so up tight with AoE is probably to stop the damn bots and famers.

I tried my Vwk rit on a few spots i used to farm before the update and..
it still works.
granted, it takes much longer, but it can be done.
But while i can't spend my life farming, a bot can. bots aren't dead, but the wallet of casual players/ small farmers like me have a dark future.

Now, i haven't tried the kuzrick zone yet, but anyone who played there with henchmen an aoe skills such as firestorm or ignite arrows knows what i'm talking about. it will be a pain.

EternalTempest · Oct 26, 2006, 04:26 PM // 16:26

Due to the description of the AOE change and the how it seems that they scatter worse then before from what I've been reading, it screams the AOE bug when they 1st changed it where any aoe made them flee in terror.

Also everytime Anet Change X = OMG they killed Kenny, I quit... give it a month before people adapt and find new build that can farm nicely. That and 2/3 of the I quit.. don't quit.

And yes my favorite primary character is a fire ele, this was before and after the 1st AOE Change.

Tango · Oct 26, 2006, 04:26 PM // 16:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoKi Foxfire

*dances* At least they didn't nerf Barrage yet either!

*hides his precious Barrage under a nerf proof bed*

Really? See, I leverage Barrage to the hilt but if they took it out of the game I couldn't blame them. How can Barrage not trigger AoE?

firewalker · Oct 26, 2006, 04:29 PM // 16:29

i just went with a 8player group to FOW and we had to chase the mobs more than once, somethimes was total caos...no one died but it was really boring.

Tango · Oct 26, 2006, 04:33 PM // 16:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by arcanemacabre

Both of you do bring up some very good points. There are fundamental differences in PvE vs. PvP. I personally prefer PvE leaps and bounds above PvP because I'm not terribly competitive in nature. I personally like a good challenge, but I dislike it at the cost of stress and rage..

Your "The want PvE to be more like PvP" argument is a very good one, arcane. Good enough to make me doubt that the AoE effect we are seeing now is a bug.