Curse

milias · Nov 12, 2006, 11:22 PM // 23:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by stamenflicker

I love the fact that monsters now behave more like player characters by running when their health gets low.

BUT...

Anet needs to fix the aggro. There's nothing worse than having the monster reduced to and handful of health points, only to have them take off running into another mob.

This has happened to me on numerous occasions. I spend energy taking a group down to nothing, only to have them aggro all their buddies. On the journey to Nightfall Jahia, mobs aggro way to easily and they aren't spaced out enough to finish taking down one group, before the runners bring another group (or two, or five) right down on top of you.

Even with the flag system, your heroes and henchies will still pursue unless you set them to avoid combat, in which case you aren't going to win there at all.

Highly frustrating.

Maybe that's the way it's supposed to work. If you're in a group, and your group is low on health, and you start running, and you see another group of friendly allies, what do you do? Of course you're going to run to them for protection

Eilsys · Nov 12, 2006, 11:25 PM // 23:25

The worst part about this change is when you're playing with other *players*. You can order your henchies pretty quick (need to set all heroes to guard or avoid, cuz agressive/attack makes them run back in), but people I play with who aren't any good won't run fast enough, no matter how much I spam it.

Personally, I think the worst area in the game is the Echovald Forest, when you're trying to cap Boon Signet. >

The rest of Factions isn't so bad, but Nightfall is a lot like that.

Beckii-Chan! · Nov 12, 2006, 11:32 PM // 23:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eilsys

The worst part about this change is when you're playing with other *players*. You can order your henchies pretty quick (need to set all heroes to guard or avoid, cuz agressive/attack makes them run back in), but people I play with who aren't any good won't run fast enough, no matter how much I spam it.

Personally, I think the worst area in the game is the Echovald Forest, when you're trying to cap Boon Signet. >

The rest of Factions isn't so bad, but Nightfall is a lot like that.

*Phew* Lucky I killed good ol' Mungri before the AI update, I'd hate to see him luring an Army of Dredge Gardeners

The Hand Of Death · Nov 13, 2006, 01:15 AM // 01:15

Snaring has a use in PvE now. Bring a snare and use it on a running enemy, it is useful.

Thallandor · Nov 13, 2006, 01:28 AM // 01:28

I notice this as well. Some of the patrol paths stagger over each other and unless you take a mental note of all the patrol paths (when you get wiped enough times for a mission you will!) and make extreme pulls to aviod cross patrol aggroing.

Call of Torment (CoT), When i first entercountered it i felt that it was sort of a time sink if your party setup cant spike fast enough. CoT on the Arm of insanity (rangers) can easily wipe your party with barrage spams if you dont have a prot monk in your party. One of the ways to overcome this is to get the lightbringer title, and get the lightbringer gaze skill. Focus fire on the target and when it starts to use CoT, use lightbringer gaze to finish it off. conditions/degens works well on those demons as well.

MaglorD · Nov 13, 2006, 01:37 AM // 01:37

I've played through the whole of NF on my dervish, warrior and paragon with heroes/henchies.

Also completed with my ranger with some pugging at the endgame.

Haven't had too much trouble with monsters running away. Then again, I keep a sharp lookout if they end up in another group of monsters.

If you manage your heroes/henchies properly, you can counter the running very easily.

Lmao Roflus · Nov 13, 2006, 07:45 AM // 07:45

Personally I think that the new enemy behaviour makes this game alot more interesting. It seems that almost everyone prefers to have their computer controlled enemy stand there and mindlessly fight you until its bitter death. Is it so bad that when an enemy feels outmatched he feels the need to run away? I thought it was the greatest thing ever when an enemy monk ran away from me as I tried to axe him to death. Would it be more "realistic" if he just stood there like a moron letting the entire group pound on him?

I always notice the people that don't want to accept the fact that this is supposed to make the game more challenging don't call it "Smarter AI", they call it "Annoying AI". So the last enemy runs away towards another group, why would you chase him down to knowingly cause more aggro and then blame the AI for the oldest mistake in the book? You gotta anticipate the fact that henchies and heros get excited when they see an enemy.

I know it must be frustrating to be outsmarted by some computer controlled enemies. Well I have the cure for that, get a new build and learn how to use the orders system more efficiently. What I like to do is leave my henchies several paces behind me before we engage a field of enemies. What I try to do is pull the enemies into my group, not the other way around. It may not sound like an advantage because henchies still run up but it certainly keeps enemies somewhat out of each others patrol routes.

Lord Sojar · Nov 13, 2006, 08:35 AM // 08:35

Bottom Line: The AI is jacked up. I figured we came to this conclussion.

I chased a ritualist boss who was healing himself CONSTANTLY for about 40 mintues. Because that wasn't at all annoying... @_@ Oh, and my ranger hero had pin down (he had mend body and soul) He would kite around his spirits, then run off far away while we fought the group he aggroed us into. Then, he would lay down another 2 spirits, etc. This was so bloody annoying, I wanted to hang myself. I was playing my MM at the time too.... so...I have no skills to "snare" him, so don't mention it. I figured pin down was enough, Guess not....

Fix the god forsaken AI anet.

shadowmist · Nov 13, 2006, 09:05 AM // 09:05

I haven't noticed all that much change with mob AI except when I attempted to troll farm (nooo!!! >_<) Might be because I've pretty much been playing my dervish exclusively for a while now and I cripple whatever I'm fighting. But even before I started using cripple, none of the monsters ran that far away from their starting point. I had more trouble with my henchies running into the middle of the fortress to attack a mob one agro bubble away when I was capping the avatars (stupid koss...) Didn't tell him to do anything either, was just finishing off one of the patrolling groups outside.

Cebe · Nov 13, 2006, 10:38 AM // 10:38

It really gets on my nerves also when mobs run away when they look like they're about to die. But more annoying is the fact that it doesn't work the other way around. Mobs now seem to target one individual before moving onto the next, in most occaisons. I first noticed this when playing as monk...when the enemy picks a target...they GO for that target and their health plumits. For instance, I was monking for the Varesh-killing mission last night. It was like "Varesh see Dunkoro"..."Varesh kill Dunkoro". "Varesh see Dervish"..."Varesh kill Dervish"...REALLY annoying since I was basically ressing people instead of healing them since their health plummited so fast. I will say, however, Holy Haste + HCT Healing Prayers Skills = 2 second Res Chant

The other thing that currently annoys me about the AI is...since they seem to have this new mentality whereby "I see...I kill", you CAN'T run away. When they run away from you when they get to half health...if they want to enough...they can lose you. When you get to half health and want to leg it they kill you anyway because, for some reason, they find some burst of speed! ARRRGH.

Deleet · Nov 13, 2006, 10:49 AM // 10:49

Time to dust off those utility skills.

garethporlest18 · Nov 13, 2006, 10:50 AM // 10:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deleet

Time to dust off those utility skills.

To bad there isn't a spot for them on my skill bar unless I want to make myself useless.

Avarre · Nov 13, 2006, 11:13 AM // 11:13

I'm partially confused, mainly because I haven't really seen... well... any change in the AI. After about 6 hours of killing Margonites for LB points, not one behaved any differently than a pre-update mob. The only mob in all of Nightfall I noticed kiting me was a Kournan Priest (which died easily when I blocked it's selfhealing). If anything, mobs (in particular, casters) have been standing in convinient groups for aoe attacks. I'm not sure why this is, when the forum presents an alternate world.

So I can't really add to this simply because I've never seen what people are talking about. It sounds dreadful.

garethporlest18 · Nov 13, 2006, 11:16 AM // 11:16

I don't think it's with NF enemies Avarre at least I've not noticed it either. Those priests are tards though, they come from their group, charge in like the warrior cast RoF and Shielding Hands and then stand there and die. Each and everytime I fight them...

Hyunsai · Nov 13, 2006, 11:44 AM // 11:44

Obviously now the useless character are those who can't snare slow KD...

ChaoticCoyote · Nov 13, 2006, 01:26 PM // 13:26

Keep the heroes on "Guard", and use cripples and snares to stops enemies from running.

ANet added a bit more strategy to the game. That's a GOOD thing.

I find it so odd that people complain about the game being too easy or boring, yet they turn around and complain when battles become a bit more tactical.

The Silver Star · Nov 13, 2006, 02:04 PM // 14:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by lunksunkunk

When the hell did bots chestrun or run period?

International Rankor used to have a few botter chest runners was kind of obvious when they run 24/7 in and out to merchant all with rank7 chest runner +_+ havnt seen them in a whie though.

stamenflicker · Nov 13, 2006, 02:23 PM // 14:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darcy

I think the new mob AI has made them play more like humans (luring & chasing), thus making it more difficult to do quests with hero/hench parties. You need real people to split your party correctly; some to chase the runners, some to protect casters.

Umm you don't chase runners in the Torment. If you do, your mission is over.

stamenflicker · Nov 13, 2006, 02:31 PM // 14:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief

I was playing my MM at the time too.... so...I have no skills to "snare" him, so don't mention it. I figured pin down was enough, Guess not....

Fix the god forsaken AI anet.

There ya go. Perfect example of the problem. MM's have it real bad, because there's no stopping a Fleshy from chasing down a runner and bringing all the aggro down on the group.

And for all the "cripple them" shouters out there. Ummm no. Save that stuff for the Kouran Clerics.