Curse

NoChance · Nov 17, 2006, 07:27 PM // 19:27

but is sundering better for heroes who don't switch weapons on their own? ... yes you could switch for them, but that sounds really tedious!

jimmy_logic · Nov 17, 2006, 11:21 PM // 23:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yanman.be

Vamp>sundering, no matter if you're spiking or not.

Based on the previous Sundering + Vampiric calculations (of which can be found on this forum) it seems both are sorta even now (Vamp is better under a IAS skill). Even by that I mean Vamp will win over the long run, but who knows when the 20/20 triggers what if within the 5 shots you take it triggers 3 times.

Katari · Nov 17, 2006, 11:46 PM // 23:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimmy_logic

Based on the previous Sundering + Vampiric calculations (of which can be found on this forum) it seems both are sorta even now (Vamp is better under a IAS skill). Even by that I mean Vamp will win over the long run, but who knows when the 20/20 triggers what if within the 5 shots you take it triggers 3 times.

Vamp is still better when not under an IAS skill.

Mystic- · Nov 18, 2006, 02:14 AM // 02:14

Take it from me, the spike pro...
spike = 3,2,1.
Which mod depends on what kind of spike, I'd say vamp only rly makes a big difference with mulitple attacks, i.e. dual shot in a ranger spike.

Paperfly · Nov 18, 2006, 04:00 AM // 04:00

Quote:

A hornbow (ivory, shadow bow etc) has an inherent chance of 10% armor penetration. Add a 20/20 sundering mod and you get 30%. Add the smiting monk skill +20% armor penetration and you get 50% chance in total.

First, you've misread Judge's Insight - it's a static 20% buff, not a 20% chance of a buff! So it's better than you think it is.

Secondly, sorry, but the math doesn't work like that. Each time you attack with those two buffs up the bonus is calculated separately (i.e. first it'll check for the hornbow bonus then for the sundering). This means that the percentage chance is lower than 10%+20%=30%, as you have to take into account the dual positives - when both trigger on the same attack.

-.- · Nov 18, 2006, 04:56 AM // 04:56

Guild Wars definition of a 'Spike' is large amounts of damage in a small time frame.

Phaern Majes · Nov 18, 2006, 05:44 AM // 05:44

Oh I love the new ways of getting this arguement going. I put like this

Sunder = are you feeling lucky?
Vamp = are you not retarded?

Sure sundering in theory could trigger every single time, but since when does it ever work that way? Not to mention if you vamp with barrage.....god I love seeing +5 +5 +5 +5 +5 +5 above my head.

Gun Pierson · Nov 18, 2006, 08:49 AM // 08:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paperfly

First, you've misread Judge's Insight - it's a static 20% buff, not a 20% chance of a buff! So it's better than you think it is.

Secondly, sorry, but the math doesn't work like that. Each time you attack with those two buffs up the bonus is calculated separately (i.e.. first it'll check for the hornbow bonus then for the sundering). This means that the percentage chance is lower than 10%+20%=30%, as you have to take into account the dual positives - when both trigger on the same attack.

Yes sorry about that, should have made my home work better on this one. Thanks for clearing up my mistake.

Vermilion Okeanos · Nov 18, 2006, 10:07 AM // 10:07

Wow, so many definition for spike...

Now here is my piece.

Spike = 250+ damage all within 1 sec.
Not a spike = example: 800 damage in 4 sec.

Generally, for a good monk to respond, it need at least .75ish to respond (along with lag); that is if absolutely no other information was provided beforehand (such as not able to watch opponent spike animation etc). While spike is something that make monk jump off the chair.

Now come to think about it... if I were to play a dervish and not use zealous, maybe I give sundering a try. Just by getting critical on non-moving foe I am already trying to win lottery, might as well give the gamble all the way.

shardfenix · Nov 18, 2006, 10:37 AM // 10:37

"Spike", as a strategic game term -
The act of applying as much damage to a single target as quickly as possible in order to minimize the chance of it recieving heals before it dies.

Something like that.

Vampyric is better for spiking unless you own a 20/20 sundering hammer or scythe and land a critical hit. Swords, daggers, bows, axes, and spears should always be vampyric.

shadowmist · Nov 18, 2006, 10:40 AM // 10:40

I personally don't like vamp weapons very much because weapon changing gets annoying, especially if I forget. Sundering weapons are much more mindless IMO so that's one less thing I have to worry about. Of course, I always keep at least one vamp and zealous weapon for those situations where they're more useful.

Anyways, spikes are where people (not always more than one, one person can spike kinda) unload high damage skills in quick succession onto one target with the goal of taking a giant chunk of health from that target. Common examples of a spike are the ranger spike and ele spike. Ranger spikes utilize damage modifiers (preperations/nature rituals/etc...) and quick attacks (dual shot, punishing shot, savage shot, etc...) to deal a lot of damage at once. Ele spikes unload their high damage skills onto one target. Both essentially work the same way.

I personally think sundering is more effective overall as that sudden extra damage can scare the shit out of less experienced players. Vamp has the life drain, but also the life degen that almost balances it out with you getting a few hp more healing every few secs. Which is like nothing in the short run. I personally find vamp to be more effective if I want higher overall DPS, but sundering less of a hassle and more useful when going PvP. IMHO of course.

Qual · Nov 18, 2006, 01:39 PM // 13:39

This is stupid, //Vamp\\ //Sundering\\ Have them both.

pah01 · Nov 18, 2006, 03:18 PM // 15:18

No never use sundering. Not both.