Curse

Molock · Nov 13, 2006, 02:56 AM // 02:56

Unfortunately, I am actually getting bored with Nightfall... Prophecies was by far the best campaign, because after you completed the missions (that were in a decent number...) you could go farm a whole bunch of areas, explore for hours, run people to places, etc. Plus in prophecies you got three challenging missions from Glint in droks, those where fun.

Thallandor · Nov 13, 2006, 03:07 AM // 03:07

After defeating Abaddon once last nite, i was preparing my paragon to have a go at it then i think of my other 8 PvE toons.... As i agree with some of my guild mates, Gate of Maddness is beginning to feel like a chore.

But as many others here say, taking a break while waiting for gem prices to drop :P would be a good way break away and take your mind off the game for a while and catch up on sleep and return to the game fresh again.

Gun Pierson · Nov 13, 2006, 04:17 AM // 04:17

First of all I want to say something about the argument to slow down. Veterans are way more experienced than the average Joe and play faster through content. Which was no prob if we could farm, chestrun or whatever. Yeah farming is still possible, but not as fun as before.

The 'Take a break argument': dedicated players and veterans don't want to take a break, they enjoyed this game and want to continue their gaming experience in THIS game and get better at it. You get good at something when you do it a lot. I take breaks when I feel like taking a break not because I'm forced to take a break while I feel like playing.

Switch to PVP: If one doesn't feel like PVP'ing, he/she just doesn't want to play PVP point. Nor Anet or anybody else can push them in that direction.

The argument that this game is not for you: Well it has been a game for me since euro release and now suddenly it's not a game for me anymore?

The nerf bat has been used too many times especially on the PVE community and the farming issue. Too much is just too much. Anet is nerfing to the point it gets ridiculous and it takes away a big part of the fun or endgame occupation.

If we see an exodus of veteran players it usually indicates a turning point in the game. It's not a good thing to happen as these players are in a way ambassadors of the game. The average Joe will play a while and will move on to other games anyway.

Loralai · Nov 13, 2006, 04:32 AM // 04:32

I have really taken my time with my Paragon, she's level 18 and still sitting on the Island. However, as I did with Factions, I did move at a relatively fast pace with my monk, (I had plenty of time on my hands that weekend), wrapped the game up doing all early quests, most Desolation ones, and a couple Realm quests. However, somewhere along the way, the game was "tweaked" and now attempting to complete those Realm quests just boils my blood.

I have been alleviating my boredom by dabbling with my Paragon some more, as well as hobbling my old characters toward the Sunspear Sanctuary areas, leveling their heroes, etc... For the moment, this seems to be alleviating my boredom with the latter areas of the game. I am still sitting on hope that some changes will occur to at least tone it down some.

On another note, someone else mentioned this in passing, but I think it deserves a bit more attention. In a couple weeks, granting that the current state of AI, bugs, glitches, hero problems, marathon running casters, continues, I expect a lot more complaints as the newer and more casual players near the Desolation and Realm areas.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sidra

Like I said earlier, the largest demographic is probably those who don't give any input at all....But- I think we should at least try to assemble a neater list of exactly WHAT we're all at each others throat's about so that if anybody from ANet DOES decide to read this topic, it isn't dismissed as a gigantic flame war from the 4th or 5th page on.

I agree completely.

There's been banter back and forth about who is the minority vs. majority. I do believe that we are all the minority here, regardless of which side of any issue we are on. The vast majority of players do not post on any forum site. So, that being said we are like (cheesy post-election political reference) the "exit polls." Avid forum posters provide to Anet a nice slice of the differing opinions of the community. This includes our in-depth logical thinkers, novelists, flamebaiters, trolls, and great debaters. Most of the variations of opinions you find here, you will likely find in game as well.

Anet recognizes that by directing their suggestions and complaints to fansite forums, any subsequent answers will come from that colorful splice of the GW community. Every debate doesn't have to be right or wrong. Sometimes it's just your way of thinking vs. mine. Sidra is exactly right, if it's toned down and it a more orderly debate, (read less: Go PvP, Go play WoW, Go PvE, scrubs, Quit then....etc..) ALL of our opinions would have a much higher chance of being actually read and taken into account and consideration.

realoddsman · Nov 13, 2006, 04:43 AM // 04:43

The only thing that I hate about NF right now is

1. the ramped up difficulty. (Cantha was ez if you know how to manage the missions, ie each mission had a quirk that could be used, even in the final missions)

2. the Sunspear points grind (I have 6 chars now, and getting 2500 on each is a bitch).

3. Leveling these annoyingly low heros. Koss x 6, Dunkoro x 6, Tahlkora, Melonni, etc. I know I dont have to level them, but since everyone is playing solo, who do I group with other than my heros?

Essentially, Factions was quick to play through if you were masterful at it. Nightfall is just an annoying grind initially, followed by a rediculous difficulty curve in the final areas.

korcan · Nov 13, 2006, 05:03 AM // 05:03

i believe some of the "boredom" that players are experiencing stems from the fact that nf is really nothing new compared to prophecies. people loved prophecies and still do because at the time of release prophecies was new, fresh, & innovative. the "improvements" to enemy ai also contribute to nf and past campaigns having less value in terms of endgame content/replayability for non pvpers, which undoubtedly adds to said "boredom" for some.

everything gets old after a while, i just didnt think that gw would be aging as fast as it is for me.

heres to hoping that anet freshens things up in the coming months, cheers

Hump Masta · Nov 13, 2006, 06:37 AM // 06:37

10 pages about the game being boring enough said....if there is 10 pages of any game about it being boring thre is something wrong ANET THERE IS SOMETHING WRONG....they need to fix it or your next copy of guild wars will be few less sales regardless of the "cool" new things that you say will be offered in it(much like an elite mission in nf)

Sid Soggybottom · Nov 13, 2006, 06:52 AM // 06:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hump Masta

10 pages about the game being boring enough said....if there is 10 pages of any game about it being boring thre is something wrong ANET THERE IS SOMETHING WRONG....they need to fix it or your next copy of guild wars will be few less sales regardless of the "cool" new things that you say will be offered in it(much like an elite mission in nf)

No. There are 10 pages of people arguing, it's sure not a unanimous outcry of the game being boring, get your facts straight. Besides, 10 pages on a forum is small potatoes especially for something so "controversial"

KurtTheBehemoth · Nov 13, 2006, 06:53 AM // 06:53

the key word here is HEROES

I am coming up with so many cool hero combinations that I can farm all kinds of areas alone that previously needed annoying pug tards.

My most off-the-wall creation as of yet is a taking 2 hero rangers and one hero necro/ranger, and creating a trapper team for UW. I have to flag individual heros and activate all their traps, but after a while it is just as fast as a regular 4 man trap team.

I applaud A-net for adding heroes and essentially raising the bar of what a creative player is capable.

Time to step outside of the box guys and get original. The canvas of Guild Wars is now huge and is looking for talented artists to fill in the blank spots.

Bobbbo Ob · Nov 13, 2006, 07:02 AM // 07:02

Quote:

Basically Guild Wars gets boring, hence the release of new chapters with their new content. But what makes it worthwhile for me playing it, is the Survivor Title... Acting like in real situations, where once you get spiked, you just try to run for your life! This 'constant fear of dying' has actually improved my tactical senses and can give you a nice adrenaline-boost IRL (-:

If you truely want a hard and extremely challenging way to play the game, then Solo, while still trying to keep the survivor title, through prophecies until you get to Sanctum Cay. This means no henchies, heroes, anything. After Sanctum Cay, the game gets too hard to solo it. This will also turn you into the ultimate tactician guildwars wise in whatever profession you are playing.

Quote:

I know thousands of you think heroes are a stroke of genius, but for me, they've made this game so much duller. I miss PUGS, even the bad ones, I'm sick of hopping from mission-to-mission Henching everything. No-one talks anymore, No-one groups anymore. PvE is practically single player nowadays.

do you know how hard it is to get a decent party, because everyone plays with heroes and henchies, or because players just want to take their heroes and don't care for playing with other players? I ask for help in a mission because I see hundreds of people, but wait! its only 30 people with 8's on their head, and they don't know anymore than you do, and are unwilling to help! It is annoying, and so I am forced to Henchie the game too, and even in the final areas of the game, its not that hard to do either after soloing it with henchies for many hours, even with the ridiculously strong enemies in the final parts.

I find that the only times that a party is formed in NF is in the last four missions. then after every mission, players split off, then meet in the next mission, not really caring to do any quests or exploring together. I played with another player named 'Poppy White' I think it was. We went through each mission, then split, then rejoined for the next mission for the last five missions in the game.

on the farming arguments, here is my opinion...

I don't like farming, I hate it, never liked it, but heck, I even farm sometimes because I am very short on money, run through some areas and kill mob after mob of monsters. But it with the New AI changes, it is nearly impossible to get a decent amount of money any faster than just playing through the game. Which by the way, 36 hours of Nightfall, without buying a thing, only selling my loot, and how much money do I come up with? well, guess! after the whole game, I came up with only 20K! 20K! thats it! and this was after several gold drops (most were useless) some runes (again useless) and several hundred Orange dyes (for some reason I never found any others.) I am sure that after I spend some 20 more hours or so doing all the quests I would end up with more money, but I still wont be very rich.

there is just no effective way to get any money anymore. I see very few, if any players with any expensive armors anymore. and the only ones who do, are the ones smart enough to do massive amounts of farming, gathering hundreds of thousands of Gold before the big nerf updates. Take the Gameamp site for example, http://guildwars.gameamp.com, I saw people posting screenshots showing all their loot, saying that they were ready for nightfall. with all the gold they had. Well I was dumb enough to not do any farming, which I still don't like doing very often, and now I have about 30K in gold, several gold items (all of which are useless!!!), some inscriptions, a green item, and thats it from Nf, no new armor, nothing.

the Incriptions were a really neat part to the game, but nearly all of them are useless. The one that increase item value to merchants, and the one that makes items highly salvagable are allright. I expiremented with several items and even got a ruby off of a gold focus item, which is where a quarter of my money came from in nightfall. but it doesn't really add much to the game as a whole, and probably just kills the player economy even more.

All the usual spots for gathering into parties and dashing through in hopes of getting something good, or atleast alot of gold, which would be the elite missions in Factions, and the Tomb of the Primeval Kings in Prophecies, are empty, there is no players anymore. And Elona even seems completely empty. I see people in Lion's Arch, and some places in Cantha selling their latest finds, but that is it. Everywhere else there is usually nothing, even in Elona, where most players have migrated to. They just keep to themselves now with the hero system, not even wanting to sell off their latest rares, because they want their heroes to have it, which for Nightfall, this has effectively killed the player economy. We don't even need to worry about an auction house anymore because there isnt going to be anyone selling there. Not to mention that many rare items are increasingly impossible to find.

what all this ranting is amounting to is this. I don't think that the game has become boring, heck just play through the last areas of the game, it will give anyone a run for their money for several days.

The game just seems empty, something is just missing about it now since the latest updates.

Quintal · Nov 13, 2006, 07:03 AM // 07:03

I think a key point to the problem here is the "chapter" structure.

I keep seeing a lot of people saying they have 10+ characters, 3000+ hours, ect ect... Those are numbers I'd expect to see on an mmo that has a monthly fee with regular large updates.

Pick up any other game with no monthly fee in the store for 50 bucks. Do you expect to get 3000+ hours of entertainment from it? Not really.

I think people are answering their own questions when they say they have 10+ characters with x number of titles and such. Of course you're bored, you've played the same game for 3000+ hours!

GW is advertised as an mmo, and frankly it's not. It's a normal multiplayer game that caters to a casual style of play. Anet just doesn't design the game around a hardcore gamer who uses up all the content so fast.

This has been Anet's stance from the start. I honestly think a lot of people here are trying to treat GW as a normal MMO, and that's where the problems arise.

If you're not here for the PvP, done with the story, and want to have a game that lasts 3000+ hours.. I think you're in the wrong place and a "true" mmo would be better suited.

My self, I only play GW off and on for the PvP and as something fun to do now and again. When I want a game with a living world that lasts forever.. I play EQ, WoW, or FFXI (have accounts in all actually =p ). There's a reason those games have a monthly fee, and a reason they last so long (EQ's been going HOW long now?).

If you accept GW for what it is, a casual multiplayer game with great pvp, it's very satisfying.

I just can't accept wanting "neverending" content for no monthly fee. Anet is taking a drastically different approach to online gaming, perhaps this is just the end result of their experiment?

Thom Bangalter · Nov 13, 2006, 07:07 AM // 07:07

If I wanted PvE Grind, I'd buy world of warcraft. The real end-game is pvp. I just wish gaile came in and talked to us pvpers as much as she does the folks in Lion's arch id1.

Quintal · Nov 13, 2006, 07:11 AM // 07:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thom Bangalter

If I wanted PvE Grind, I'd buy world of warcraft. The real end-game is pvp. I just wish gaile came in and talked to us pvpers as much as she does the folks in Lion's arch id1.

I fully agree (and DO play WoW for PvE grind!) PvP is the one thing that GW does leaps and bounds better than any other game.

Edit: I find it very ironic that just the other day there was a huge post here flaming the gamespot review of NF for having the view that it's "the same old thing". Just goes to show the dichotomy of the forum community ^^

Bobbbo Ob · Nov 13, 2006, 07:17 AM // 07:17

@ Quintal

I have only one character that has been through all three campaigns, and I also have a PvP character. that is it. and I only have 450 hours of playing in 14 months. I am not a PvE grinder, nor a PvP grinder, I just play Guildwars to play it.

And you do make a good point, but then again, everyone here does have a good point too. ANET and NCsoft did advertise it originally as an MMORPG with "NO MONTHLY FEES!!!!" which is how they got two million players to begin with, which is also the reason why six months later they lose half a million players because ANet can't add any free content because of their strict schedule of releasing new games every six months.

Quote:

I fully agree (and DO play WoW for PvE grind!) PvP is the one thing that GW does leaps and bounds better than any other game.

which is why they sell PvP editions of all three games.

Sid Soggybottom · Nov 13, 2006, 07:20 AM // 07:20

Even though I'm mostly a PVE guy, I have to agree that GW is geared towards PVP and not a "true" MMO. So yeah, I have to scratch my head whenever I see complaints that there's no "endgame" stuff to do for PVE players, didnt you realize that this was a "budget" type game? And these people expect too much from a non monthly fee casual player oriented game like this. If anything, this game has a LOT of value and content for what you're paying for.

Arcador · Nov 13, 2006, 07:24 AM // 07:24

Let me give an example of me. As most humans I like variety, but unlike them I accept change.
I play PvE around 1-2 hours per 2-3 days and I get somewhat bored with it, as probably with the many games I played. For pvp (with my guild) this time is a lot longer than hour or two (especially when you get excited), but this is personal preference.
So getting back to the point. The good side of GW (for me) is that even I play that little I still can go to all areas and I offer equal competive technical level for PvP (of course the player skills differ here a lot, but that is not the point). I like GW because it is a game, that does not force you to stay and "play" as some mmorpg out there that have all lost their "G for game" since they began to praise the grind.
I play a lot other games too, now the new NWN2, even will try Gothic 3 when some descent patch fixes the major bugs. But this do not stop me from playing GW. It is funny how some people declair - I STOP GW CUZ OF xxx UPDATE, I GO TO NWN2. Life is complex thing, you should not force yourself to only 1 thing otherwise you risk at the age of 40 to get bored of everything for 1 hour.
Quintal said it good - add variety and you will be happy playing all games for long time

MerLock · Nov 13, 2006, 07:33 AM // 07:33

I agree with the poster.

Prophecies offered a lot of variety of things to do at the end of the game for those who liked PvE. (Farming, Running Services, etc.)

Now the PvE seems to be a grind because of locked areas and the need to grind sunspear rank to continue further.

The things that I thought were done right were.

AI was good
Ability to run anywhere without having to follow the strict primary quests
The ability to gain skills from quests

Those were good things in my opinion that should've remained the core of the game.

Gun Pierson · Nov 13, 2006, 07:52 AM // 07:52

This game has 100 times more pve content than pvp content. And frankly this has nothing to do with you pvp players. It's about the ai changes, farming nerfs, etc. I don't want the WOW grind which is comparing apples with oranges. I want to play gw like it was for over a year since prophecies was released. We had a strong pve community, a strong market with it's ups and downs.

So don't come in here with your pvp attitude and lecture us, if it wasn't for the pve player base this game wouldn't be what it is today. And Anet knew this.

garethporlest18 · Nov 13, 2006, 08:45 AM // 08:45

Yes how would it hurt you people who are trying to defend what we are complaining about, how would them putting it back the way it is hurt you? What I am asking is why are you defending something when it's not going to hurt you in anyway, in fact in might benefit you?

I see that you who are defending are trying to give debate to this but I'm asking why, what does it do for you and why, if Anet changes it back, will that hurt you?

**cosyfiep** · Nov 13, 2006, 09:00 AM // 09:00

10 pages and I am still awake.

I am bored. I have not finished nightfall. I never have farmed. I cant pvp worth a dammn.

Why am I bored? Well I tend to agree with many of the posters here, and then I do have some of my own opinions.
When factions came out everyone complained it was too short and such....if nightfall had come out before factions I think people would have been happier.

However; I do feel that with recent changes to the ai and the hero system that the game is a totally different game then what I had intended to buy. As a caster I dont really care that the monsters run around, just means my camera makes me dizzy with turning me round and round. I DO, however; care that the drops have been horrible at best (I got 6 sets of non-max steel daggers from non-assassin monsters....why so many daggers????) and not a single gold drop worth more than 90 gold so far. (and only 1 gold drop since I started playing nf.....arrrgh

). AND the hero system-----it just sucks. Now we dont have to pug, we can just use our own heros......if I am not mistaken wasnt this game called GUILD wars, not heros r us????????? I never have to look for a pug again, which means I really dont need to have this be an internet game anylonger. Secondly with 14 heros for each of my characters just working with them makes me tired. Yes, I do understand that all of the heros dont need to be level 20, but at some point each one is needed for some quest or other and having a level 6 or 10 character dying in the level 24 mobs and having to redo the quest just doesnt make me a happy camper.

I have been trying for titles....my tyrian monk has 3 titles already and just .4% short of another one.....I have spent hours and hours getting masters on missons, doing bonuses and just mapping areas with 6 toons....I dont feel like doing this in nightfall for some reason. Prophecy missions I still do and like doing, even some of the faction areas are fun to visit (not the slums though). I just cant see myself trying to get all 8 of my non-mule characters thru nightfall. I have already given up on my paragon who had made it to 130K xp when I died---just dont feel like playing her anymore (yes I did read the post about this...) so she is now a mule as well.
Other things of interest in game content----armor. Factions had neat new armor that I wanted for most of my characters (ok my monk didnt want any, but he is the only male character I have as well).....nightfall armors, besides being blank and needing to buy more insignias for them arent that neat. Only the mesmer and the ele armors even slightly implore me to get them....the others are just horrid!

So in short I believe that I may be bored because there is just too much to do ---leveling heros and 20 missions of kiting ai-s for 8 toons AND then no reward for finishing the game, heck no rewards along the way either, eg no good drops, chests have been nerfed, are there greens in elona? I have seen none.....just seems so pointless now to do this with all of my toons. And with the bad drops just trying to get money to get those dang insignias and new skills, etc is just not worth it. Bored, overwhlemed, and underwhelmed all at the same time. Think they did a good job getting all that in just one expansion and update.

And no, I probably wont be buying another chapter either, they have all the money I wish to give them already. So I spend most of my day now here on this forum, reading other posts and looking at horrible screenshots threads and some good ones as well......

sorry for the long post....and before anyone rebutes me....this is MY opinion and I dont really care if you dont agree with it, I am just stating it as is my right on this subject on this forum. (until I am otherwise banned).