Curse

False Truth · Jan 04, 2007, 06:16 PM // 18:16

Another thing that doesn't make sense, is people blindly agreeing with your recommended suggestion without even giving a hint of why. Can this be explained a bit further please? You can freely insult my intelligence if you want, but I'm just asking for more explanation.

DeanBB · Jan 04, 2007, 06:17 PM // 18:17

Lets make it even easier, delete everything except warriors and monks. Then reduce them to 8 skills each. That should do the trick.

Cracko · Jan 04, 2007, 06:17 PM // 18:17

@Yan: Your saying AB's FA and JQ suck, oh wait.. RA? yaaahh..

beanerman_99 · Jan 04, 2007, 06:18 PM // 18:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ebony Shadowheart

Ugh someone close this pointless thread!

Best idea of this whole thread. /signed

Skyy High · Jan 04, 2007, 06:19 PM // 18:19

Either you're an idiot, or a troll.

In case of idiocy: care to explain why pets, shouts, spirits, and minions are all stupid gameplay mechanics? Also, care to explain why you think that high level gvg seems to be the ONE AND ONLY game type that matters at all, and that skills that don't see play there are automatically trash?

In case of trolling: GTFO.

Yanman.be · Jan 04, 2007, 06:19 PM // 18:19

I never said AB FA AND JQ suck. But they're clearly PvE. And RA is not high-end PvP. (No wonder I own that place! )

Ebony Shadowheart · Jan 04, 2007, 06:20 PM // 18:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yanman.be

ALL skills for PvE.

Limited amount for high-end PvP. So your AB's and FA and JQ will remain open to all skills.

BUT! All skills in the pvp deck will be balanced thoroughly, and that balance will affect PvE too.

I don't see how this would help. You'll end up with cookie cutter builds, and gimmicks that you may be unable to counter due to limited skills. Even balanced completely (and this really isn't very likely) variety is the 'spice to life'. Yes pvpers in general perfer certain skills and there are certains skills that counter them, etc but how do you ever figure out if there is anything better if you dont have variety and options? Perhaps I just don't get it b/c I'm not a hardcore pvper atm.

Perynne · Jan 04, 2007, 06:20 PM // 18:20

Basically you just want to suck all the useful skills out of PvE. I have a ranger, a ritualist and an assassin, and deleting the skills you suggested would completely destroy the builds I use.

I'm sorry to tell you this, but the game is not just about PvP, there's a large amount of players who are not into hacking other players. For them, the rich variety of skills is only a good thing.

Cracko · Jan 04, 2007, 06:22 PM // 18:22

I dont see the point how this can ever help us. Not posting anymore, If you cant find the skills between ~150 skills of each profession, maybe you should learn some alphabetics.

cr3ature · Jan 04, 2007, 06:23 PM // 18:23

like the idea, do think some skills would need a reconsidering, and would also like atleast a few more skills option per line (around 10-15 per attribute line)

hmm, posting something that would actually make the game better, probably dont work when you have with PvE'ers, that start to whine when the AI of the monsters get better, same with this, the PvE noobs that have their godlike skills like BackFire, aura of the lich and mending

MirkoTeran · Jan 04, 2007, 06:24 PM // 18:24

Perfect time to use "Standard Flame Reply (tm)"

Quote:

Dear:
[ ] Clueless Newbie [X] Lamer [ ] AOLer
[ ] "Me too" er [ ] Pervert [ ] Geek
[ ] Spammer [ ] Nerd [ ] Elvis
[ ] Fed [ ] Freak [ ] Cryogenic
[ ] Scammer [X] Troller [X] Pre-teen

You Are Being Flamed Because:
[ ] You posted MODs in pieces LESS than 5000 lines
[ ] You posted something asking for warez sites
[ ] You quoted an ENTIRE post in your reply
[ ] You continued a long, stupid thread
[X] You started an off-topic thread
[ ] You posted a "YOU ALL SUCK" message
[X] You posted a blatantly obvious troll
[ ] You posted pretending to be someone famous (See "troll" above)
[ ] You said "me too" to something
[X] You make no sense
[ ] Your sig/alias/server is dreadful
[ ] You posted a phone-sex ad
[ ] You posted a stupid pyramid money making scheme and claimed it was legal
[ ] You posted in ElItE CaPiTaLs because you think that makes you cool
[ ] You didn't do anything specific, but appear to be so generally worthless that you are being flamed anyway

To Repent, You Must:
[X] Give up your AOL account
[X] Bust up your modem with a hammer and eat it
[X] Tell your Mommy to increase your medication
[X] Jump into a bathtub while holding your monitor
[ ] Actually post something relevant
[ ] Read the FAQ
[X] Be the guest of honor in alt.flame for a month

In Closing, I'd Like to Say:
[ ] Get Wrecked
[ ] Get a life
[ ] Never post again
[ ] Age 10 more years before you post again
[ ] I pity your dog
[ ] Go tell your mother/father/test tube they failed
[ ] Yer momma's so fat/stupid/ugly that etc...
[ ] Take your gibberish somewhere else
[ ] Get a clue, you pathetic loser
[ ] Learn to post or get off the internet
[X] All of the above

beanerman_99 · Jan 04, 2007, 06:25 PM // 18:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ebony Shadowheart

I don't see how this would help. You'll end up with cookie cutter builds, and gimmicks that you may be unable to counter due to limited skills. Even balanced completely (and this really isn't very likely) variety is the 'spice to life'. Yes pvpers in general perfer certain skills and there are certains skills that counter them, etc but how do you ever figure out if there is anything better if you dont have variety and options? Perhaps I just don't get it b/c I'm not a hardcore pvper atm.

No Ebony, you understand it very well actually. The OP is just mad about something that probably happened to him in PvP and wants to get rid of all the skills and counters to the skills HE uses. I just understand how you can have "complete" balance in a game like this. One skill HAS to be slightly better than another or there would be no winning. You would seriously just stand around looking at each other because your skills would totally negate each other.

This thread is pointless.

martialis · Jan 04, 2007, 06:25 PM // 18:25

Quote:

Note that this isn't my personal opinion, as I love gimmicks, but this is just a proposal to satisfy what seems to be the vast majority of players who want a small meta with true balance.

3 | Sunspear Rebirth Signet | 1

This is the best post ever. I fear I might die from its awesomeness.

10/10

Sister Brianne · Jan 04, 2007, 06:26 PM // 18:26

Mending is used in PvP....Mystic Wrath spike...so HA!

Trevor Reznik · Jan 04, 2007, 06:27 PM // 18:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skyy High

Either you're an idiot, or a troll.

In case of idiocy: care to explain why pets, shouts, spirits, and minions are all stupid gameplay mechanics? Also, care to explain why you think that high level gvg seems to be the ONE AND ONLY game type that matters at all, and that skills that don't see play there are automatically trash?

In case of trolling: GTFO.

Pets, minions, and some spirits are all AI. AI in a game that pits players against players is a bad idea. It's not controllable, and leads to frustration in fighting against and alongside it. Shouts and defensive spirits are mindless. A half brained monkey could plop out spirits with rit lord, or stand in the middle of his team and spam his shout buttons on recycle. Furthermore, shouts can't be removed, nor even seen by allies or enemies. Thus, minions/pets are stupid mechanics because they rely on AI to win the fight for you, and spirits and shouts require minimal skill to use.

In case you guys didn't notice-this is for GvG balance. All other balance is irrelevant.

Now you gtfo.

lagrand1 · Jan 04, 2007, 06:27 PM // 18:27

At first I thought OP was joking, but when I saw how much time he put into the list, I think he's actually serious. Now I'm not one to flame, but with all due respect, this the single dumbest idea I've seen in a long time. And I said "with all due respect" so it wasn't flaming.

miles · Jan 04, 2007, 06:29 PM // 18:29

First off i thought i had to set this straight...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ebony Shadowheart

So you're saying ALL those skills need to be deleted?

Yeah right. I know many people that use quite a few of those skills. You just essentailly said the all warriors should be sword because you want most of all the axe and hammer skills removed. Obviously you don't like air eles, there go the air skills. Ele attune used in conjunction with a specific attune (ie fire attune) makes it near impossible to run out of energy, except in certain cases such as energy sapping mesmers or spamming flare (5e spells).

No spirits or pets or chants or shouts? Why don't we just delete the entire factions and nightfall games while you're at it? We'll just have prophecies and it'll be all good.

/roll eyes

The skills are there for a reason. Just because YOU don't use them, or feel they are useful to you does not mean that everyone else feels the same way. There are several on that list that I use and that many people I know use. Hell, just watching people in AB, I see quite a few of those used. Take Verata's Aura, its a great example. Necros (and several other classes with necro 2ndary) are forever stealing minions in AB. No, its not all that useful in general PvE or hardcore PvP, but it does have it's place.

You completely snuffed out sins, rits, dervish, and paragons. You've removed MMs and so many other builds that I've lost count. No more bonders, or prot monks....heck looks like you want to remove essentially everything. What would be the point in playing if you dont have options?

do you realise who you are talking to/lecturing? Trevor was in the guild who MADE fast cast air spike. Im sure he knows much more than he ever wanted to about the air line, aswell as how damn good ele attune can be.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redly

So sorry Trevor... I don't feel that your idea is consistent with a basic philosophy of the game.

As a PvPer, doesn't it give you a sense of pride when you master some new combo or build, or if you come up with something you've never seen in play before? Even if some skills start rolling through metagame, it's usually easy enough to create a counter for it. As a crude example, Searing Flames recently became the new flavor--and yet, with some silliness such as Mantra of Flame, Frigid Armor, or liberal use of Cautery Signet or Martyr and the like, it becomes easy enough to roll through for even the more PvE Scrub guilds.

Balance may be easier with fewer skills, but it would also arguably be better if we removed weapon choices for the warrior, or even entire professions. That doesn't make it the answer, however. PvP would be reduced to nothing but a test in who can execute the faster Infuse Health. -_-

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~

P.S. That list is so confusing at first...

you originally are saying that a large skill list is justified by gimicky builds being beaten by a more gimicky counter skill? and your last sentence about pvp becoming a faster infuse health... so, if the skills were deleted as trevor suggested than every single game will become a spike somehow? wow

if you think AB are pvp, think glimmer of mark is a viable skill or that the game in general is balanced, dont even bother reading my post because it will only anger you further...

as for the 4 ppl remaining, With the release of each new update all these skills have become a nusiance to the rest of the game as trevor has pointed out. Although his skill list may not be the best, it should at the very least give a general idea of what should be purposed/done to this rapidly declining game that we know and love. This game is great, just some of these new skills have diverted attention away from certain things in the game that really need looked at, and i think that this would be a turning point in allowing Anet a chance in getting to those more dificult tasks.

leprekan · Jan 04, 2007, 06:29 PM // 18:29

NO WAY! I can't lose headbutt it is the elite all my monks use.

Alya · Jan 04, 2007, 06:30 PM // 18:30

Really? Do you really think that Blessed Aura, Mending, Dodge, Serpent's Quickness, Purge Conditions, Spell Breaker must be DELETED? Thanks, you've just killed my most successful Southern Shiverpeak runner.

Why do you PvPers think that if some skills are not used in PvP, they ought to be completely eradicated? There are other things in GW apart from PvPing, if you have not noticed it yet...

I don't even want to discuss this seriously.

Sister Brianne · Jan 04, 2007, 06:31 PM // 18:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by beanerman_99

One skill HAS to be slightly better than another or there would be no winning. You would seriously just stand around looking at each other because your skills would totally negate each other.

Thats not totally true....

The game would come down to who could play the one available build the best.

Creativeness, ingenuity, and most thinking would be removed however.