Curse

savage vapor 33 · Mar 02, 2007, 06:23 AM // 06:23

My guild is very new to GVG, many of you have probably faced us. We try different builds and try copycat builds, pretty much everything that everyone else runs.

The problem is, we are rank 5,000. From the day we started, at N/A, we have faced top 1000 guilds. We are a fairly noob guild when it comes to GVG, but why can't Anet just pair us up with someone of the same caliber? Is that so hard to ask?

How are younger, and inexperienced guilds supposed to move up in ranks, if they always have to fight someone head over heals better than them? It's more of a self esteem killer rather than being able to improve on your mistakes.

Does anyone else think Ladder needs to be changed so High Ranked guilds face high ranked guilds? I would love opinions on this.

notskorn · Mar 02, 2007, 06:37 AM // 06:37

The ladder is pointless right now. They were supposed to roll out the automated tournaments in january but since they have been pushed back to april the ladder will continue to be worthless for a few months.

Bankai · Mar 02, 2007, 06:49 AM // 06:49

Well, what do you think?

You won't be paired with them, because they're currently playing a match or not playing at all.

They can also let you wait for 45 minutes for a match, but they decided not to. You can learn quite a lot from facing higher-ranked players.

savage vapor 33 · Mar 02, 2007, 06:57 AM // 06:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bankai

Well, what do you think?

You won't be paired with them, because they're currently playing a match or not playing at all.

They can also let you wait for 45 minutes for a match, but they decided not to. You can learn quite a lot from facing higher-ranked players.

I do agree that you can learn a lot...But not everyday. I have learned mostly from watching observer, and watching high ranked guilds. But when ur the losing guild on the other end, daily, it gets annoying. Especially when you know your going to get rolled.

sixdartbart · Mar 02, 2007, 11:22 AM // 11:22

Hi Savage;
One good place to start with your problem is stop knowing that you're going to get rolled

I know it can be frustrating when you are trying to get started and trying to improve but it WILL get better, your players will get better/more confident and you will look back on this and smile. [I know it sounds like total bs but hang in there]
They try to make the system match up teams as evenly as they can but there will always be some gaps between the teams. Wait til you guys are top 500 and catch a few top 50s a night.

GL and I'm glad to see some new people making the effort but always remember HAVE FUN thats why your here!

fenix · Mar 02, 2007, 12:08 PM // 12:08

The thing I'd do if I were you guys (I was not too long ago, when we remade our guild and had to shake loose cobwebs), is I'd watch obs, and find a build that is almost guaranteed to get you wins again average guilds. So run something really powerful. Basically you want to find a build that is already perfected, so that all you have to do is work on the strats, and once you get them sorted, you can start developing your own builds

savage vapor 33 · Mar 02, 2007, 10:53 PM // 22:53

Has Anet said anything about changing the ladder? I know they aren't going to reset it right now. Has there been any talk about it?

HawkofStorms · Mar 03, 2007, 01:53 AM // 01:53

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elo_rating_system

^ If you want to come up with a better mathematical system for rating and pairing guilds then this physist, good luck.

Antheus · Mar 03, 2007, 02:37 AM // 02:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by HawkofStorms

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elo_rating_system

^ If you want to come up with a better mathematical system for rating and pairing guilds then this physist, good luck.

Much more suitable for games, and already working:
http://research.microsoft.com/mlp/tr...l/Details.aspx

The problem is, that in GW, you simply don't have anyone else to pair against. It's not that the system is broken - there just isn't any other rank 5000 teams waiting to enter at the time you want to. So you're matched against lowest team available.

Lykan · Mar 03, 2007, 04:03 AM // 04:03

Find an alliance with guilds of your calibur and play them in unranked matches, you wont get high on the ladder but you will get experience. You might even win a game

*lemming* · Mar 03, 2007, 09:14 AM // 09:14

Ladder rank at the lower end is extremely uninformative - there may very well only be a few wins separating you from rank 1000. In short, you're basically of the same caliber as any guild within that range.

If you win enough to get your rank to 2000, does this mean that you're better than the 3000 guilds you just surpassed? No.

Gustin · Mar 03, 2007, 09:50 AM // 09:50

the rank really has nothing to do with it. GW's system matches you up by your rating. and I believe it's in incriments of 50 or 25? first it tries to find a guild within 25 or 50 rating of you, if none or found it increases that by 25 or 50, and continues until it finds a guild waiting to match you with. you could be rank 5000 and another guild could be rank 500, but if you both have a rating of 1000 you'll get matched pretty quick.

Morganas · Mar 03, 2007, 10:05 AM // 10:05

Just don't worry about rank if you're new. Really rank 5000 isn't far away or different from 1000. That matching system really works best for midranked guilds, once you hit about 500 or so your rank stops changing so drastically, so you can afford to lose a bit.

Really, the fastest way to rise up in the ranks is to play those high ranking guilds your complaining about. Don't run a gimmick copycat, run a balanced build ripped from a top 100 guild, and get GOOD at it. After EVERY SINGLE match, your entire guild should go into observer mode and watch your last match, and scrutinize every single thing your team did, and try and learn from and mimmick what the other team did. Don't spend this time watching top guilds fight. Watching your own guild fight a higher ranked guild is far more informative.

Don't be afraid to call on your bad players to get better, and tell them how to do it. I guest for noob guilds sometimes, and the leader being afraid to criticize his players is a common pattern in noob guilds, as opposed to higher ranked guilds. Guild wars isn't a difficult game, and any group of players can get good enough to beat even rank 200ish guilds some of the time, if they practice alot and are willing to learn from loss.

Oh, and the ladder is just fine. If the game didn't match players against much higher ranked guild, then wait times would be insanely long (low rank guilds play alot less than higih ranked ones), and those low ranked guilds wouldn't get good nearly as quickly than if they were matched against higher ranking guilds.

savage vapor 33 · Mar 03, 2007, 10:19 AM // 10:19

You all have been very informative and very helpful. You can close this thread if need be. My flaming is done