Curse

crimsonfilms · May 09, 2007, 09:05 PM // 21:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by lyra_song

An ad hominem argument, also known as argumentum ad hominem (Latin: "argument to the person", "argument against the man") consists of replying to an argument by attacking or appealing to the person making the argument, rather than by addressing the substance of the argument. It is most commonly used to refer specifically to the ad hominem abusive, or argumentum ad personam, which consists of criticizing or personally attacking an argument's proponent in an attempt to discredit that argument.

Ravengar's point remains valid. You need to stick to the point instead of insulting him.

Address the point why marginalizing a player's achievements is ok.

Uhm yea, now he can actually spend time learning to PvP - so he can get the same crap on his other chars. Wow!

Why is he complaining again?

lyra_song · May 09, 2007, 09:05 PM // 21:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Narcism

Okay, coming from someone who use gothic axes, chaos axes, fellblades and brute swords on his pve toon in pvp(me), ravengar is being selfish.

Selfishness is irrelevant. The point still remains.

Address the point.

Why is marginalizing something that took effort (and time) ok to do?

crimsonfilms · May 09, 2007, 09:15 PM // 21:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by lyra_song

Selfishness is irrelevant. The point still remains.

Address the point.

Why is marginalizing something that took effort (and time) ok to do?

Uhm, since it does not modify current PvE chars - you are right selfishness is irrelevant thus the QQing over the reward. Thus no reason to complain since its just a selfish(thus irrelevant) argument.

Quantum Duck · May 09, 2007, 09:20 PM // 21:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by lyra_song

Why is marginalizing something that took effort (and time) ok to do?

If awards were being handed to only one side for nothing while the other side worked for it, I'd see a point here. But I fail to see how allowing an alternative method of seeking to aquiring an award marginalizes any previous method of aquiring that reward.

Taki · May 09, 2007, 09:27 PM // 21:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir Skullcrasher

I thought it's a good thing to reward both PvP and PvE side regardless what our preference are!!

QFE. Your parents raised you right.

Quote:

The point is this.

In a PvP environment, with UAX, PvP has readily access to more skills, more weapon mods, more runes and armor mods than a PVE character who is stuck with their primary and has to buy runes, armor and weapon mods.

They are supposed to. Remember all the hype about being able to skip story mode and jump right into the action with a max-level PvP character? This along with player skill over time spent was emphasised anywhere and everywhere leading up to the release of Guild Wars. But that was far from the truth. Not only did you have to unlock weapon mods and runes but you even had to unlock skills. SKILLS!!! Skills you needed to play the game but didn't have access to. What kind of sick twisted shit is that?

You don't start a fighting game with 10/100 possible moves; you don't begin a game of chess with missing pieces; you don't start a game of counter-strike/UT/Quake with a knife and have to stab people just to unlock a gun to fight properly. But you do if you play Guild Wars. And not only did you have to unlock all this shit but you had to do so at painfully slow, frustrating rate.

Quote:

The PVE player sacrifices flexibility for vanity.

No. The PvE player sacrifces flexibility for the experience of story mode.

I had more but my internet connection died and I can't be bothered to retype. Everything has already been said anyway, somewhere between the filth.

Yichi · May 09, 2007, 09:28 PM // 21:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by lyra_song

Selfishness is irrelevant. The point still remains.

Address the point.

Why is marginalizing something that took effort (and time) ok to do?

Exactically how is your PVE character marginalized because a few skins will be available to PVP players and NO ONE has a clue as to what these skins are.....

Swift Thief · May 09, 2007, 09:31 PM // 21:31

Can people stop complaining, this is a free new update. If you don't want different skins on a PvP character, then you don't have to get them. It's your choice really, this did nothing bad.

Hell Raiser · May 09, 2007, 09:34 PM // 21:34

Imo this is just ArenaNet's way of shadowing the PvP problems. You PvPers are falling for it. You have new skins to unlock, yet there are so many balancing and bug problems. Are you seriously happy?!

I highly doubt new skins will include Crystalline/FoW armor, my guess is something like Forked Sword/1.5k Sunspear. I don't believe Anet said anything about ALL skins being unlockable. Just adding a few of the lower-end skins gives a lot of variety.

I do a fair share of both PvP and PvE. I don't like doing just one side, it gets boring. Doing both keeps things interesting. I find the PvE community a lot better, except the high end (DoA-type) people. And high end PvP is just terrible.

The thing I'm loling at right now is HvH, it's a total joke. I'm still pondering why Anet is putting so much into it. Imo HvH is the most laughable addition to PvP since RA. Especially in its current state. Now they are doing real money prizes? Meh, I guess this is a different discussion.

Tempy · May 09, 2007, 09:37 PM // 21:37

*wonders just how many PvP'ers would be bitching if the roles were reversed. Imagine any PvE toon gets the first PvP rank emote at level 20, the next one at 10 skill points above that, and so on and on. Open to everyone, ohhhh boo hoo you worked to get that flashy emote...oh well

Icy DS · May 09, 2007, 09:41 PM // 21:41

Wammos' Stop Complaining And Learn To Change Your Secondary!

kthx

Yichi · May 09, 2007, 09:47 PM // 21:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tempy

*wonders just how many PvP'ers would be bitching if the roles were reversed. Imagine any PvE toon gets the first PvP rank emote at level 20, the next one at 10 skill points above that, and so on and on. Open to everyone, ohhhh boo hoo you worked to get that flashy emote...oh well

Because getting to lvl 20 takes so much skill whereas fighting to get fame in a Player vs Player (note no ai or missions or monsters... aparently people dont grasp this concept...) doesnt.... /end sarcasm...

this is the type of stupid ass comments that derail a topic when it comes to pvp. its when pve fans come in and make off the wall dumbass comments liek this that turns things into a flame war.

Here I can make one paragraph to put this to rest...

All they announced is that pvp only characters will have the ability to unlock different skins than the standard generic ones we already have. NO WHERE did ANET every say that it would be a rare skin. No where did anet every say that the skin would be so outstanding that the pvp community will be the only ones to have such a thing. No where does it say that they wont be just normal skins aka wingblade, cleaver, ball hammer, etc... that you dont find a dime a dozen in PVE already... or basic 1.5k armors that arent in the character selection menu, aka 1.5k istani and sunspear.... Instead of just running off and jumping to conclusions when they announce that you can unlock new PVP weapon skins, why not just wait abotu things and gather your information first. Then if it becomes a problem afterwards, then bitch about it...

Icy DS · May 09, 2007, 09:55 PM // 21:55

As for the role reversal comment...

Who cares about emotes anymore...I stopped tombing 2 years ago...hell, give all pvers tigers i don't care.

Hell is tombs even in the game anymore?

Oh btw, to the guy who said tombs takes skill, go take a look on obs mode, any pver who can complete a campaign (believe it or not they are far and few between) can get easily 100/day running searing flames.

Tombs died 2 years ago, the only people still playing:

A) Like the tombing and do it for enjoyment

B) Are small dicked fame drones looking to enlarge their epeen

Tempy · May 09, 2007, 09:57 PM // 21:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by MistressYichi

Because getting to lvl 20 takes so much skill whereas fighting to get fame in a Player vs Player (note no ai or missions or monsters... aparently people dont grasp this concept...) doesnt.... /end sarcasm...

BTW, IWAY (and alot of the other FotM builds)didn't take skill, and as already brought up, too many people have paid for their ranks...so in the same token, standing back letting your friends or person(s) you paid to get your rank is SOOOOOO hard.

I did both aspects of the game, and actually earned my rank the hard way. PvP was killed a long time ago, but cheating any PvE only items to give to PvP is another kick in the face to PvE, and to a point one to PvP too. Too bad they can't come up with a real way to demonstrate skill and ability, one that can't be bought or gimmicked.

Bruce Leeroy · May 09, 2007, 10:00 PM // 22:00

I want to unlock mini Ghostly Hero for my PvE toon!

Shadis · May 09, 2007, 10:06 PM // 22:06

PvE'ers should get Fame and Faction for completing the late game PvE areas. Also a large chest should spawn for them at the conclusion of each area containing Sigils, rare skinned weapons, miniatures (formerly only available to PvP players) and practically anything else in the game.

Why not? It's only fair.

Narcism · May 09, 2007, 10:24 PM // 22:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadis

PvE'ers should get Fame and Faction for completing the late game PvE areas. Also a large chest should spawn for them at the conclusion of each area containing Sigils, rare skinned weapons, miniatures (formerly only available to PvP players) and practically anything else in the game.

Why not? It's only fair.

Are you waiting for a PvP player to say: OH NO YOU CANT DO THAT? So you can post and then say SEE THE POINT I WAS GETTING AT.

But seriously, I don't know a pvp player who would give a shit about this.

Yichi · May 09, 2007, 10:24 PM // 22:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tempy

BTW, IWAY (and alot of the other FotM builds)didn't take skill, and as already brought up, too many people have paid for their ranks...so in the same token, standing back letting your friends or person(s) you paid to get your rank is SOOOOOO hard.

I did both aspects of the game, and actually earned my rank the hard way. PvP was killed a long time ago, but cheating any PvE only items to give to PvP is another kick in the face to PvE, and to a point one to PvP too. Too bad they can't come up with a real way to demonstrate skill and ability, one that can't be bought or gimmicked.

IWAY took way more skill to play effectively against 8 other players, than doing some stupid missions/quests to get expierence.... so yes these 2 corilate perfectly as to why PVE chars should get fame and rank in PVE eventhough its a PVP only reward. NO WHERE in the game does it say that weapons are only limited to PVE. Thats the difference.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadis

PvE'ers should get Fame and Faction for completing the late game PvE areas. Also a large chest should spawn for them at the conclusion of each area containing Sigils, rare skinned weapons, miniatures (formerly only available to PvP players) and practically anything else in the game.

Why not? It's only fair.

OK and honestly WTF would be the point of this. Because yes high end elite PVE only areas translate into PVP success. Honestly are u RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing retarted? because youre seriously acting like it. This is honestly one of the stupidest comments ive seen in this thread and trust me there have been a lot.

This debate is simple. There is no proof that high end pve skins will be available to be unlocked. It isnt going to kill the economy and cause everything to be worthless... It will just be different skins other than the gladius, war axe, etc.... Besides, we have no idea which skins will be available, due to this fact.....

THIS UPDATE HASNT BEEN RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOING IMPLIMENTED YET!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Enciah · May 09, 2007, 10:43 PM // 22:43

Having weapon/armor with pve skin on pvp character is fine.

i'm tired to change 20/20 to fire damage, 10%... on PVE Weapon, or having 3 or more different weapon with the same rare and expenssive skin just because you need different stat and builds are always changing!
PVE skins that you can customise when you want without platine and ectos and lot of farming, time is really nice.

pve's: hours of farming--> crystalline bought
pvp's: same time of pvp--> same crystalline unlock ......I think it's fair!

seut · May 09, 2007, 10:51 PM // 22:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Icy DS

Hell is tombs even in the game anymore?

Yes, it's a pve farming area

Quote:

Originally Posted by Narcism

But seriously, I don't know a pvp player who would give a shit about this.

The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence. If you want an example about PvP'ers whining about PvE changes, read the announcement for changing the Razah quest on the tgh forum.

But people should really wait and see how these skin unlocks will turn out requirement and selection wise. Anet's words are usually bigger than the deeds and people expecting rare skins unlocked in a week will be pretty disappointed.
On the other hand, with Anet giving in to long term player requests like unlockable skins for a cheap promotion of their ATS, we might see other reasonable requests from the PvE side turned into reality (insignia armor and inscription items in cantha & tyria, removal of the favour system, etc.).

Taurucis · May 09, 2007, 11:12 PM // 23:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by MistressYichi

Wow have you people honestly listened to yourself in this thread?

Look heres the deal. you get reward points based on your positioning in the AT's. Any monkey with a brain can figure this out. its based just like the points system in say nascar, baseball's win loss ratio, etc.... The better you do, the more points you get. simple. It will take a vast amount of points to be able to unlock anything, so not only do you have to grind it and farm it like a PVE player would do to get a certain weapon to sell, YOU ALSO HAVE TO BE GOOD AND WIN to at least place high enough to recieve rewards points. Seriously... its not like someone is going to have a PVP only char, go win 5 matches in RA and be like "OMG!!!! I GETZ A ELEMENTAL SWERD!!!!!!1" I love how everyone thinks that its only going to take an hour or so to be able to unlock everything. Ill remind you again, go to the tournament guy in your own guildhall. No where does it say you use faction to unlock any of this. It says reward points. and how do you recieve reward points? You compete in the At's and it is then based on your placement in said tournaments. Simple. So no your PVP player cant just go and get your precious sword in a matter of minutes, where u have to spend a day or two.... Get that thought out of your head.

Well, no PvE player can go out and get a precious sword in a matter of minutes. You have to spend a day or two... even more.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Someone Report This Dude

You sir have to be about the biggest JACKASS i have ever seen to reply to a PVP post. Im ever so glad we have your expert opinion with such misguided facts so that you of all people can set the record straight for us.

First of all, I am a girl. So don't go around calling me sir.
Second of all, what does throwing flames at me earn you? E-Ego? Do you expect me to wither and die?
Third of all, thanks very much you think my opinion is expert.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flamebag

Look its as simple as this. PVE is in no way screwed over. PVE still gets to keep all their fancy skins, some fancy weapons, hell even weapons that PVP players cant get. In no way is your PVE character screwed over. No one says you cant use it and that you shouldnt use it. You put the time and effort into making your character your own. so by all means use it and enjoy it. A lot of PVP players made PVE characters for that same reason and also you used to be able to swap armor in PVP, so it was a dual purpose... but you think there wont be PVE chars used in PVP because people still like their characters? YOURE DEAD WRONG!!!! Also if you think that because a PVP char has the same skin as your PVE char, that now your PVE char is useless, Again YOURE DEAD WRONG!!!! I'm sorry to have burst your bubble... but im sure that you arent the only one running around with an assassin that has celestial daggers, skills, runes, and 15k armor... its been done before, so does that mean your pve character is now useless because somewhere in the 3+ million copies of Guildwars, someone might have a sin that looks like yours?

It's FINE if you think that IT'S FAIR for PvE people to get SCREWED over. IT'S UP TO YOU!!!!! Also, it's fine if you think that YOU get to FREELY INSULT me because I play PvE. Again IT'S UP TO YOU!!!!! I'm sorry to burst your bubble, but I'm sure that you aren't the only one running around trashing PvE because a teeny little level 6 charr demolished you... it's happened before, so does that mean PvE is now useless?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keg O' Insults

You say that PVE constantly gets the shaft to appease the PVP crowd.... yes because PVE gets so little and nothing has ever been done for PVE at all. The only thing 90% of the PVe community bitches about is the skill nerfs/buffs that we the PVP community get to help maintain balance. This game is supposed to be about skill, but thats kinda flawed when you have certian builds that can come up and press 1,2,3,2,3,2,3 and win.... how is that skill? so therefore ANET decided to balance said skill or game mechanics so that this type of build isnt as viable anymore... I can understand PVE farming builds get hurt by this. I understand, because PVP builds that are viable and have nothing to do with said overpowered build can be affected by this also... but that part is never mentioned because its construed as the PVP community bitching too much. We just kinda suck it up for the greater good... so besides trying to maintain a balanced game for all to enjoy, what has ever taken precidence over PVE in this game as far as PVP goes?

Look im ending this post with this. Instead of just randomly flaming things that we know nothing about, try gathering some information and using your head, instead of spewing some random garbage and getting a 7 page long thread about nothing of any importance.

1,2,3,2,3,2,3 <-- Isn't that touch ranger?

Instead of randomly flaming people that you know nothing about, try gathering some manners, instead of spewing some random insults. Oh, and this isn't my thread.

I thought I could just post my thoughts and leave it, but I guess there will always be PvPers chasing me down.