Curse

Patrick Smit · Jun 25, 2007, 05:39 AM // 05:39

Leavers might just leave because the battle is "lost", does not perse need to be leechers present or not. So rewarding after the fight will influence people to stay rather then leave before the the points have been rewarded.

ABout Bots, yes they may be better in some cases then players, but it cannot really handle intelligently, so I prefer still humans as u can make agreements, instructions or whatever (using chat/speech). ANyway bots don't belong in pvp and I think all will agree on that. People going solo aint so bad sometimes, when u can cap with 2-3 persons, while u have a roaming sin about u can have lots of fun. That person can be a real problem to an enemy team. U shouldn't interfere with how people can play the game, as quite some strategies can be effective. Capping is part of it, but forgetting PvP at all times would be a mistake. AN I agree u have people who just run into a mob to die, but u have also people picking of enemies quite intelligently. To focus rewards just on caps would therefore disfavor this style of play.

FlameoutAlchemist · Jun 25, 2007, 05:41 AM // 05:41

I've been in FA battles where the bots locked onto a random teammate and just followed them - didn't use any skills or anything.

I like the idea of a votekick, as I've seen it used to good effect in CS servers before. I'm sure it could be used by a team to griefkick a player they don't like, so it wouldn't be perfect. Not only that, it could be used to kick people who legitimately aren't good at the game yet (first-time PvPers or GW gamers), which could lead to a sense of elitism spreading to these areas.

I've already posted my suggestions on how to deal with this issue partially in Sardelac, but I think the best way for them to deal with this is to actually 'bot-spot' these areas, like Gaile said she did one day out in Granite Citadel. That would bring it to the attention of Anet, and might result in some changes.

Either way, personally, FA and JQ are out of the question for me for the time being. I understand the idea of being rewarded for success and not being rewarded for failure, but when I'm getting absolutely next to nothing for being on the losing team, regardless of my personal performance, where's the incentive for me to keep playing? Many more people would feel the same way before too long, and ABs, in all forms, would theorhetically see a drop in the number of participants.

Engel the Fallen · Jun 25, 2007, 10:38 AM // 10:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liselle Morrow

And a note on leavers: anyone who thinks it's ok to leave a match halfway should seriously consider getting a course in basic human social skills!

If my team is down 100 or 5 shrines in the early going I leave. Why stay if you are aiming for faction if you know the end result will not be worth your time? You can tell usually in a few minutes how the overall battle will turn out.

And I already seen roll stuff. But most people do not get it, so it will not be widespread.

Aera Lure · Jun 25, 2007, 03:06 PM // 15:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Engel the Fallen

If my team is down 100 or 5 shrines in the early going I leave. Why stay if you are aiming for faction if you know the end result will not be worth your time? You can tell usually in a few minutes how the overall battle will turn out.

I agree with Liselle. This sort of behavior is selfishly motivated even if one tries to rationalize it. Problem is, its Anet's lack of thinking the results of the update through that encourages this sort of behavior. What in the world is wrong with them lately?

Engel's statement if nothing else is proof that AB needs a fix now that might override or at least readjust the recent update. I wont be touching AB with a 10 foot pole until it happens since the long wait times combined with the update makes it a collossal waste of time - unless playing simply for fun - but leavers and rage quitting now affects even that.

Quozz · Jun 25, 2007, 03:08 PM // 15:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Engel the Fallen

If my team is down 100 or 5 shrines in the early going I leave. Why stay if you are aiming for faction if you know the end result will not be worth your time? You can tell usually in a few minutes how the overall battle will turn out.

And I already seen roll stuff. But most people do not get it, so it will not be widespread.

And you sir are a prime example of the type of player ABs need less of. Do the community a favor and stop playing until you grow up and understand what sportsmanship is about.
By the way, you cannot predict the outcome of a match in the first few minutes. I have been in a lot of ABs where the tides have changed dramatically.

As for this "attempt" by Anet to cut down on leavers and leechers, it really isn't going to bother the leechers and it will actually create a bigger problem with leavers. The problem isn't going to be resolved until harsh penalties are enforced. In game monitoring is required so leechers can be stamped out (permanent ban if caught leeching in more than one match).

explodemyheart · Jun 25, 2007, 04:01 PM // 16:01

It sucks that AB are in a worse state now than they were before. When something bad gets worse... that's really bad.

I AB for 2 reasons:
1) For faction
or
2) Out of boredom just for something to do

Rarely do I play for both of those reasons at once. If I'm playing just to have something to do, losing for a tiny bit of faction doesn't bother me. However, when I'm trying to gain some faction, I'm constantly losing due to the fact the Luxons don't have the upper hand, and I've got people on my team leaving left and right... I start getting a little annoyed.

I needed 3,000 faction earlier so I could get one of my PvE-only skills, so I decided to AB for it. I stayed each match I played through, I lost every match. An hour or so later, I ended with just a little over 500 faction. In each match I had no less than 4 leavers on my team, a couple of them had leechers, and there was just an all around nasty attitude from people on my teams because most of what was going on was losing horribly and people leaving.

I ended up doing a few quests and in less time than I did AB I had the rest of the 2,500 faction I needed. As far as I'm concerned, AB has lost what little appeal it had left for me. It's nothing more than annoying to do nothing but lose, watch people on your team spout profanities because they're doing nothing but lose, watch people on your team leave due to losing, or others spouting profanities and all for a pinch of faction. With the bad attitudes and the large amount of leavers, the fun appeal has pretty much burnt out as well.

I think Anet has too much faith in their player base. In a perfect world, everybody would be happy with losing and would not leave or shout profanities and the leechers would suddenly care that they're not sitting around the computer not playing GW just to gain 100-200 faction. Unfortunately, this is not a perfect world and Anet's attempt at fixing leechers was seriously misguided, however well intended.

Sarevok Thordin · Jun 25, 2007, 04:13 PM // 16:13

In Character way to deal with leavers

- Have a Lux/Kurz Rep come and detuct 500 faction for each time you leave before a match finishes citing you as a coward. Should incriment by 500 each consecutive time this happens.

In Character Way to deal with Leechers of types I can think of.

- Types that AFK in the base without leaving

Kick and refuse entry for 5 minutes having a rep say they don't like deadwood in the base. Incriment for 5 minutes each time it occurs to a max of an hour or 2. After 30 mins, faction should be dropped.

-Types that lockon to a player and don't use their own "Free" movement

Same as above, but the excuse is to stop being a windcatcher

-Types that follow preset paths to accomplish a goal (Such as collecting amber or something)

Again, but this time citing the need for people with brains and not zombies.

Argh, it's just difficult to think of an automated solution that won't goon actual players.

D8tura · Jun 25, 2007, 06:24 PM // 18:24

what would be awesome is a command like:

/afk "characters name"

after so many people enter it (8/12?) the player is kicked out with no faction and a flag

Rocky Raccoon · Jun 25, 2007, 06:56 PM // 18:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Engel the Fallen

If my team is down 100 or 5 shrines in the early going I leave. Why stay if you are aiming for faction if you know the end result will not be worth your time? You can tell usually in a few minutes how the overall battle will turn out.

And I already seen roll stuff. But most people do not get it, so it will not be widespread.

What do you want, everything handed to you without any effort? I have been on teams that were well over 100 points behind and still came back to win, because everyone kept trying and no one quit.

Shmanka · Jun 25, 2007, 08:34 PM // 20:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Voltar

yeah, i like the idea of it but i'm not sure how it works in practice. i think it's going to have unintended effects.

After Factions came out for the very first time, Anet had alot of unintended affects in this game. This is no surprise at all.

cebalrai · Jun 25, 2007, 09:05 PM // 21:05

AB is so jacked up now. HUGE waits in Grenz (30 mins in Ancestral lands now sometimes), and no reason to keep playing if your team starts to fall behind. There are more quitters than ever.

Anet - please change ABs back to how they were.

Aera Lure · Jun 26, 2007, 02:20 AM // 02:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by D8tura

what would be awesome is a command like:

/afk "characters name"

after so many people enter it (8/12?) the player is kicked out with no faction and a flag

Also, enough such reports and the player is flagged and Anet would notice. I'd think they'd be able to check to see the player did anything in a number of their AB battles via logs, if they record player actions. If they do, and the player can be confirmed by them to have been AFK in multiple games --> BAN.

Omniclasm · Jun 26, 2007, 02:24 AM // 02:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by D8tura

what would be awesome is a command like:

/afk "characters name"

after so many people enter it (8/12?) the player is kicked out with no faction and a flag

afk spike ftw

3...2...1.../afk

Taki · Jun 26, 2007, 03:23 AM // 03:23

Food for thought: revert faction awarded and make it conditional on players answering easy, random questions with choices in random order. Questions would pop-up like a quest reward after the match and have a timer where, if no or an incorrect answer is given, that player receives no faction and the match ends after the timer reaches zero.

The questions could be tied to lore, basic game mechanics, jokes, simple math, or something like "Seclect X from the five options below to claim your faction reward."

Patrick Smit · Jun 26, 2007, 06:02 AM // 06:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by cebalrai

AB is so jacked up now. HUGE waits in Grenz (30 mins in Ancestral lands now sometimes), and no reason to keep playing if your team starts to fall behind. There are more quitters than ever.

Anet - please change ABs back to how they were.

Lets be clear on this, on the luxon side there are hardly any waits. There are just more kurzicks if u ask me. But u can change the rewards to form an incentive to play luxon on grenz or ancestral by increasing the faction reward by 50 and 100% respectively. Vice versa on luxon lands.

BoredJoe · Jun 26, 2007, 09:41 AM // 09:41

Yeah definitely noticing a lot more leavers on the losing side. Can't say I blame them.

Won 6 games in a row in Grenz, for 9000 faction. I would say the losing teams in total for those games got between 600 and 800 faction. Better to leave and hope for a good team, as you will get more faction in one win than staying on in a losing side.

Played in FA, kurzick side, lost and got 64 faction, woot. The thing is there are some combinations on the other side that are almost unbeatable. At the least faction is some consolation. I'd be better of leaving and joining another game knowing that the 2 monks and 3 touch rangers are still playing in the other game.

The maps are so old now I need some kind of incentive to play.

Perfected Shadow · Jun 26, 2007, 10:20 AM // 10:20

I started a thread similar to this yesterday, it vanished into unread land I think. Generally, from observation, the wait time has increased because more players don't bother joining anymore if the map doesn't favor them. That's perfectly understandable.

eg: I lost in a map that favors the other side, the final score was 500-484, as you can see and as many in the match stated, it was a gg. Naturally because of the recent [crappy] update, we only got 484 faction. It kinda makes one not even bother unless it's a good map for them.

The decreased faction gain sucks hard.

cebalrai · Jun 27, 2007, 01:46 AM // 01:46

People don't play on maps that are stacked against them anymore. This has always been a mild problem... Now it's a huge one. Horrible, horrible update.

Phantom Gun · Jun 27, 2007, 02:10 AM // 02:10

I remember before this update there was a thread where Gale was reading different suggestions. Several people basically said to give the losers nothing. "Not exact words but basic meaning". Now look at what happened. They did it! Not fully, but enough to really hurt both the real players and the leechers. Honestly I think it hurts the real players more because if they continue to fight a losing battle then what do they get?

You think AB is bad? Try FA. I'm not saying the faction for FA has ever been good, but now it's next to nothing if you lose. Mine usualy averages around 86 faction. 86! Also guess what! There are still leechers. Just 2 nights ago I was on a team that had 4 leechers. It's just like I said, they don't care. They are to lazy to actualy play the game and earn their faction even though you get more for winning.

I wish people would think about the pros and the cons before suggesting crap like this. I give all the people props who are trying to come up with solutions, but this update is NOT it. Don't punish the people who actualy want to play the game just to stop those teletubbies that only log in to leech faction.

/End Rant

Sorry people I feel better now. *phew*

chikorita23 · Jun 27, 2007, 04:17 AM // 04:17

Again.... ever since the horrible item-drop nerf.... this is another failure Anet has done. Anet quit being idealism, when are u gonna wake up?!?

They thought this update can discourage leecher and make winning team work harder together? No! Totally wrong. I am in AB and aspenwood almost everyday... this update only ENCOURAGE losing team to QUIT!! More and more people quit now ever since the update.... and it's totally annoying.

Remember Anet!! Aspenwood.... u can't pair up with a friend, u can't co-operate with guild members....its not GvG! So a lot of ppl with no honor would still leech, and the decrease of faction on losing team only make impatient player QUIT the game. Today I was in luxon side.... we almost kill the gunther... and impatient players start quitting.... one a person quit, the others follow. And me + another guy was the only one left in the game on luxon side. We could have win... or at least get 400 luxon faction, but the reduce reward on losing team only make ppl quit....

Anet, don't be lazy, if you wanna ENCOURAGE player on Aspenwood, at least give penaty on leechers or quitter!! Made them unable to enter the game once they quit or leech for a short amount of period. (Say like 30 mins....) Simply buff/nerf winning/losing team reward will be even more inbalance.