Curse

Dark Savior · Aug 17, 2007, 10:12 PM // 22:12

Hello Everyone,

I was away on vacation with my GF for two weeks and then went on another week vacation with some friends after I came back from the states. I live in Canada.

I came on and was just scrimmaging and noticed that some of my builds didn't work as they should. I looked over the notes of some of them and found out that Shadow Prison had been changed. They nerfed it so that you couldn't use it and it's no longer any good. Not only that but not Price of Failure was nerfed while I was away.

I log on and look at all the builds that they 'nerfed' for the betterment of the game. I don't think it's bettering the game.

I think that they are ruining the game for those who don't actually abuse the skill. They completely RUINED SOUL REAPING it's no longer any good. They Nerf so many builds in the name of 'fairness' It's getting out of hand.

Next they will start banning for saying the F word....yesh. When will all this non-sense stop?

Alexandra-Sweet · Aug 17, 2007, 10:17 PM // 22:17

Some people are happy with skill updates, some people are not happy with skill updates.

You belong to the group that are not happy with the recent skill update.

You will just have to learn to live with it and adapt.

GodofAcid · Aug 17, 2007, 10:21 PM // 22:21

Welcome to Guild Wars, apparently you've missed about 2 1/2 years. They make changes, some we like, some we don't, most of us learn to accept it and move on. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.

(I don't mean that in a rude way either, that's how it works..)

Bankai · Aug 17, 2007, 10:24 PM // 22:24

No. There aren't enough nerfs.

Look around you. For the past half year, the only elite assassins have used is Shadow prison. That is not a good sign. It needed the nerf. Price of failure was horrible overpowered. If you had it on you as a warrior, together with the 3 other anti-melee hexes, the only thing you could do was /sit and cry. And don't talk to me about hex removal, most of the time a team has 2 melees or more, and 2 veils and a mass hex removal isn't enough for that. Especially not since everybody else is being hexed up.

Is it really that fun to see 95% of the sins use shadow prison and the exact same build? No. It doesn't make the game more fun. If I monk, and I see shadow prison on me, I just press Generic Prot Skill Nr 1 and look at my party list again. No, I don't find it fun. Not as a monk. Nor as a sin.

The truth is that there is no reason to take another elite if there's shadow prison+black spider strike. And the only thing that makes a fun metagame is diversity and skill to win. A Regular Shadow Prison Build (tm) isn't diverse and requires no skill. It dominated RA and AB. No fun metagame.

Now, remember back to the days where sins had no Shadow prison. Was it that bad? No. Now, add shadow prison to the usable movepool of sins, since it's still usable, just less effective.

That's also something I can really /facepalm about. Whenever a skill is nerfed quite hard, everybody immediately discards it. However, it can still be good enough. For example, just put more in deadly arts. See? You deal less damage, so the build isn't working as awesome as it used to, but it still works. The same goes for a lot of things. People discard skills to easily.

I really enjoy these kinds of nerfs. It creates a metagame where everybody is finding new good builds. I've been experimenting with Way of the Empty palm today, and I really like it. If there's Nerfs, there's also Buffs.

hyro yamaguchi · Aug 17, 2007, 10:28 PM // 22:28

Good builds should be nerfed to hell, everyone just uses them because they are overpowered right? Can't have such a thing as skills that do what they are ment to do.

myword · Aug 17, 2007, 10:36 PM // 22:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark Savior

Hello Everyone,

I was away on vacation with my GF for two weeks and then went on another week vacation with some friends after I came back from the states. I live in Canada.

I came on and was just scrimmaging and noticed that some of my builds didn't work as they should. I looked over the notes of some of them and found out that Shadow Prison had been changed. They nerfed it so that you couldn't use it and it's no longer any good. Not only that but not Price of Failure was nerfed while I was away.

I log on and look at all the builds that they 'nerfed' for the betterment of the game. I don't think it's bettering the game.

I think that they are ruining the game for those who don't actually abuse the skill. They completely RUINED SOUL REAPING it's no longer any good. They Nerf so many builds in the name of 'fairness' It's getting out of hand.

Next they will start banning for saying the F word....yesh. When will all this non-sense stop?

when you cite the shadow prison change and describe it as 'nerfed it so that you couldn't use it and it's no longer any good', your ability to discern whether the skill balances are benefiting the game loses any credibility

Dr Strangelove · Aug 17, 2007, 10:37 PM // 22:37

Jesus farking Christ, shadow prison was stupidly overpowered, quit whining. There's a reason no other sin build was ever run in any sort of serious PvP. And no, it wasn't just a "good build" you hit 1-2-3-4-5-6 and something would die. Wait 20 seconds. Rinse. Repeat. Wipe hands on pants.

Price of failure still works, you just can't maintain it on 3 people anymore. It's a little less ridiculous now.

As for "nerfs hurting people who didn't abuse the skill", what does that even mean? That you were using it in a subpar build, thus the overpowered build should be permitted to stick around because you use crappy skills? PvPers play to win. If something is more powerful than other skills, you use it. If that build promotes brainless, skilless gameplay, it should be nerfed, 'nuff said.

hyro yamaguchi · Aug 17, 2007, 10:53 PM // 22:53

Right...so which solo build, doesn't rely on brainless stuff? Every solo build is just repeatedly doing skills, apart from perhaps monking. It's team play that drags it up from the brainless zone.

0mG RA 1s t3h bRa1nl3ss!!!

Get over it already, these builds aren't played anywhere but in lower end PvP, which is...lower end, who cares about that grindfest anyway?

myword · Aug 17, 2007, 10:57 PM // 22:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by hyro yamaguchi

Right...so which solo build, doesn't rely on brainless stuff? Every solo build is just repeatedly doing skills, apart from perhaps monking. It's team play that drags it up from the brainless zone.

0mG RA 1s t3h bRa1nl3ss!!!

Get over it already, these builds aren't played anywhere but in lower end PvP, which is...lower end, who cares about that grindfest anyway?

you're right, izzy just changed those skills for a laugh.

Solas · Aug 17, 2007, 11:26 PM // 23:26

skills change for a reason, jsut change your build.

it your build was the pwnz0rs kill everything with a flick of a thumb then chances were it was pretty imba.

anet dont nerf builds they create new ones

Dr Strangelove · Aug 17, 2007, 11:47 PM // 23:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by hyro yamaguchi

Right...so which solo build, doesn't rely on brainless stuff? Every solo build is just repeatedly doing skills, apart from perhaps monking. It's team play that drags it up from the brainless zone.

0mG RA 1s t3h bRa1nl3ss!!!

Get over it already, these builds aren't played anywhere but in lower end PvP, which is...lower end, who cares about that grindfest anyway?

Shadow prison sins and hexes have never seen play in high-end PvP? What?

And no, not every build consists of pressing 1-2-3-4-5-6 every 20 seconds. In fact, very few good builds do.

Hyper Cutter · Aug 18, 2007, 12:06 AM // 00:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Strangelove

There's a reason no other sin build was ever run in any sort of serious PvP.

Which itself seems like a larger problem...

pork soldier · Aug 18, 2007, 12:14 AM // 00:14

I read this thread and I lol'd.

dargon · Aug 18, 2007, 12:16 AM // 00:16

LOL, I read your post about nerf and when I reached soul reaping, I just started to laugh. Before you go thinking something sucks, maybe you should try it out first, because the new form of soul reaping works great.

Kissa · Aug 18, 2007, 12:28 AM // 00:28

Me too, I never run out of energy with soul reaping. Other classes have a lot lot less energy than necros and are able to survive. Get used to e-management!

Young Hero · Aug 18, 2007, 01:09 AM // 01:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark Savior

They Nerf so many builds in the name of 'fairness' It's getting out of hand.

When will all this non-sense stop?

Never! Anerf are the Kings of ruining something good/fun/enjoyable.

My best advice is NEVER buy another Anerf/NCsofter product again.

vergerefosh · Aug 18, 2007, 01:10 AM // 01:10

Things change. I never used Shadow Prison, mainly because I couldn't be bothered to cap it on my PvE sin, or unlock it for PvP. Temple Strike FTW :P (that got buffed a while ago)

Seriously though, things change. So many sins were using Shadow Prison it was ridiculous (Shadow Prison = BoA?)

Some adjustments to skills are required as new skills are introduced, and then these changes have knock on effects

They want more build diversity before EotN

MithranArkanere · Aug 18, 2007, 02:37 AM // 02:37

This is Guild Wars, not nap wars.

Skill change so people do not stick to the same builds all the time.

You better get used to it. I just make my builds dinamically, depending on what I think I'm going to find, instead of using the same all over and over.

Onarik Amrak · Aug 18, 2007, 02:48 AM // 02:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by myword

when you cite the shadow prison change and describe it as 'nerfed it so that you couldn't use it and it's no longer any good', your ability to discern whether the skill balances are benefiting the game loses any credibility

Agreed. All he sounds like is another person on the band wagon using cookie cutters.

«Ripskin · Aug 18, 2007, 02:57 AM // 02:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by hyro yamaguchi

Good builds should be nerfed to hell, everyone just uses them because they are overpowered right? Can't have such a thing as skills that do what they are ment to do.

It's to make you come up with new builds. Because otherwise people will get bored, everyone using the same exact build over and over, then they start to whine. You know what? no matter what they do people are going to whine. But I'd rather have people whining and crying about skill changes then having no skill changes at all.