Curse

lord dragon · Sep 08, 2007, 11:29 PM // 23:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

Well ive never said grind was a good thing and im not saying grind is good because it extends the life of the game.

Good I am glad we that grind is not good. We have some common ground.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

All im saying is most things ingame that require grind arent necessities, so if you dont want to grind for an armor set, a title, a rank or a weapon you dont have to.

Agreed again. I am not interested in any material things. I am interested in keeping the game balanced, so untie skills to titles and the title farmers can have at it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

Its only Factions points, SS rank and LB gaze which forced you to grind and those are tiny fractions of the game. 95% of the other grinded content isnt important and is isnt required to complete the game.

And because of this, the game is balanced up until GWEN.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

Thats my entire point. Not that grind is ok or good, because its not.

I am so glad to hear you say GRIND is not good.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

But most of the stuff you grind isnt important. I dont think adding titles to max out is an ideal way to keep us playing for 2 years, but its one option and it works.

Anet got the money already from us. Wether we play or not is irrelevant for this discussion. This does not cost money a month to play.

This will work on the C, spacebar crowd, but not the rest of us.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

Im gonna want to increase my reputation points just because im anal and I like to do that. But its not important and its my choice.

Totally agree with you, it is your choice. Should it not be everyones choice without effecting the game on them. (Lets state this again so it doesn't turn into an armor or material discussion. I could care less about what is offered in GWEN in the material area.)

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

People are welcome to go play another game for 2 years instead of grinding titles or armor and weapons or skills. But people cant complain about grind being Anets way to keep us playing unless they suggest alternative ways to do it.

Got one for ya. Take the skills out of the titles. Do that and I will have fun in my areas of the game uneffected by skills that I am not interested in. And please see the above posts on PUGs before we hear again how this does not effect the game, it does, proven last night and GWEN has only been out a week. I can imagine a month from now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

Aside from releasing new expansions every 2 months I dont see how they could do it aside from adding titles to grind. Its not great as I say, but its one way of doing it.

It is one way of doing it. My concern in the end is that this is considered OK to do. This shows poor development and lack of ideas in the end. GWEN could have been so much more then it is. It could have really blown the socks off of us. It did not have to be large to do it. What we got is a different animal.

GWEN reminds me of the movie "STAR TREK: Search for Spock". Star Trek was running high in the ratings. The franchise was doing very well and Paramount decided to do a low budget movie to capitalize on it. The movie goers got what they paid for, a C+ movie.

Now, I know people like titles and grind. Nothing wrong with that at all. I will chuckle on a regular basis and thank you for maxing them so I don't have to buy a scroll to go to UW and FOW when I want. The minute you change the rules and force grind, you loose players. These are players that you will not get back because they were the ones that originally bought Guild Wars before there was a Prophecies. They were the ones that beta'd. They were the ones that went out and told the world how wonderful GW is. They were the ones that GW promised not to do this too.

Like I said before (My Opinion) GWEN is the price of a couple of bad movies. Good news is it didn't last that long. Thing is, now it is turning into being reruned on all the channels and I can't find anything else to watch because of the skills.

lord dragon · Sep 09, 2007, 06:33 AM // 06:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by darktyco

Funny, I don't remember ANYONE asking for GW to be like World of GrindCraft.

So true. I guess there was enough people in Anets mind that wanted another WOW but didn't want to pay a monthly fee to get it. They didn't want to actually GO TO WORK to get WOW, so they wanted it here ruining the game.

Please remember...

I must not GRIND. GRIND is the mind-killer. GRIND is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my GRIND... I will permit it to pass over me and through me.

Punches · Sep 09, 2007, 06:48 AM // 06:48

I'm so not even worried about grind in Eotn at all. I'm just hoping at some point they will put in a HM, and I can get the titles naturally while I'm working on vanquisher. In the meantime it's just taking a little longer to get them playing through the game and clearing maps for fun, doing dungeons, etc. If at any point I feel like I'm doing the same thing over and over for the sole purpose of attaining a title and it feels more like work than fun, I'll probably go swimming, or maybe learn needlepoint, or even write a memoir no-one will ever read that I can lock in a box and bury on top of a very high mountain, and I'll come back later on when my interest has rekindled.

Have fun people, do what makes you happy.

TabascoSauce · Sep 09, 2007, 11:50 AM // 11:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

But most of the stuff you grind isnt important. I dont think adding titles to max out is an ideal way to keep us playing for 2 years, but its one option and it works.

So, what does that say about the the state of the game in general, and you in particular, when your whole argument is "grind extends the game"?

I can keep this up as long as you can.

Thanks!
TabascoSauce

Guildmaster Cain · Sep 09, 2007, 12:47 PM // 12:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malice Black

Grinding points to get armor sucks, hence why I'll stick with the fissure.

Does seem to based around grind though. Already getting tired of doing long ass quests for 200 whole points..

To OP: Well it wouldnt be a title u would want to wear if everyone has it and u dont have to work for it?

So spending 200+ hrs farming money to get Fissure is better then spending 5 hours farming reputation? Unless you obviously bought your Fissure armor... which is also the reason why people with that armor dont earn my respect automatically. Plus the fact that it looks awfull and it stinks, but that just personal.

freekedoutfish · Sep 09, 2007, 01:19 PM // 13:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by lord dragon

And because of this, the game is balanced up until GWEN.

This is the bit I truly dont understand about your argument. I really cannot for the life of me, working out why you think having these GWEN pve only skills connected to titles is unbalancing the game.

As ive said alot now, your not forced to use these skills! Its not like LB gaze which was required and having a higher rank made an impact on the game itself and people might have judged you upon your rank.

If a person chooses to use one of GWENs pve only skill, they can and it has no impact on you as in individual or anyone else.

Whether another person has rank 1 Norn or rank 7 Norn and their Norn skill is more or less effective then yours, has no impact on your game or anyone elses.

Its completely personal and isolated to that individuals gaming experience.

Their not connected to pvp so it has no impact there either.

The effectiveness of these skills is completely related to yourself, and your title. You choose whether you want to increase those ranks or not to make it more effective.

If you keep it low it only effects you, if you increase it, it only effect you! There are no outworldly effects or impacts on anyone else.

Im sure there is a post above somewhere which explains how and why you think what you do (and ill look), but im really cannot get my head around this notion of GWENs pve skills unbalancing anything.

I accept that (for example) if one person has their Norn skill more powerfull then someone elses, it may make their gameplay easier. But again that is their individual gaming experience and it was their choice to increase it. You have the same choice, but because these skills arent necessary to complete the game you are no at any disadvantage in terms of completing the storyline.

How ever (as I said in an earlier post) by the time you have aquired most of these pve only skills, you're most likely to have completed GWEN and have completed one or all the other campaigns.

There for they wont give you any kind of an edge, unless you are replaying through missions, quests or dungeons. But because you will have done them already, its not a necessity. Their just nice little skills to use and mix things up.

Granted, you could be the kind of person who doesnt continue playing until you have unlocked ALL your pve only skills, but why do that? Why spend endless hours playing polymock or drawf boxing or play tournaments to get pve only skills you dont need to do the game?

These pve only skills really are just like collectable items, which you achieve and then use after the game is complete in dungeons and repeatable quests to make things a bit more interesting.

I accept some people will have this opinion of "Its not fair because that person has his pve Norn skill more powerfull then mine" and they'l pout and have a paddy and a cry.

But what does it matter? it has no impact on them or you if someone else has a more powerfull Norn skill.

One argument I heard as that this mentality of...

"Oh you havent got a high enough Norn rank, so you cant join our PUG"

...or...

"Have you got this pve Norn skill? if not you cant join us"

...was creeping into GWEN, but i havent seen or experienced that myself. And if I did, I would leave the party and use my guild. I would refuse to play with such arrogant, anal people.

Im sorry if I seem to be repeating myself and if I seem stubborn about this, but its like trying to work out quantum physics as to why you think this is unbalancing the game. Maybe that makes me seem like im stupid, and fair enough if it does. But the mechanics behind PvE only skills is that unimportant to me, has that small an impact on my gaming experience and doesnt make me even flutter an eyelid thinking about it.... that I really cant understand why so many people are getting wound up about this.

Its got to be the last thing on my mind when concerning GWEN about whether or not you need higher ranks to use PvE only skills. It really doesnt register very high with me in terms of importance ingame. Probably because I havent used any or felt the need to.

PvE only skills are items/skills that only impact the individual and their individual gaming experience. It has no outward impacts on anyone else around them.

Its hard for me to understand why it bothers anyone.

TabascoSauce · Sep 09, 2007, 02:33 PM // 14:33

Google the Advanced Lawnmower Simulator (ALS for short).

You'll play it once or twice, and have fun sending it to your friends, but it gets old fast because it is exactly the same content.

Now imagine that they had a central completion counter for the ALS. If you complete it 6 thousand times, then you get a bonus!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Your lawnmower will go 20 percent faster!!!!!!!!!!!!! Yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahooooo!

Welcome to the new vision of GW(?) Make a short game, then put superskills tied to repetitive grind area-clearing. Wow, doesn't that sound like a winner?

Oh, and the best the grind-supporters can say is that it is optional? So, what other option do I have? Play different areas? Oh, no, they did not make any.

So, go ahead and suggest that I play a different game. Then I'll get to ask you, what does that say about the game when the only alternative you have to offer me in the game besides grind (since there is a shortage of game) is.... go play another game? Heh, just exactly what does that say?

Thanks!
TabascoSauce

lord dragon · Sep 09, 2007, 11:11 PM // 23:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

This is the bit I truly dont understand about your argument. I really cannot for the life of me, working out why you think having these GWEN pve only skills connected to titles is unbalancing the game.

As ive said alot now, your not forced to use these skills! Its not like LB gaze which was required and having a higher rank made an impact on the game itself and people might have judged you upon your rank.

If a person chooses to use one of GWENs pve only skill, they can and it has no impact on you as in individual or anyone else.

Whether another person has rank 1 Norn or rank 7 Norn and their Norn skill is more or less effective then yours, has no impact on your game or anyone elses.

Its completely personal and isolated to that individuals gaming experience.

Their not connected to pvp so it has no impact there either.

The effectiveness of these skills is completely related to yourself, and your title. You choose whether you want to increase those ranks or not to make it more effective.

If you keep it low it only effects you, if you increase it, it only effect you! There are no outworldly effects or impacts on anyone else.

Im sure there is a post above somewhere which explains how and why you think what you do (and ill look), but im really cannot get my head around this notion of GWENs pve skills unbalancing anything.

I accept that (for example) if one person has their Norn skill more powerfull then someone elses, it may make their gameplay easier. But again that is their individual gaming experience and it was their choice to increase it. You have the same choice, but because these skills arent necessary to complete the game you are no at any disadvantage in terms of completing the storyline.

How ever (as I said in an earlier post) by the time you have aquired most of these pve only skills, you're most likely to have completed GWEN and have completed one or all the other campaigns.

There for they wont give you any kind of an edge, unless you are replaying through missions, quests or dungeons. But because you will have done them already, its not a necessity. Their just nice little skills to use and mix things up.

Granted, you could be the kind of person who doesnt continue playing until you have unlocked ALL your pve only skills, but why do that? Why spend endless hours playing polymock or drawf boxing or play tournaments to get pve only skills you dont need to do the game?

These pve only skills really are just like collectable items, which you achieve and then use after the game is complete in dungeons and repeatable quests to make things a bit more interesting.

I accept some people will have this opinion of "Its not fair because that person has his pve Norn skill more powerfull then mine" and they'l pout and have a paddy and a cry.

But what does it matter? it has no impact on them or you if someone else has a more powerfull Norn skill.

One argument I heard as that this mentality of...

"Oh you havent got a high enough Norn rank, so you cant join our PUG"

...or...

"Have you got this pve Norn skill? if not you cant join us"

...was creeping into GWEN, but i havent seen or experienced that myself. And if I did, I would leave the party and use my guild. I would refuse to play with such arrogant, anal people.

Im sorry if I seem to be repeating myself and if I seem stubborn about this, but its like trying to work out quantum physics as to why you think this is unbalancing the game. Maybe that makes me seem like im stupid, and fair enough if it does. But the mechanics behind PvE only skills is that unimportant to me, has that small an impact on my gaming experience and doesnt make me even flutter an eyelid thinking about it.... that I really cant understand why so many people are getting wound up about this.

Its got to be the last thing on my mind when concerning GWEN about whether or not you need higher ranks to use PvE only skills. It really doesnt register very high with me in terms of importance ingame. Probably because I havent used any or felt the need to.

PvE only skills are items/skills that only impact the individual and their individual gaming experience. It has no outward impacts on anyone else around them.

Its hard for me to understand why it bothers anyone.

As you put it, if a skill makes the game a little easier. Does this not effect the whole team?

If it does, will this not effect who you want to take with you if you do like to do DOA, FOW, UW, Urgoz, The Deep, ect. It does effect it. The only way it will not, is if you play alone.

A Ruby dijin sprouting imodulate effects the game for the team. You either have it, or you don't.

Please remember...

I must not GRIND. GRIND is the mind-killer. GRIND is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my GRIND... I will permit it to pass over me and through me.

Darlichay Dalinar · Sep 09, 2007, 11:19 PM // 23:19

It took me about three days to get my Vanguard to rank 5, so that's not an issue at all. However, in that time I also got rank 5 Dwarf and Norn, with a lowly rank 4 for Asura...

I understand that the grind is a bit of a pain, but here again, it comes to raiding vs. pvp. For those from WoW, you know what I mean, but I'll explain all the same...

PvP requires little time anymore; it just needs you to be on every-once-in-a-while to get some good armor. Raiding requires you to be on almost every day, like a job almost, 5-8 hours a day perhaps getting the best armor in the game.

Those whom have the time are able to get the best armor in the game. Those whom do not have to settle for sub-par.

Guild Wars, however, requires no work, really, for the best armor in the game. Heck, you can buy it in one of those starting towns. We all know that however. I'll get to the point, however...

These armor sets and weapons are optional. Guild Wars 2 is about a year off or so. The grinds aren't that bad, the new content is short as crap and it takes no effort to nail most of these armor's and etc. The largest grind, I believe, is for the 75 ectos needed for your dragon gloves and the like. Otherwise, the mats are rather simple.

Know what happened when these debates came up in WoW? Blizzard lost a huge player base. Guild Wars: be prepared for the same.

iamthescooter · Sep 10, 2007, 03:36 AM // 03:36

See, I'm at 46k dwarf and 30k Norn and 16k Asura and 13k Vangaurd, but i havent grinded one thing, I've just been doing dungeons, and enjoying it.

arsie · Sep 10, 2007, 03:59 AM // 03:59

One of the nicer things about Kurzick/Luxon Faction grind, is that you can choose a variety of ways to get the Faction points. Alliance Battles, mob-clearing with Blessings, or repeatable quests. Faction is also shared account-wide, so you can complete the same quests with different professions.

While the different methods have varying point rewards for the same time spent, which I regard is a small failure, it breaks the monotony for the players who are not FFF addicts.

It is not perfect, but it's not a bad solution. They invented this system, and perhaps they should have applied this to Nightfall and EotN.

lord dragon · Sep 10, 2007, 09:38 AM // 09:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by arsie

One of the nicer things about Kurzick/Luxon Faction grind, is that you can choose a variety of ways to get the Faction points. Alliance Battles, mob-clearing with Blessings, or repeatable quests. Faction is also shared account-wide, so you can complete the same quests with different professions.

While the different methods have varying point rewards for the same time spent, which I regard is a small failure, it breaks the monotony for the players who are not FFF addicts.

It is not perfect, but it's not a bad solution. They invented this system, and perhaps they should have applied this to Nightfall and EotN.

Oh, I would have loved that. I could CHOOSE the way I got it.

Please remember...

I must not GRIND. GRIND is the mind-killer. GRIND is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my GRIND... I will permit it to pass over me and through me.

freekedoutfish · Sep 10, 2007, 09:39 AM // 09:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by lord dragon

As you put it, if a skill makes the game a little easier. Does this not effect the whole team?

If it does, will this not effect who you want to take with you if you do like to do DOA, FOW, UW, Urgoz, The Deep, ect. It does effect it. The only way it will not, is if you play alone.

A Ruby dijin sprouting imodulate effects the game for the team. You either have it, or you don't.

Please remember...

I must not GRIND. GRIND is the mind-killer. GRIND is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my GRIND... I will permit it to pass over me and through me.

Ofcourse adding a person with a higher rank and a certain pve only skill might make your questin or mission or dungeon easier.

But aside from LB gaze you dont need to use pve only skills in any aspect of the game. Sorry but if your the kind of person who is going to look at a player and think "their rank isnt high enough" and not accept them, then thats childish.

Especially when you dont need to be using these pve only skills at all. You can do FOW, UW, Urgoz and The Deep without any pve only skills. People seemed to manage before pve only skills were added!

LB gaze and its connected title are the only instance when this might happen and I can understand it. But the difference wih LB gaze is that its damage doesnt change with your rank, only the number of creatures it effects. So again its not hugely important that a person has a high lightbringer rank for it to be effective.

So NO, it doesnt unbalance the game because you DONT need to use pve only skills in any instance except when facing Abaddons forces.

What if your trying to do an area and you ask if people have a certain pve only skill and they dont? they might not own that campaign or GWEN!

Are you going to kick them or not accept them?

Its no different if you wanted to form a party and someone doesnt have a certain skill because they dont own the right campaign! Does that justify kicking them or not accepting them? No!! Because you dont need that one skill, its purely preference and purely because it might make it easier.

Its not because it not a necessity.

You are all acting like pve only skills are sooo important, that you cant live without them. That you cant do elite zones without them and a high rank. Like the entire game will fall apart unless you have a high enough rank to take advantage of them.

Seriously.... get over it!

We managed long before pve only skills were added, and managed to play FOW, UW and the faction elite zones before pve only skills were added. We managed to do quests and missions without them.

I even completed GWEN without using any and I only started using LB gaze in NF near the very end and I still survived!

PvE only skills mean squat in this game, and they are not important and they are necessities. They are just nice to use like any other skill. If you are going around rejecting people from groups because they dont have high enough ranks in certain titles and because they dont use certain pve only skills, I think that speaks for your mentality.

You act and speak like its acceptable for people to judge a person by their rank and whether they get accepted into groups?

Its like anything new to the game!

"Oooo we have new skills which will make certain things easier. Right, dont let anyone in the team unless they use it and they have a high rank!!!"

The exact same thing happened with Searing Flames was added! I had virtually every party I tried to enter ask if I was using SF and they all tried to force me to use it. And this was just for easy missions!

I just refused and said my build was fine.

This has nothing to do with pve only skills unbalancing anything. It has everything to do with elite morons, trying to dictate to use which new skills we should be using in certain areas and judging you on whether your good enough to join them based on your rank.

Something which shouldnt happen and doesnt need to happen.

You can do elite zones without pve only skills, you can do all quests and missiosn and dungeons without pve only skills! They are not required at all (except maybe LB gaze)!

So nooo, they dont unbalance the game!

lord dragon · Sep 10, 2007, 10:04 AM // 10:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

Ofcourse adding a person with a higher rank and a certain pve only skill might make your questin or mission or dungeon easier.

Good you acknowledge that this effects the game no matter how you want to call it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

But aside from LB gaze you dont need to use pve only skills in any aspect of the game. Sorry but if your the kind of person who is going to look at a player and think "their rank isnt high enough" and not accept them, then thats childish.

Actually the title also reduces and increases damage overall. Hence the reason the title huggers in the groups require it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

Especially when you dont need to be using these pve only skills at all. You can do FOW, UW, Urgoz and The Deep without any pve only skills. People seemed to manage before pve only skills were added!

But now they are asking for skills from there. They are limiting the teams because of it. So, it is do it and be bored to tears, or never to areas I love to do again.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

LB gaze and its connected title are the only instance when this might happen and I can understand it. But the difference wih LB gaze is that its damage doesnt change with your rank, only the number of creatures it effects. So again its not hugely important that a person has a high lightbringer rank for it to be effective.

You are looking at the damage from the skill and not the title. The title reduces the damage you take and increases the damage to the mobs overall.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

So NO, it doesnt unbalance the game because you DONT need to use pve only skills in any instance except when facing Abaddons forces.

Oh, but it does unbalance the game when it effects the teams.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

What if your trying to do an area and you ask if people have a certain pve only skill and they dont? they might not own that campaign or GWEN!

Are you going to kick them or not accept them?

I wouldn't. I would use the skill set they have. That is me. It is not the majority of GW playerbase though. Hate to tell you, but this goes on everyday, each day.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

Its no different if you wanted to form a party and someone doesnt have a certain skill because they dont own the right campaign! Does that justify kicking them or not accepting them? No!! Because you dont need that one skill, its purely preference and purely because it might make it easier.

Its not because it not a necessity.

It is becoming a necessity if teams require it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

You are all acting like pve only skills are sooo important, that you cant live without them. That you cant do elite zones without them and a high rank. Like the entire game will fall apart unless you have a high enough rank to take advantage of them.

Seriously.... get over it!

So you are asking me not to do elite areas of the game anymore? Asking me not to PUG? I just want to make sure that you have turned into a developer or owner of GW and are asking a customer to leave.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

We managed long before pve only skills were added, and managed to play FOW, UW and the faction elite zones before pve only skills were added. We managed to do quests and missions without them.

I even completed GWEN without using any and I only started using LB gaze in NF near the very end and I still survived!

I agree, and you weren't asked to use them, because they didn't exist. Now they do and teams are requiring them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

PvE only skills mean squat in this game, and they are not important and they are necessities. They are just nice to use like any other skill. If you are going around rejecting people from groups because they dont have high enough ranks in certain titles and because they dont use certain pve only skills, I think that speaks for your mentality.

I don't reject them. I agree the metality sucks. Title huggers will always have this mentality though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

You act and speak like its acceptable for people to judge a person by their rank and whether they get accepted into groups?

Its like anything new to the game!

Except now skills are tied to it. So it is grind or leave the areas you like to play.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

"Oooo we have new skills which will make certain things easier. Right, dont let anyone in the team unless they use it and they have a high rank!!!"

The exact same thing happened with Searing Flames was added! I had virtually every party I tried to enter ask if I was using SF and they all tried to force me to use it. And this was just for easy missions!

I just refused and said my build was fine.

This has nothing to do with pve only skills unbalancing anything. It has everything to do with elite morons, trying to dictate to use which new skills we should be using in certain areas and judging you on whether your good enough to join them based on your rank.

Agreed. But there are plenty of title huggers out there that effect the game and it gets worse everyday.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

Something which shouldnt happen and doesnt need to happen.

Agreed, it should never happen, but it does.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

You can do elite zones without pve only skills, you can do all quests and missiosn and dungeons without pve only skills! They are not required at all (except maybe LB gaze)!

So nooo, they dont unbalance the game!

They do, when it limits anything a player can do through the limits of the game, or the effect it has on the community. This effected the community by adding in overpowered skills that you have to grind for.

Please remember...

I must not GRIND. GRIND is the mind-killer. GRIND is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my GRIND... I will permit it to pass over me and through me.

freekedoutfish · Sep 10, 2007, 10:11 AM // 10:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by lord dragon

...

You didnt answer my question. Where in the entire game (aside from LB gaze and against abaddon forces) do you have to use a pve only skill or you cant do that area, quest, mission or dungeon?

Aside from areas where it helps to have LB gaze where else do you need a pv only skill and you need to have a high rank to be effective?

If you cant name any accept for areas where you face abbadons forces, then you're entire arguement falls apart.

Your basing your agruement on the idea that lots of areas exist where people are being forced into increasing ranks to make their pve only skills more effective, because if they dont they cant proceed!

I would like you to list those areas (not including LB gaze ones becaue I accept that as the only one)?

lord dragon · Sep 10, 2007, 10:22 AM // 10:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

You didnt answer my question. Where in the entire game (aside from LB gaze and against abaddon forces) do you have to use a pve only skill or you cant do that area, quest, mission or dungeon?

Aside from areas where it helps to have LB gaze where else do you need a pv only skill and you need to have a high rank to be effective?

If you cant name any accept for areas where you face abbadons forces, then you're entire arguement falls apart.

Your basing your agruement on the idea that lots of areas exist where people are being forced into increasing ranks to make their pve only skills more effective, because if they dont they cant proceed!

I would like you to list those areas (not including LB gaze ones becaue I accept that as the only one)?

OK, let me try this again.

If teams require a skill I do not have because I refuse to do the ENDLESS, MINDLESS, HATED, BORING, WORK of title farming to get skills that are tied to it, how am I going to team?

Teams are already requiring it.

I hate to tell you, but not all people feel that the skills are not useful in a team. So, it is have it or don't join us. I don't feel that way, but to many TITLE HUGGERS already do. Enough to limit my play areas each day.

Is that fair? Is that balanced?

The argument, "Just don't join that team" does not hold up when ALL the teams are requiring it now!

Please remember...

I must not GRIND. GRIND is the mind-killer. GRIND is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my GRIND... I will permit it to pass over me and through me.

freekedoutfish · Sep 10, 2007, 10:34 AM // 10:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by lord dragon

OK, let me try this again.

If teams require a skill I do not have because I refuse to do the ENDLESS, MINDLESS, HATED, BORING, WORK of title farming to get skills that are tied to it, how am I going to team?

Teams are already requiring it.

I hate to tell you, but not all people feel that the skills are not useful in a team. So, it is have it or don't join us. I don't feel that way, but to many TITLE HUGGERS already do. Enough to limit my play areas each day.

Is that fair? Is that balanced?

The argument, "Just don't join that team" does not hold up when ALL the teams are requiring it now!

Please remember...

I must not GRIND. GRIND is the mind-killer. GRIND is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my GRIND... I will permit it to pass over me and through me.

I find this hilarious, because the unbalanced aspect your talking about isnt the result of Anet combining titles and pve only skills.

Its the result of players like you and your l33t attitudes of trying to dictate what builds to use and what titles to show.

Again I ask...

1) are you incapable of playin FOW, UW and the faction lite zones without some pve only skills?

2) what if a person didnt have the campaign or expansion which gave them the pve only skill you demand?

This has nothing to do with Anet unbalancing the game. This has everything to do with "oh a new skill has been added and unless you use it, you cant join our PUG"!

Despite the fact you dont need those skills to actually play those elite zones. I said this befor... how did we play those elite zones befor pve only skills were added? we must have managed somehow!!

This is nothing more then a l33t attitude of select players trying to force their notion of what skills should be used in elite zone. If you dont have use them or have high enough ranks to be l33t enough, you cant join.

Its you players who are removing the choice about using pve only skills and the choice about increasing ranks. Not Anet!!!

You players have once again twisted somethin that worked absolutely fine, slapped it with your elite stick and made it compulsary. So now people have to max their title or they cant join you in elite areas!

I have to laugh at the hyprocrasy!

And you were all trying to say that I was dictatin how to play the game? lol!!!! Your basically saying to me that if a person doesnt have a high enough rank in a title and doesnt use a pve only skill (that they dont need to) then you dont accept them into your elite zone pug!!

Thats hilarious!!

And people complain about cookie cut build, and you guys are basically dictating how people should play elite zone and what pve only skills they should use and what titles they should max out.

Thats the ultimate cookie cut build!

I think your arguement just sank about 10 miles bellow the ocean along with your l33t attitudes. This is exactly why i dont play elite zones because of players like yourself who try to dictate builds and skills, even though you dont neeed them.

TabascoSauce · Sep 10, 2007, 11:31 AM // 11:31

Freeked, we all understand that you think people who require titles are bad.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

This is nothing more then a l33t attitude of select players trying to force their notion of what skills should be used in elite zone. If you dont have use them or have high enough ranks to be l33t enough, you cant join.

But you yourself are saying that this is happening:

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

I think your arguement just sank about 10 miles bellow the ocean along with your l33t attitudes. This is exactly why i dont play elite zones because of players like yourself who try to dictate builds and skills, even though you dont neeed them.

Need, schmeed. You dont play elite-type zones to avoid the problem while you are trying to tell dragon there is not a problem?

Thanks!
TabascoSauce

freekedoutfish · Sep 10, 2007, 11:43 AM // 11:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by TabascoSauce

Thanks!
TabascoSauce

I said i dont play elite zones because that kind of thing does happen. Read what I wrote!

This unbalance issue you talk about is nothing more then you trying to cover up the fact that you want everyone to have these skills at max capacity to use in elite zones.

You're p'd off because you want everyone in your PUG to copy your build and use the pve only skills you order them too.

But because they require ranks to increase their power/strength, your annoyed because it means not everyones skill will be as effective as the other.

I appreciate that, but what you seem to completely miss is you dont need these pve only skill to play elite zones.

The only reason people are feeling pressured into increasing ranks for their skills, or even feel the need to use these skills is because l33t players like yourself are ordering them too.

Your tall talking about how GWs is meant to be about fun and enjoying the game right? You say you dont want to grind because you dont enjoy it!

How is it fun for another player in an elite zone to be rejected or kicked from a group just because their rank isnt high enough, or they dont bring a certain pve only skills?

I dont play elite zones because that elite attitude ruins the fun for me. I've tried joining pugs for FOW and UW and alike before and you spend 30 minutes with the leader shouting "ping build" and then picking it apart like hes all-high-and-mighty.

Not politeness, no manors... just dictating how you should play!

And your defending that kind of attitude by forcing other playes in elite zones to max titles just to make (un-required) pve only skills more powerfull.

There is no unbalance in the game due to pve only skills.

The unbalance is a result of elite players forcing and pressuring people to increase those ranks and use those skills!

lord dragon · Sep 10, 2007, 12:11 PM // 12:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

I said i dont play elite zones because that kind of thing does happen. Read what I wrote!

This unbalance issue you talk about is nothing more then you trying to cover up the fact that you want everyone to have these skills at max capacity to use in elite zones.

You're p'd off because you want everyone in your PUG to copy your build and use the pve only skills you order them too.

But because they require ranks to increase their power/strength, your annoyed because it means not everyones skill will be as effective as the other.

I appreciate that, but what you seem to completely miss is you dont need these pve only skill to play elite zones.

The only reason people are feeling pressured into increasing ranks for their skills, or even feel the need to use these skills is because l33t players like yourself are ordering them too.

Your tall talking about how GWs is meant to be about fun and enjoying the game right? You say you dont want to grind because you dont enjoy it!

How is it fun for another player in an elite zone to be rejected or kicked from a group just because their rank isnt high enough, or they dont bring a certain pve only skills?

I dont play elite zones because that elite attitude ruins the fun for me. I've tried joining pugs for FOW and UW and alike before and you spend 30 minutes with the leader shouting "ping build" and then picking it apart like hes all-high-and-mighty.

Not politeness, no manors... just dictating how you should play!

And your defending that kind of attitude by forcing other playes in elite zones to max titles just to make (un-required) pve only skills more powerfull.

There is no unbalance in the game due to pve only skills.

The unbalance is a result of elite players forcing and pressuring people to increase those ranks and use those skills!

All of this would be a moot point if either they didn't exist or were not tied to title. As it is now. This happens because of the title huggers.

Please remember...

I must not GRIND. GRIND is the mind-killer. GRIND is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my GRIND... I will permit it to pass over me and through me.