Curse

Nyree · Oct 17, 2007, 05:57 PM // 17:57

Talking about paragons,

I'm my opinion the GFTE nerf hits paragons harder than the AR nerf, specialy if you're playing a command line paragon in PVE. That is basicaly because GFTE is your main energy management skill, and with the recharge time, you don't have enough energy as you had before to use some command skills like Stand Your Ground with TNTF PvE skill. Now is very bad to run both on the same bar, or even 3 skills with 10e coast. Paragons have too low energy recovery with too high energy coast skills... The recharge time of GFTE, in my opinion, just killed a lot of paragon skill bars.

Diddy bow · Oct 17, 2007, 06:17 PM // 18:17

no more perma shadow form in front of swearing mobs of ab'ers for me then

Lagg · Oct 17, 2007, 06:51 PM // 18:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by yesitsrob

That's not better, that actually is killing the damn skill. Way to be bad

The point of Aggressive Refrain should be to build up adrenaline/energy fast in a support build.

Of course, they're nerfing it because people are using it to increase their DPS in a damage build, which is why I'm saying: make it like Flurry.

For a damage build, I still prefer Soldier's Fury.

Heck, even Flail ain't bad (though that should get nerfed to 2 seconds at 0 Strength).

Ulterion · Oct 17, 2007, 06:55 PM // 18:55

Nerf the good & buff the bad... GG Anet... G.... g...

Racthoh · Oct 17, 2007, 07:09 PM // 19:09

On the update: That signet build was crazy to watch. Shutting down LoD = win, shutting down the other monk's elite too = broken.

On paragons: GftE! having a 4 second recharge means you can't just mash every skill as it recharges and you have to actually pay attention to your energy. How will our mindless profession survive?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lagg

For a damage build, I still prefer Soldier's Fury.

Because attacking 8% faster than Aggressive Refrain and not having access to Cruel Spear is the best way to deal damage.

Right.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lagg

Heck, even Flail ain't bad (though that should get nerfed to 2 seconds at 0 Strength).

On a paragon it's terrible, you're wasting a strike of adrenaline every 4 seconds to maintain your IAS.

SotiCoto · Oct 17, 2007, 07:34 PM // 19:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by the Puppeteer

how will the deadly paradox nerf affect the shadow form runners?

Total and utter obliteration.

Shadow Form cannot be permanently maintained now. It was severely close before, but now it just cannot be done.

It is an unforgivable change. Silly as it might seem, if PvPers are fussing about the use of Deadly Paradox in one or two builds to spam a select few skills..... then why not nerf THOSE SKILLS? .... Why nerf Deadly Paradox and thus take down with it everything else that relies on it (to within a fine degree of accuracy) outside of the PvP world?

... BAD A-NET! INFINITELY BAD A-NET!

Earth · Oct 17, 2007, 07:39 PM // 19:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by SotiCoto

Total and utter obliteration.

Shadow Form cannot be permanently maintained now. It was severely close before, but now it just cannot be done.

It is an unforgivable change. Silly as it might seem, if PvPers are fussing about the use of Deadly Paradox in one or two builds to spam a select few skills..... then why not nerf THOSE SKILLS? .... Why nerf Deadly Paradox and thus take down with it everything else that relies on it (to within a fine degree of accuracy) outside of the PvP world?

... BAD A-NET! INFINITELY BAD A-NET!

They would nerf Shadow Form then.

Oh right.

Simath · Oct 17, 2007, 07:42 PM // 19:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by SotiCoto

then why not nerf THOSE SKILLS? ....

Because nerfing one skill makes more sense then nerfing numerous skills to accomplish the same goal.

unienaule · Oct 17, 2007, 07:46 PM // 19:46

The other skills that were being abused weren't broken when they didn't have HALF RECHARGE.

Yichi · Oct 17, 2007, 07:50 PM // 19:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by SotiCoto

...the use of Deadly Paradox in one or two builds to spam a select few skills..... then why not nerf THOSE SKILLS? .... Why nerf Deadly Paradox and thus take down with it everything else that relies on it...

Because those builds and situations wouldn't be a problem without Deadly Paradox. Deadly was the problem with those builds, not the other skills.

Skuld · Oct 17, 2007, 07:57 PM // 19:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by SotiCoto

Total and utter obliteration.

Shadow Form cannot be permanently maintained now. It was severely close before, but now it just cannot be done.

It is an unforgivable change. Silly as it might seem, if PvPers are fussing about the use of Deadly Paradox in one or two builds to spam a select few skills..... then why not nerf THOSE SKILLS? .... Why nerf Deadly Paradox and thus take down with it everything else that relies on it (to within a fine degree of accuracy) outside of the PvP world?

... BAD A-NET! INFINITELY BAD A-NET!

why so sad happy man

tmakinen · Oct 17, 2007, 08:05 PM // 20:05

As I thought, the Deadly Paradox nerf didn't do anything to keeping up permanent Shadow Form. Just tried it with my sin and after 5 minutes in SF I had convinced to myself that it's still totally doable, so please stop complaining and check your timing

On the other hand, I wonder why anybody would want to bring into a PvP match a build that is totally trashed by a single sig of humility ...

SotiCoto · Oct 17, 2007, 08:10 PM // 20:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by unienaule

The other skills that were being abused weren't broken when they didn't have HALF RECHARGE.

Nah.... only 66% broken now.
Because naturally that makes ALL the difference. ¬_¬

You're talking about numbers.... A mere matter of slightly more or slightly less.
I'm dealing with something that has simply stopped working altogether.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuld

why so sad happy man

I'm not a happy man.
I'm a whiny git who does NOT need to be given even more reason to whine.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmakinen

As I thought, the Deadly Paradox nerf didn't do anything to keeping up permanent Shadow Form. Just tried it with my sin and after 5 minutes in SF I had convinced to myself that it's still totally doable, so please stop complaining and check your timing

If you can figure it out then good on you.... but given that it required practically PERFECT timing before, I fail to see how it is possible now. Care to explain?

Not only that.... but would someone mind explaining why now when Arcane Echo reverts to its natural form (recharging), Shadow Form's recharge marker suddenly jumps forward for no apparent reason? It does it every single time without fail now, and it never did that before.

Zahr Dalsk · Oct 17, 2007, 08:15 PM // 20:15

Yay for this patch! (Assassins have not suffered because they can still kill with amazing speed, all they lost was an annoying gimmick.) Right in time to cancel one of my guildmate's plans of running infinite shadow form in an alliance tournament

Skuld · Oct 17, 2007, 08:16 PM // 20:16

Anyway, you asume invincibility-mode was a good thing. Get over it.

Yanman.be · Oct 17, 2007, 08:17 PM // 20:17

I lol'ed @ SotiCoto irl. Yes, i-net abbrev. r cool.

SotiCoto · Oct 17, 2007, 08:23 PM // 20:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuld

Anyway, you asume invincibility-mode was a good thing. Get over it.

It IS.... for chest-running.

For the record, having enough energy, skill slots or the perfect timing to do much else while under permanent Shadow Form is another story.

.... Well... besides kill Vermin with Empathy. That was simple enough once one got used to the Energy Management...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yanman.be

I lol'ed @ SotiCoto irl. Yes, i-net abbrev. r cool.

Yes Yanny. I exist for your amusement...
.... Well... I do other things too that aren't so funny, but that isn't so important now, is it?

Glad I bring you such hilarity.

Now would someone mind explaining how I'm supposed to get around this supposedly not-as-big-as-I-make-it-out-to-be problem? ^_~

unienaule · Oct 17, 2007, 08:23 PM // 20:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by SotiCoto

Nah.... only 66% broken now.
Because naturally that makes ALL the difference. ¬_¬

You're talking about numbers.... A mere matter of slightly more or slightly less.
I'm dealing with something that has simply stopped working altogether.

Does it occur to you that the other builds that were abusing Deadly Paradox might be having similar drops in effectiveness?

SotiCoto · Oct 17, 2007, 08:27 PM // 20:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by unienaule

Does it occur to you that the other builds that were abusing Deadly Paradox might be having similar drops in effectiveness?

As far as I'm aware.... the other builds "abusing" (lolz) Deadly Paradox weren't doing it to maintain something constantly so much as make something 0.5x faster than it was originally meant to be. I heard it made Dancing Daggers quite dangerous (heard MANY complaints about that).
Now it just happens to be slightly less fast than it was but still 0.33x faster than it was originally meant to be.

Unless these "abuse" builds were centered around maintaining permanent Shadow Form in PvP (which, given the exceedingly low offensive potential of such a thing, would only be useful for griefing... essentially) .... then I fail to see how it is that much of an issue.

unienaule · Oct 17, 2007, 08:31 PM // 20:31

Half time recharge on skills doubles their damage output. 33% recharge is a 50% boost. That's a significant difference.