Curse

Sniper22 · Sep 18, 2007, 09:33 PM // 21:33

They should at least tell you what you are missing in each zone

semantic · Sep 18, 2007, 10:14 PM // 22:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by booooYA

...You can vanquish and then go back around and hug hug hug those walls =]
....

But that's dumb.

Quote:

Originally Posted by arcady

...
Etc...

Those would be 'cartographer titles' with meaning.
....'

good ideas. Would be fun.

SpotJorge · Sep 18, 2007, 10:35 PM // 22:35

k some points here

a - a zone with the size of your radar in Nighfall and chanta is about 0.1% of exploration but in prophecies map same area is 0.05%

b - complete map of a campaign is about 100.7% so a player that have 96% and think he is near the end he is wrong ... its here problems start and where you see who want the tittle and who dont ... 4% is a area with almost the size of ring of fire .. but splited .. this means long hours of comparing maps.

c - to huge walls you have to clear the enemies too including missions (harder here if its time based ones) ... or you think enemies run away of you because you are exploring ? so for this it takes the same time of a vanquish + the time of huge walls (just thing in a zone like droks run for explore)

d - you have areas you only acess with necrotic or some assassin skills to shadow step ex. evenia zone on wilds + dunes misson + rurik path + hidden area on factions ... acessible arenas count .... some challenge missions zones count ... in factions its impossible to find a team to enter jade quarry unless you get all your guild to help you ... and theres really mutch more ....

e - if you ask all players that went for that tittle it was a really hard fight of many weeks ... but trust me when i say theres nothing more gratefull in GW that see that 100% flash on screen when you get it

so in conclusion you wish to have the tittle ? ... Fight for it and do it like all other cartographers did ... instead of try to ask anet to put the tittle on your hand ... if you cant get it you have always the very dificult drunk tittle to achive

Mohnzh · Sep 18, 2007, 11:23 PM // 23:23

I see this thread split into two main groups:

1) Those who have the cartography titles and think they were setup appropriately.

2) Those who do not have the cartography titles and think that ther were not setup appropriately.

Classic have and have-nots. "I don't have it so it's unfair/stupid/waste-of-time/pointless/etc." I'm certain there are a handful that do not fit those two categories (have the title, still think wall-hugging is lame; do not have the title, still think wall-hugging is the way to go). Doesn't matter. Preference is preference. Just because you say something is stupid does not make it stupid. It simply means you do not enjoy it. As a matter of fact, wall-hugging does not require much intelligence. But there are numerous things that require little intelligence, but the rewards from doing them make such activities hardly stupid.

My cartography history: After doing my best with Cantha on my own, not reading anything whatsoever about mapping, I had nearly 90%. That was when I found out about wall-scraping. I was quite frustrated because I had to go back to every single area in the entire campaign to get my GMC title. When NF came out, I decided to scrape as I go. NF GMC was a piece of cake. Never had to consult a map or anything. I wish I had done that in Tyria and Cantha, because it really did not require all that much extra work. I will go get legendary once I finish EotN.

If you accept the requirement and just do it, it really isn't that difficult. If you are really annoyed with it, that's fine too. Don't bother, why would you want a title that you disagree with as a matter of principle. Express your suggestions congenially, and hopefully something more to your liking will come with GW2 and you can find something more up your alley in the meantime.

Aera Lure · Sep 18, 2007, 11:53 PM // 23:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mohnzh

I see this thread split into two main groups:

1) Those who have the cartography titles and think they were setup appropriately.

2) Those who do not have the cartography titles and think that ther were not setup appropriately.

Not necessarily. My warrior did them without even an external program or mod, just 100% maps. I still think its pretty asinine and not worth the trouble. All of my other characters are now retried and my monk is it. She has the most titles now as well, but I certainly wont do it again.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mohnzh

I'm certain there are a handful that do not fit those two categories (have the title, still think wall-hugging is lame; do not have the title, still think wall-hugging is the way to go).

Indeed. Yes I replied to quickly, so thought I'd edit and point out how nicely balanced your post is.

I'll also add while I think the current method is highly annoying, I'm not looking for an easy title either. It seemed silly to me at the time to be walking around trying to wedge myself into nooks and crannies over and over for a title I look back on now as more or less a waste of time, not to mention on the wrong character. While I dont like the process for the title, here and there I did find some fairly nice scenery to admire. So I dont know, it really does simply come down to simply what one gets out of it, like anything else.

wetsparks · Sep 19, 2007, 04:50 AM // 04:50

The reason you have to hug the walls is because the map goes beyond the wall. The way the servers figure out your percentage is the number of pixels revieled. So the extra pixels outside the wall needs to be uncovered. There was a thread about this probably 6 months ago, but it is probably lost by now.

Longasc · Sep 19, 2007, 09:11 AM // 09:11

One can only hope they have a more elegant solution that does not involve hardcore wallhugging for GW2.

But IMO they should get rid of most if not all titles in GW2.

But I fear they are going to make "something different than WoW" and then up with standard faction grind but less content - a bit the GWEN way.

Oh, sorry for going offtopic. I just wanted to say I absolutely gree that cartography in GW is a major pain in the arse.

Imagine Columbus running around San Salvador to get his explorer title...

SpotJorge · Sep 19, 2007, 09:29 AM // 09:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Longasc

Imagine Columbus running around San Salvador to get his explorer title...

hehe Columbus got it because he got lost ... so if Columbus explored GW in Factions problably he would get Nighfall explorer title instead

Nemo the Capitalist · Sep 19, 2007, 10:17 AM // 10:17

its very annoying and takes much skill:to waste your time and your life for anet and ur towards ur title track
but thats not stopping me

Omniclasm · Sep 19, 2007, 10:23 AM // 10:23

I'm confused....

Titles are there to take time, so you stay "interested" in GW for longer. They are there to make you waste your time and let you simulate work.

You whine when it takes too long and/or is too hard or tedious?

Abnaxus · Sep 19, 2007, 11:55 AM // 11:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mohnzh

I see this thread split into two main groups:

1) Those who have the cartography titles and think they were setup appropriately.

2) Those who do not have the cartography titles and think that ther were not setup appropriately.

Classic have and have-nots. "I don't have it so it's unfair/stupid/waste-of-time/pointless/etc."

Wrong, I have both Tyria and Cantha GMC and in several occasions in this forum I expressed my opinion about how wrongly designed GMC title is.

Cantha is totally flawed, especially when it comes to JQ area, that counts towards the title but can be accessed only provided that other 15 real players start the battle. Not to mention the glitched areas and Monastery Overlook.

To me exploration means: visit all places in the map, find nice spots, view all the content the devs put in game.
But when it comes to GMC title, you miss all of this.
You MUST run watching the walls, for hours and hours. Enemies are just obstacles to your wall facing, NPCs you don't consider them at all, nice spots you have no time to waste watching them.
Your only concern is the minimap and the attention to put in order to uncover every single tiny piece of fog.

So basically, you miss all the enjoyment of exploration, which is turned into an idiot activity of wall hugging.

That's why I'm among those who deem GMC very badly designed.
It won't be changed for the current game, but must be rethought for GW2 hopefully.
Probably a good idea would be put some milestones or sign that mark some spots, and once you have reached and read them you have uncovered the part of the map around.
Everything can be good, except the horrible idea of the fog system.

Woop Shotty · Sep 19, 2007, 03:45 PM // 15:45

It should be easier, admit it.

lyra_song · Sep 19, 2007, 03:48 PM // 15:48

I dont know about you guys....but cartography involves drawing maps....and if you dont know how the edge of a land border looks like....how will you draw an accurate map?

VanDamselx · Sep 19, 2007, 04:36 PM // 16:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by semantic

But that's dumb.

good ideas. Would be fun.

If you think that's dumb then fine, don't do it.

I enjoy doing the cartographer titles, even if it means hugging walls and vanquishing an area. Kill two birds with one stone.

mr_groovy · Sep 19, 2007, 05:35 PM // 17:35

yawn this still open?
They aren't gonna change it. Maybe in gw2 if there would be carto titles, then maybe they would somehow implement it. If they would even consider this then

All Gwen issues >>>>> Carto title QQ

Karia Mirniman · Sep 19, 2007, 05:48 PM // 17:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abnaxus

Cantha is totally flawed, especially when it comes to JQ area, that counts towards the title but can be accessed only provided that other 15 real players start the battle. Not to mention the glitched areas and Monastery Overlook.

Don't forget, Naffalls contibution, Remains of Sahlahja, not even part of the story line.

Cartographer looks really cool as a title when you first see it. But once completed it's killed it's own sense of achievement. Protector, Vanquisher cool, GMC is life wasting and requires the player to play improperly, i.e cheat.

Oh and people thinking GW2 is going to be better is.. well, lol.. show me the proof as I look at my HoM.

Karia

p.s. Mister designer, I want a house with lots of cupboards in GW2, just like I had in Neverwinter Nights.

Mohnzh · Sep 19, 2007, 08:43 PM // 20:43

Abnaxus, I see you stopped quoting me right before I included the group you fit into. It was an observation I made, which I clearly indicated that there were exceptions, you being one of them. I cannot be "wrong" about what I saw. If you read (past tense) on, you would have seen that whether or not you fit into those two categories made no difference. I was only pointing them out to say they don't matter anyway.

Furthermore, I do really like the ideas of milestones where you learn histroy, etc. that you suggest. It is reminiscent of the Ascalon quest where you have to find all the ruin markers (you know, the -50hp cesta reward quest!). I thought that was really cool. But it wouldn't be a cartography title anymore. It would be more of an adventurer/historian title.

Cartography has always been about edge-scraping. The professional map-makers (pre-industrial era) had to scrape every inch of coastline, and sail up rivers as far as they could. Observing the coastline from afar was never sufficient, lest they overlook an inlet. The way this title is done most accurately reflects that.

Maybe GW2 could have both a cartography title and a historian/adventurer title. I would like to see the latter. I just don't think you could eliminate wall-scraping and still justify calling it cartography. If it's not your cup of tea, try a mocha.

wolfwing · Sep 20, 2007, 04:44 AM // 04:44

Okay reality check...I don't need to walk along the edge of a cliff to know it's there. and most of the time the things your uncovering you never see. Okay why is there a 20 foot cliff beside me, but I need to be able to know whats on the other side of it? This is the flaw in the system as many have mentioned, when your wasting your time facing a solid cliff, your not seeing the scenery behind you. Where are the cool features your witnessing when staring at a rock? A title should be a challenge, but it should also make sense.

I'm seeing LESS hgging a wall, then I would be having the wall within my agro bubble, least then I'm seeing the other 180*'s and not just the solid face of a wall, or a brief view off the side of a cliff, or on the other side of a lake. Most of the real scenery I never see hugging the wall.

mr_groovy · Sep 20, 2007, 05:14 AM // 05:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolfwing

Okay reality check...I don't need to walk along the edge of a cliff to know it's there. and most of the time the things your uncovering you never see. Okay why is there a 20 foot cliff beside me, but I need to be able to know whats on the other side of it? This is the flaw in the system as many have mentioned, when your wasting your time facing a solid cliff, your not seeing the scenery behind you. Where are the cool features your witnessing when staring at a rock? A title should be a challenge, but it should also make sense.

I'm seeing LESS hgging a wall, then I would be having the wall within my agro bubble, least then I'm seeing the other 180*'s and not just the solid face of a wall, or a brief view off the side of a cliff, or on the other side of a lake. Most of the real scenery I never see hugging the wall.

QQ more? U need to find the boundaries (wall hugging), otherwise you can't see what's behind it. As all people said. If you want the title QQ Less, If you QQ more, then don't go for the title. Go farm Lb / ss points.

And for the record Cantha is doable with non canthan chars. Just remember to explore the monestary at the ring games. 100+% Been there, done that, got the T-shirt. (And I got my 100% cantha with a tyrian char, without having the monestary)

blue.rellik · Sep 20, 2007, 05:59 AM // 05:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpotJorge

hehe Columbus got it because he got lost ... so if Columbus explored GW in Factions problably he would get Nighfall explorer title instead

Can't...stop...laughing....