Curse

elektra_lucia · Oct 30, 2007, 01:11 PM // 13:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by ForgeWhelp

I just realized theat the OP and many others are those guys that get mad that I decided to pay someone to run me from Ascalon to Grotto for my prestige armor instead of fighting my way thru with my 8th toon.

If ANet out and out says they don't have any issues with it, then I don't feel bad about doing it. And you can't make me feel bad for it. I've logged over 1400 hours playing GW and all of it's expansions, I think I've earned my right to take a short cut here or there if it helps keep me playing the game and buying their stuff...

As far as I know, the EULA says running is a violation. I could be wrong on this.

ChaoticCoyote · Oct 30, 2007, 01:15 PM // 13:15

I smell a hint of jealousy here: "I had to work for this title, and you take the easy way out!' Sheesh, it's supposed to be a damned GAME. Quit basing your self-worth (or denigrating others) based on your e-peen.

As the OP demonstrates, GW PvE is about vanity. The gameplay is stagnant and limited, so ANet focused the game on meaningless vanity items -- titles, armors, mini-pets, weapons skins. Those things have *nothing* to do with skill or actual gameplay -- it's just window dressing on an empty game.

It is what it is. Deal with it, or play another game.

ForgeWhelp · Oct 30, 2007, 01:15 PM // 13:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by elektra_lucia

As far as I know, the EULA says running is a violation. I could be wrong on this.

Official Guildwars wiki page on Texmod:

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Texmod

Official Guildwars wiki statementon on Texmod:

Quote:

"As a general rule of thumb, we don't mind if you do things like this to make your own playing experience more fun. Some people really like to mod, and we recognize that this can often be a valuable learning tool. When you're doing it, though, keep in mind that we ask that you don't use our content to mod other games. Please do not attempt to extract anything from your GW.dat with the intent to use it in a mod for another game or project. Also keep in mind that we can't support any changes you make.

In other words, if you try to make some changes and your game crashes, don't contact support because there really isn't anything they will be able to do for you. Make sure you have your disks handy to reinstall

In case anyone was concerned about this reply, keep in mind that alterations that people make to their own .dat files will not affect the play experience of others. All of that important data is stored server side, so any changes that would be able to be made are purely cosmetic. For instance, if someone re-textures their sword to look like a gigantic pickle, they will be the only one to see this change. You won't start seeing people wielding pickle swords running around in random arena any time soon

Also keep in mind that we are always interested to see what stuff you guys come up with. If you do something exceptionally cool that you feel would really benefit the community as a whole, don't be afraid to let us know about it." -- Emily Diehl

elektra_lucia · Oct 30, 2007, 01:21 PM // 13:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by ForgeWhelp

Official Guildwars wiki page on Texmod:

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Texmod

Official Guildwars wiki statementon on Texmod:

I didn't ask for that link, and it's not related to what I said

.

ChaoticCoyote · Oct 30, 2007, 01:23 PM // 13:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jecht Scye

I did Canthan Grandmaster Cartographer a bit ago. I didn't use the texmod thing because I thought it would have been cheap to. I don't mind others that do though, it's their choice and it has no effect on me.

QFT.

Exactly.

Let's get rid of the Wikis, so people can't "cheat" by reading guides.

Bah, I don't even use this mod, and yet I find the OP's position to be nothing more than whiney "I worked hard, why shouldn't other people?"

As it stands now, Gaile is going to play den mother and side with people whose self-worth is tied up in what *other people* do.

Sad.

Bah. This game is nothing more than a chibby chat room for people who have digital egos. Yuck. I only hope the Bonus missions get here, so I can be done with this travesty.

ForgeWhelp · Oct 30, 2007, 01:26 PM // 13:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by elektra_lucia

I didn't ask for that link, and it's not related to what I said

.

I was going with the whole official statement on official site creates a loophole in the EULA for the use of Texmod.

pixiLated · Oct 30, 2007, 02:05 PM // 14:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by elektra_lucia

An extreme exaggeration here.

Jecht Scye: Supposing you are proud of your title, and perhaps want to show it off a little in town. Then magically there is a program you can use that when you press the letter M twice, it does what you have achieved. Instantly! You don't use this program, but everyone else does. Essentially de-valuing your title.

Can you see how this would effect you?

Earlier on in this thread I said this:

Quote:

Originally Posted by pixiLated

Titles like this mean something only to the people that have them. I'm proud of my LGMC's, and to me they have meaning. Do I care if someone else has LGMC and how they got it? Do I hell, I couldnt care less what titles other people have.

So what if they use TexMod? Fair play to them on their tactical use of resources

And I'm speaking as someone who got 2 LGMC without using TexMod, Photoshop or paying for a map compare. Why the hell should I care if someone else has LGMC or how they got it? It's their title, their achievement. Does the fact that someone used TexMod to get theirs bother me or mean that I feel LGMC has been "devalued"? Not at all, they still have to run around to get to the spots that they missed, they are just using a more time efficient way of doing it.

elektra_lucia · Oct 30, 2007, 02:16 PM // 14:16

Quote:

was going with the whole official statement on official site creates a loophole in the EULA for the use of Texmod.

That's cool but it has nothing to do with what I was saying. Look:

Quote:

As far as I know, the EULA says running is a violation. I could be wrong on this.

Which was relating to:

Quote:

I just realized theat the OP and many others are those guys that get mad that I decided to pay someone to run me from Ascalon to Grotto for my prestige armor instead of fighting my way thru with my 8th toon.

Now this:

Quote:

"As a general rule of thumb, we don't mind if you do things like this to make your own playing experience more fun. Some people really like to mod, and we recognize that this can often be a valuable learning tool. When you're doing it, though, keep in mind that we ask that you don't use our content to mod other games. Please do not attempt to extract anything from your GW.dat with the intent to use it in a mod for another game or project. Also keep in mind that we can't support any changes you make.

Is not really related to that. It's about texmod.

As for this:

Quote:

And I'm speaking as someone who got 2 LGMC without using TexMod, Photoshop or paying for a map compare. Why the hell should I care if someone else has LGMC or how they got it? It's their title, their achievement. Does the fact that someone used TexMod to get theirs bother me or mean that I feel LGMC has been "devalued"? Not at all, they still have to run around to get to the spots that they missed, they are just using a more time efficient way of doing it.

I already answered this question. Apologies for making it a personal answer and not something you could emphasize with. If FoW did not cost anything it would not be something to show off. Titles for some are something they are proud of but also something to show off. I hope with this information and the information I have given you before hand, or the theoretical question, you now have the answer to your question.

Torqual · Oct 30, 2007, 02:21 PM // 14:21

By the Gods, what a colossal load of excrement is posted above, mainly by people with only a casual interest, the typical Guru lurkers who love to jump in and tell people not to care about things because they themselves don't give a damn.

So let me get this right, breaking your EULA and altering your game client with a 'Cartography made easy' patch so that you can go from 60% explored to 100% on two continents over a bank holiday weekend is morally equivalent to looking reading wiki and finding out where to cap skills. What utter utter tripe. For the benefit of people that don't know what they are talking about (probably most of the people above) I will provide you with some more information. And let me be clear, it's obvious enough to see who does know what they are talking about, and that is people that have achieved GMC and/or Legendary Cartographer by traditional means, i.e. not modifying your client.

For the benefit of readers who disrespect my character, I have never compared maps using Photoshop or any layered graphical tool. I haven't needed to, because I am a thorough cartographer. Did I explore bonus areas like Rurik's road in the Frost Gate, and Eredon Terrace? Yes, because these were achievable using clever use of teleport skills (something that's already in the game withing to be used) and without cheating. I really cannot believe people that imply anyone that ever read wiki is a cheat according to my logic. That's the most ridiculous strawman I've seen on here in a while.

When mapping Tyria and Elona I never once even did an ALT-TAB. Cantha, yes, that was hard. The map graphics in the Jade Sea are so fuzzy that fog is really indistinguishable from unfog. So I alt-tabbed with Livingston's guide and spent up to 45 minutes on places like Rhea's Crater, in some cases just to get 0.1% or 0.2% here or there I didn't have.

This is my point about the mod. It quite simple makes the invisible visible. People that have an understanding of cartography above the general level of ignorance shown here will understand that normal exploring is extremely difficult, as often when an area is unfogged, the effect is barely - or not - visible on the screen. Often, you'll unfog a point and you don't get 0.1%. Or, you get 0.1% and nothing has changed visibly on the screen. And when you're comparing maps with ALT-TAB (a process that is complicated by different resolutions, image compression etc) you have to strain your naked eye. Ultimately, as I worked out, it's simpler just to go everywhere and that way you hit all the invisible points.

So, the point is that you're searching, slowly and methodically - you have to make the time by clearing the explored area of mobs. But essentially you are looking for something that is largely INVISIBLE.

You can look at your map of an Explorable Area, you're on 92.4%, then you trace the edges and 20 minutes later, you're on 92.7% but your map looks EXACTLY, EXACTLY the same. Or, you may go and scrape the walls, and spend 20 minutes to get nothing.

The point is, you are searching for something that is frequently invisible, and may not exist at all. You have to search methodically, in every area and mission of the continent, until you have clicked them all off. All of the time you must defeat the mobs in the area.

Now..... let's compare that with THIS:

http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/3782/gw003kx8.jpg

Look specifically at how it draws and dynamically shifts BORDERS for you. All you need to do is go and run to the points where the border doesn't match the superimposed fully-explored map, and watch as the client redraws the border.

Using this mod you can:

1) See immediately which zones you have fully exploited for 0.1% and don't need to revisit... saving a huge amount of time.
2) See at a glance which edges you need to 'push out' so the orange border line matches the template.
3) See immediately when it's done and can't be done any more.
4) Rush out and get these points with a running build from the nearest outpost.... avoiding the need to build and equip a team to defeat the monsters in the area.

And what's more..... you don't even need to do any research or leave the program!

People that say this is the same as map comparing in Photoshop are talking utter nonsense. To do this in Photoshop (something I never did) requires you to take many, many screenshots of different areas and go through a lengthy manual process to align and paste layers each. It's something you would do only in desperation when you need the last 0.1% or 0.2% and can't for the life of you work out what you missed. Like I say, I was a competent and thorough cartographer, I didn't rush things, I understood that I was searching for the invisible, and I damn well flayed the skin off my right shoulder to get this title. And the obvious point anyway is that Photoshop doesn't draw you a fracking border that updates dynamically as you move. "Did I hit it yet? Did I hit it yet? Ah, got it. Right, let's map out and go and finish the next zone in 40 seconds."

Does looking up information on wiki draw you a border?

Is photoshop available by pressing U?

So let's be clear, this is not just 'Cartography made easy' it's 'Cartography made laughably easy'. It makes the invisible visible, it shows where you need to go and don't need to go, it shows when an area is completed, it eliminates the need to fight through monsters (instead running) and it updates dynamically. And you don't even have to leave the game. Press U for cheat.

It's nothing like reading wiki or comparing screenshots. Please people, stop talking nonsense. It's clear that most of the posters here don't give a damn and even less know what they are talking about.

To take the CS:Source allegory further, OK... it's not aimbot. It's wallhack. Why bother hunting down the last Counter Terrorist who is stalking you. Just look through solid walls, see where he is hiding, then go round and shoot him in the back! Logical really. Why should people play the game by the rules....these things have been invented to make life easier. People who oppose them want to take us back to the Stone Age.

Bilge.

This has ended up as a typical Guru thread where people are only too delighted to jump in and pour scorn on the person that points out something that needs to be changed.

"Hey, QQ less"
"Hey, no-one cares about you anyway"
"A stupid whine getting all this attention"
"Hey dude you suxxor"

...such posts add no value to the discussion and are the equivalent of saying "Look at me. I am stupid. I had nothing to say but posted anyway."

pumpkin pie · Oct 30, 2007, 02:25 PM // 14:25

For Above Post: Well Said!

when a character reaches 98% on charting the map, can anet please just make all these players have 100%

happy days! and thank you if you do that! i'd be overjoyed!

by the way, I cleared another 0.1% (without texmod) !! Drytop, that makes me 1.2% short

For post below, luckily you are not anet.

SotiCoto · Oct 30, 2007, 02:30 PM // 14:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by pumpkin pie

when a character reaches 98% on charting the map, can anet please just make all these players have 100%

happy days! and thank you if you do that! i'd be overjoyed!

NEVARRR!
Now get your face back on that wall and start grinding!

elektra_lucia · Oct 30, 2007, 02:33 PM // 14:33

The wiki argument is much like buying a walk through for a game on a playstation. Infact in a way that is kind of cheating too. Sure it's not so big that anyone really cares, but if you think about it - it still kind of is cheating.

Torqual - I agree with your post though

.

ForgeWhelp · Oct 30, 2007, 02:36 PM // 14:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by elektra_lucia

That's cool but it has nothing to do with what I was saying.

Whoops, missed the word 'running' in your orginal statement. but that's okay. I'll just refer to the official wiki:

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Runner

And it seems that it does not give any impression that there is anything wrong with runners, so once again I'd go with loophole. As well I could not find anything in the EULA that would need said loophole.

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/EULA/User_Agreement

Karyuu · Oct 30, 2007, 02:37 PM // 14:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Torqual

...such posts add no value to the discussion and are the equivalent of saying "Look at me. I am stupid. I had nothing to say but posted anyway."

Don't mind if I summarize your first post with this statement, do you? After all, it's only fair to return the compliment.

Savio · Oct 30, 2007, 02:43 PM // 14:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Torqual

And let me be clear, it's obvious enough to see who does know what they are talking about, and that is people that have achieved GMC and/or Legendary Cartographer by traditional means, i.e. not modifying your client.

So you're suggesting that only people who did GMC "traditionally" can understand you? You're just full of grinding elitist bullshit. Even the traditionalists agree that it doesn't matter if other players use Texmod.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karyuu

Don't mind if I summarize your first post with this statement, do you? After all, it's only fair to return the compliment.

"what a colossal load of excrement is posted above" is a better summary.

electrofish · Oct 30, 2007, 02:48 PM // 14:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karyuu

Quote:

Originally Posted by Torqual
...such posts add no value to the discussion and are the equivalent of saying "Look at me. I am stupid. I had nothing to say but posted anyway."

Don't mind if I summarize your first post with this statement, do you? After all, it's only fair to return the compliment.

LoL exactly what I was thinking

freekedoutfish · Oct 30, 2007, 02:49 PM // 14:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Torqual

By the Gods....

That is seriously the best post I have read in a long time and I applaud you for it! No sarcasm at all, im being honset!

elektra_lucia · Oct 30, 2007, 02:50 PM // 14:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by ForgeWhelp

Whoops, missed the word 'running' in your orginal statement. but that's okay. I'll just refer to the official wiki:

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Runner

And it seems that it does not give any impression that there is anything wrong with runners, so once again I'd go with loophole. As well I could not find anything in the EULA that would need said loophole.

http://wiki.guildws.com/wiki/EULA/User_Agreement

It took you this long to realise what I was saying. I think I'm more observant than you are. I don't really need you to keep posting links at me. Please don't keep doing it?

As for the EULA It does rather imply that running is forbidden though much like the bible it is not very clear at times.

SotiCoto · Oct 30, 2007, 02:52 PM // 14:52

Request /Lockdown.

This thread is not only a stupid QQ-fest... but the less that Gaile gets baited into believing it significant... the better.

ForgeWhelp · Oct 30, 2007, 02:54 PM // 14:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by elektra_lucia

It took you this long to realise what I was saying. I think I'm more observant than you are. I don't really need you to keep posting links at me. Please don't keep doing it?

As for the EULA It does rather imply that running is forbidden though much like the bible it is not very clear at times.

Okay, I'll stop. But you have agreed that implied or not neither running nor using texmod is clearly forbidden, and there for is effectivly allowed. Running has been around for years and they have at best made it harder, but don't nothing to prevent it. They eleminated it in Factions, but opened it back up again, to a point, in Nightfall. And as far as Texmod goes they have more or less said, 'go for it but if it breaks your game don't cry to us"...