Curse

Extreme Measures · Jul 19, 2007, 12:09 AM // 00:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by reetkever

I didn't see another topic discussing this, so I made one myself...

Well after being angry for a few days after the loot scaling came out, I decided to watch what happened...

A-Net said that with the loot scaling, casual players would be able to buy cool weapons etc. (Which means they're about 1K each). So did this happen? NO. I don't see any difference in prices, except ecto, but that's because UW is about the only farm spot left, and ecto's are the only way of making decent cash.

What DID happen, is people getting poor. Going from 100K to 5K while just buying needed stuff is just not right. Clearing ENTIRE AREA'S in Hard Mode only nets one about 600 gold, which excludes the bonus cash for clearing, but you still gotta buy ID Kits and Salvage Kits.

So why the hell is the loot scaling still here? Are we supposed to farm a week just to buy some descent skills? Are we supposed to save our cash for 5 months in order to buy 1,5K armor? Is this the way you keep your people playing, A-Net?

The ironic thing is that the rich people (1000K and more) stay rich, and the poor people (150K and less) keep getting more poor. PEOPLE ARE NOT LOWERING PRICES, and BOTS ARE ALIVE AND KICKING. Once again, a farm nerf update ruins the economy, and casual players who NEEDED to farm in order to buy skills, armor and keys are screwed.

Please tell me A-Net, how the hell am I supposed to make cash, only playing 2 hours a day, and getting only about 10K per week?

Please only add constructive criticism, and not just flame or spam or whine about whining...

You must be in a dream world.... I still clear over 100k per week farming in hard mode with my Elem/Derv....... There is plenty of gold to be made, but the problem is with these people that have ZERO patience. I do 15 min farms in Cliffs of Dohjok, and I get 3-4 gold unid, runes, materials, all kinds of stuff... 5k run for 15 min work. So dont tell me there is no gold to be made.. because Im still doing it, and Im doing it in a noobish area of Nightfall.
I dumped 7000 tanned hide squares today, cause the price went from 4g each to 6g each on the sell side. I had 700+ steel ingots that I saved until the price hit 200-210 on the sell side at the rare material trader, then I dumped it all.
You have to be smart, and if you are, there is plenty of gold to be made.
Did you know that you can net profit +50g per bottle of ink, free and clear..
All you need to do is save your plant fibers, and dust, in which I had 7000 of each... I then crafted glass, which takes both of those materials, it cost me approx 60g , which includes the glass, to craft ink... and I then sell the ink at rare trader for 110-120 per bottle. Can you imagine 500-1000 bottles of ink sold at 120 a bottle ???
It takes time, and it takes patience. If you dont have neither, you will not be rich in this game....
And my last tip, I salvage every weapon I get that is white, and blue if it is under 70g... if its over 70g, or purple, i just sell it at the trader....
Salvage it all, and save your materials. Except Bones, Granite, and Wood, they all have set prices, and you can dump them as you get them at the material trader... no need to save those...
It used to be good to craft Parchment with the wood, but parchment on the sell side is so horrible now, its not worth it. Unless you are using free wood that you have got while farming.
Anyways, it can be done, just a little creativity.

Liquid Fusion (in game name)

Sergeant of Marines · Jul 19, 2007, 12:36 AM // 00:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kinn

My experience:

I'm a new player; been playing the game only 3 months, so Loot Scaling hit me right from the start basically (and I never attempted farming before the HM update anyway). I only play with one character (a Ranger).

Last Monday I completed the Nightfall campaign. I have already completed both Prophecies and Factions.

In those 3 months, the most I've ever had in my inventory at one time is 20K. I never spend money on vanity items. I never buy skills unless I absolutely need them for a particular build in mind. I have only ever been able to afford 1.5K armour, and the only reason I have a Sup Vigor is because one dropped for me. All my weapons are collector weapons apart from my two Factions and Nightfall end-game greens.

So far, I have enjoyed the game. It has been awesome. But now that I have completed all three campaigns I want nice things. I want 15K Kurzick armour, dyed black. I want cool skinned weapons for all my builds, and maybe *gasp* even give my heroes some runes and max dmg weapons

Aquiring these things is not feasible for me. I'm not playing a 55 monk or other class with a gimmick build that can farm HM. I work full time and can only invest at absolute maximum a dozen hours over the whole week; I guess that makes me a "casual gamer".
So, Anet - in what way, shape, or form does Loot Scaling benefit me, the "casual gamer"? I cannot farm normal mode because nothing drops. I cannot farm hard mode because I'm, well, a Ranger and not a 55 monk gimmick to put it bluntly.

Is my only option to trap the Underworld in the hope of getting ectos? Not very bloody likely when it costs a plat to get in only for me to die immediately because I haven't had any experience farming there.

"But you don't need any of this vanity stuff!" I hear you say. But everywhere I look, expensive armour and vanity weapons are teasing me. Towns are full of players kitted out in 15K armour, the pugs I join are full of tarts wielding rare-skinned golds and exotic greens. I course I bloody want these things - EVERYONE ELSE HAS GOT THEM!

Have you ever heard of the 105 /Famine Farm for Titan Gems?

They still net about 20 to 25k a piece and the run only take 5 mins to do...

I do this about an hour a day and manage anywhere from 1 to 3 Titans...

You can either:
a. Sell them immediatly for the 20 to 25k profit
b. Save them to get an Armbrace of truth for you "Rare" Weapon
c. Save them for an Armbrace of turth and sell that for around 100k and 70 ectos...

There is plenty of money to be made in this game, you just have to *gasp* work at it!

Since loot scaling for me, might not be for everyone;

Loot scaling=me 2 sets of Fow Armor and 3/4 of the way to my 3rd set...not bragging or anything but you just have to work at it, and I usually only play for about 3 to 4 hours a day.

reetkever · Jul 19, 2007, 01:26 AM // 01:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sergeant of Marines

Have you ever heard of the 105 /Famine Farm for Titan Gems?

They still net about 20 to 25k a piece and the run only take 5 mins to do...

Yes, but I don't have the right profession at that place yet. Besides, DoA has been nerfed now, so by the time I get there, the titan gems are so overfarmed they're worthless.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sergeant of Marines

I do this about an hour a day and manage anywhere from 1 to 3 Titans...

You can either:
a. Sell them immediatly for the 20 to 25k profit

I don't have the time to sell items. Besides, I wonder if 'WTS Titan Gem' even fits in the party search thingy...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sergeant of Marines

b. Save them to get an Armbrace of truth for you "Rare" Weapon

I don't want rare weapons, I want skills, keys and stuff like boardwalk tickets so I can play, too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sergeant of Marines

c. Save them for an Armbrace of turth and sell that for around 100k and 70 ectos...

Once again, I have too little time for selling stuff, and the trade system is broken atm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sergeant of Marines

There is plenty of money to be made in this game, you just have to *gasp* work at it!

And that is the problem. Doesn't A-Net want us NOT to work at it? What they're doing and saying are the opposite. We gotta work more and more and more for fun things.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sergeant of Marines

Since loot scaling for me, might not be for everyone;

Loot scaling=me 2 sets of Fow Armor and 3/4 of the way to my 3rd set...not bragging or anything but you just have to work at it, and I usually only play for about 3 to 4 hours a day.

That probably is the exemption list, loot scaling just makes everything drop less. It's the exemption list that makes the titan gems still drop sometimes. It's the exemption list that saved us from the economy crash that the loot scaling almost created (ecto prises rising 3K in a matter of hours).

If the loot scaling was removed, you'd just make more profit, so it's not helping you at all.

Thanks for the tips, but they only work for people who have the right character at the right place, and who are patient enough to sell things with the broken pile of **** called the trade system.

Cyandroid · Jul 19, 2007, 03:15 AM // 03:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by reetkever

A common made argument is that people should stop spending cash when not needed... So the casual player is doomed to play through the game with Starter Armor, Starter Weapons and 3 skills? (these aren't actually NEEDED, as when you are truly skilled, you might beat the game with that).

Well even if we ARE doomed to do this, is it actually FUN?

Ok, please admit that you're stretching the truth just a bit here. I play "casually" and I have had no problem paying for new armor sets and skills without doing any farming whatsoever. I simply use the gold I find as I progress through the game. I've purchased 3 new armor sets already and I'm only level 16 with this character.
I'm not buying your argument at all.

Naylyn · Jul 19, 2007, 06:07 AM // 06:07

Just by playing the game it is possible to get enough money to buy everything you need just by merching all of your junk. If you don't have enough money then you are most likely keeping stuff that you shouldn't be (hint:That req11 9% while hexed sword with a 13/12 sundering mod isn't ever going to be useful).

If you want 15k armour or superior vigor runes then work for them or be satisfied with droks armour and a major vigor rune.

Also I have been able to get a full set of 15k armour dyed black and several new greens since loot scaling through FoW and HM runs, and I only play mesmer so don't try to claim that you have to have a 55hp monk or anything like that to be able to make money.

Grukk Darkfire · Jul 27, 2007, 01:24 AM // 01:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Naylyn

Just by playing the game it is possible to get enough money to buy everything you need just by merching all of your junk. If you don't have enough money then you are most likely keeping stuff that you shouldn't be (hint:That req11 9% while hexed sword with a 13/12 sundering mod isn't ever going to be useful).

If you want 15k armour or superior vigor runes then work for them or be satisfied with droks armour and a major vigor rune.

Agreed!!!

There is absolutely no need for 15K armour or green weapons to finish the game. It is just "bling" for your character and nothing more!

My first character a W/R was able to finish all the missions and all but the titan quests from Proficies with Droks armour, a purple axe, and zero elites! My Mo/N was able to obtain Protector of Tyria with Droks armour, a blue healing ankh, a gold holy rod and only one elite.

If I don't salvage from them all my blue, purple, and gold drops are sold directly to the merchants or weapons npc. I even sold my one green drop tothe weapons npc because it didn't work for my profession. I have no interest in spending any amount of time trying to find people to purchase them, I'd rather play the game.

I think people forget it is a game and if people were to play the game with the prices set by the game everything would work out fine. When people start to set their own prices for things (like ectos & green weapons) the prices for everything-else gets F'ed up.

Personally I believe the people who participate in the overpricing of items in any-way-shape-or-form are the ones causing the Loot Scaling problems. When the price of things change dramatically you have no one to criticize but yourselves.

I refuse to participate and laugh at those who do participate in the purchasing or selling of items at greater prices than what the npcs provide.

Regards,
Grukk

Iuris · Jul 27, 2007, 07:54 AM // 07:54

I have always played in full parties, for 9 months.
I have 8 characters. 5 wear 15k armor, 3 don't, but only because I don't like any of the 15k armors available to them. All are using runes and insignia.
All of the above characters have unlocked enough skills to run several builds.
I have about 180k in my storage.

Yesterday, by clearing out normal mode Drazach thicket of monsters and doing the available quests there, I earned about 2.5k in 1hour 30mins, and got a few steel ingots to save up. That's two skills, or a piece of normal armour.

So, I call the OP's bluff. You can get the gold playing.

Also, Nightfall campaign alone, assuming just primary quests and masters missions yields you 14k gold. Enough for a normal max armour and assumes no drops at all during the game.

If you want to earn gold, consider the following:
-use the quest rewards to buy identification kits and ID everything that drops. By the time you run out of the credits, commendations, tokens, requisitions, battle commendations, coins, artifacts AND secrets, you'll have a long beard.
-do some quests, the rewards add up

Oh, BTW:
I've spent quite some time farming kurzick faction by completing the Duel of the houses quest. It takes 3-5 minutes, barring wipes and Oni minefields, and rewards 100 gold. That's at least 1000 gold in an hour, plus any drops, plus 4000 Kurzick faction, yielding 4 amber, which you can sell at the daily prices.

reetkever · Jul 28, 2007, 08:55 PM // 20:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iuris

Yesterday, by clearing out normal mode Drazach thicket of monsters and doing the available quests there, I earned about 2.5k in 1hour 30mins, and got a few steel ingots to save up. That's two skills, or a piece of normal armour.

So, I call the OP's bluff. You can get the gold playing.

Yesterday, when clearing snake dance with a friend of mine and heroes, and half of Dreadnaught's Drift (Until my friend accidentally teleported us to the UW -.-), I got like 6 items. Whole Snake Dance = 6 items. They weren't even good, 2 Raven Staves, some Troll Tusks and that's it. Selling everything together, and the gold we picked up, I got 800 gold. That's in 2 hours.

What I'm trying to tell is: You being lucky with drop numbers, doesn't mean we all are. And 2K from clearing an area still isn't much. I'm supposed to do 1 hour of continuous grinding in an area, AND do some quests, and THEN, I'm able to buy 2 skills?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iuris

Also, Nightfall campaign alone, assuming just primary quests and masters missions yields you 14k gold. Enough for a normal max armour and assumes no drops at all during the game.

But too bad that I already did these quests, and masters is too hard on some missions. If not, I already have done it way back when cash was easy to get.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iuris

If you want to earn gold, consider the following:
-use the quest rewards to buy identification kits and ID everything that drops. By the time you run out of the credits, commendations, tokens, requisitions, battle commendations, coins, artifacts AND secrets, you'll have a long beard.

Already did the quests that give them, and already used the rewards to get sup salvage kits, which I sold. This was of course, before the loot scaling, so I had no idea it would be hard to make cash back then, and just spent the money. (btw I do have hair under my chin, so yeah...)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iuris

-do some quests, the rewards add up

Already did most quests, the ones I still have to do are way too hard and troublesome, and only have 300 gold as reward, anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iuris

Oh, BTW:
I've spent quite some time farming kurzick faction by completing the Duel of the houses quest. It takes 3-5 minutes, barring wipes and Oni minefields, and rewards 100 gold. That's at least 1000 gold in an hour, plus any drops, plus 4000 Kurzick faction, yielding 4 amber, which you can sell at the daily prices.

Sorry, I do not like to repeat a single quest over and over and over, for a minimum amount of cash. Isn't it called... grinding? Something A-net said we would NOT need if we wanted to get cash?

My main problem here isn't even cash anymore, my main problem is A-Net screwing with us all. They tell us it's easier to buy stuff for casual players, while they did NOTHING to make it easier. NOTHING at all. The loot scaling helps NOBODY at all, and still A-net says it's better for everyone.

And don't come with: 'I'm getting way more golds now.' cause that is NOT the scaling, it's the prevention list (Which is, btw, only good for farmers, because it.

And it might be true that I can play the game without 15K armor and without elite skills or max armor, but do people want that? NO. It's A-Net forgetting that it's just a game. Why work for cool stuff like that? Why make it nearly impossible? Wouldn't it be more FUN if we could get these items without having to grind endlessly?

Why doesn't A-Net just make these rare weapons drop ALOT? That way, everyone can get them. So what if the weapon is useless? If YOU like the skin, you'll enjoy it, no matter how many other people share the same weapon with perfect stats. Is it so hard to make the 'leet' stuff accessible to everyone?

Loviatar · Jul 28, 2007, 10:02 PM // 22:02

[QUOTE]

Quote:

Originally Posted by reetkever

Yesterday, when clearing snake dance with a friend of mine and heroes, and half of Dreadnaught's Drift (Until my friend accidentally teleported us to the UW -.-), I got like 6 items. Whole Snake Dance = 6 items. They weren't even good, 2 Raven Staves, some Troll Tusks and that's it. Selling everything together, and the gold we picked up, I got 800 gold. That's in 2 hours.

i gave you a easy dependable run anybody can do that will get you 8 to 10 times what you got there or the other places you have farmed at.

i just did the exact same run to see if anything had changed which it didnt.

except this time i got a white dye which adds a few k to it..

without the white dye i got a total sale net of3.4 K for ONE HOUR

you got 400 gold per hour so it is you that is the problem not the scaling

Quote:

What I'm trying to tell is: You being lucky with drop numbers, doesn't mean we all are. And 2K from clearing an area still isn't much. I'm supposed to do 1 hour of continuous grinding in an area, AND do some quests, and THEN, I'm able to buy 2 skills?

mine is over 3 skills or at least 5 skills counting the dye.

since other people have run the same run i detailed with the same results it is not just one lucky player

Quote:

My main problem here isn't even cash anymore, my main problem is A-Net screwing with us all. They tell us it's easier to buy stuff for casual players, while they did NOTHING to make it easier. NOTHING at all. The loot scaling helps NOBODY at all, and still A-net says it's better for everyone.

every bitch you make is cash so give that up already.

YOUR PROBLEM IS THAT YOU ARE NOT ONLY NOT A CASUAL PLAYER YOU WOULD NOT RECOGNIZE A CASUAL PLAYER AT ALL

Quote:

And it might be true that I can play the game without 15K armor and without elite skills or max armor, but do people want that? NO. It's A-Net forgetting that it's just a game. Why work for cool stuff like that? Why make it nearly impossible?

no reet it is you who have forgotten it is a game.

and *max armor* can be drok or basic but you think 15 K is the starting point for max armor.

here tis the terrible truth reet.

a casual player (most of the players) is playing the game doing the missions the quests getting to the next part of the game having fun PLAYING THE GAME

you.................

keys for chest runs i have fun chest running so make them real cheap but keep the chest rewards high to make me rich.

CASUAL PLAYER

i found a key that dropped and got a real nice purple ..... goodie

you

i need 15K armor for all the ones that dont get FOW armor i deserve the nicer things

CASUAL PLAYER

i got my 1.5 K DROKS armor and boy i feel great about it

you

i need a bunch of elites and other skills to play around with builds

CASUAL PLAYER

doesnt even think about skills except to grab a few along the way and maybe cap an elite doing a mission playing the game.

you are not playing the game reet you are working to get the best things possible it seems to try to impress people with what you have.

if you are not having fun playing the game and it is work instead of fun have the brains to stop for a break instead of bitching.

i have spent less than 5k total over all characters in the last 6 months since wintersday.

i am playing for fun not working for proft

Age · Jul 28, 2007, 10:06 PM // 22:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by reetkever

Yesterday, when clearing snake dance with a friend of mine and heroes, and half of Dreadnaught's Drift (Until my friend accidentally teleported us to the UW -.-), I got like 6 items. Whole Snake Dance = 6 items. They weren't even good, 2 Raven Staves, some Troll Tusks and that's it. Selling everything together, and the gold we picked up, I got 800 gold. That's in 2 hours.

What I'm trying to tell is: You being lucky with drop numbers, doesn't mean we all are. And 2K from clearing an area still isn't much. I'm supposed to do 1 hour of continuous grinding in an area, AND do some quests, and THEN, I'm able to buy 2 skills?

But too bad that I already did these quests, and masters is too hard on some missions. If not, I already have done it way back when cash was easy to get.

Already did the quests that give them, and already used the rewards to get sup salvage kits, which I sold. This was of course, before the loot scaling, so I had no idea it would be hard to make cash back then, and just spent the money. (btw I do have hair under my chin, so yeah...)

Already did most quests, the ones I still have to do are way too hard and troublesome, and only have 300 gold as reward, anyway.

Sorry, I do not like to repeat a single quest over and over and over, for a minimum amount of cash. Isn't it called... grinding? Something A-net said we would NOT need if we wanted to get cash?

My main problem here isn't even cash anymore, my main problem is A-Net screwing with us all. They tell us it's easier to buy stuff for casual players, while they did NOTHING to make it easier. NOTHING at all. The loot scaling helps NOBODY at all, and still A-net says it's better for everyone.

And don't come with: 'I'm getting way more golds now.' cause that is NOT the scaling, it's the prevention list (Which is, btw, only good for farmers, because it.

And it might be true that I can play the game without 15K armor and without elite skills or max armor, but do people want that? NO. It's A-Net forgetting that it's just a game. Why work for cool stuff like that? Why make it nearly impossible? Wouldn't it be more FUN if we could get these items without having to grind endlessly?

Why doesn't A-Net just make these rare weapons drop ALOT? That way, everyone can get them. So what if the weapon is useless? If YOU like the skin, you'll enjoy it, no matter how many other people share the same weapon with perfect stats. Is it so hard to make the 'leet' stuff accessible to everyone?

You said it perfectly as I farm casual and don't get near enough as pro.I remember the days when you could get 10 or 15 ectos on a single run or shards.I didn't farm the UW or FoW back then but I know some who have and got their FoW relatively easy .

manitoba1073 · Jul 29, 2007, 12:54 AM // 00:54

[QUOTE=Loviatar]

Quote:

i gave you a easy dependable run anybody can do that will get you 8 to 10 times what you got there or the other places you have farmed at.

i just did the exact same run to see if anything had changed which it didnt.

except this time i got a white dye which adds a few k to it..

without the white dye i got a total sale net of3.4 K for ONE HOUR

you got 400 gold per hour so it is you that is the problem not the scaling

mine is over 3 skills or at least 5 skills counting the dye.

since other people have run the same run i detailed with the same results it is not just one lucky player

every bitch you make is cash so give that up already.

YOUR PROBLEM IS THAT YOU ARE NOT ONLY NOT A CASUAL PLAYER YOU WOULD NOT RECOGNIZE A CASUAL PLAYER AT ALL

no reet it is you who have forgotten it is a game.

and *max armor* can be drok or basic but you think 15 K is the starting point for max armor.

here tis the terrible truth reet.

a casual player (most of the players) is playing the game doing the missions the quests getting to the next part of the game having fun PLAYING THE GAME

you.................

keys for chest runs i have fun chest running so make them real cheap but keep the chest rewards high to make me rich.

CASUAL PLAYER

i found a key that dropped and got a real nice purple ..... goodie

you

i need 15K armor for all the ones that dont get FOW armor i deserve the nicer things

CASUAL PLAYER

i got my 1.5 K DROKS armor and boy i feel great about it

you

i need a bunch of elites and other skills to play around with builds

CASUAL PLAYER

doesnt even think about skills except to grab a few along the way and maybe cap an elite doing a mission playing the game.

you are not playing the game reet you are working to get the best things possible it seems to try to impress people with what you have.

if you are not having fun playing the game and it is work instead of fun have the brains to stop for a break instead of bitching.

i have spent less than 5k total over all characters in the last 6 months since wintersday.

i am playing for fun not working for proft

So sometimes you really go off there alot at times

But in my book and many others someone getting 400 gold an hour is not just there problem but chances are very likely high that many others are also like that. It also true it is anerf fault as the problem before was not enough people were getting decent rewards for casual playing. A simple just adding a higher chance alone would have been the perfect solution long ago as I had mention numerous times, since there are 2 economies ingame, 1 for vanity and 1 for necessity items. The only thing loot scaling has effected whether anyone wants to admit to is the fact to get necessities harder since they havent gone down in price at all. You can spin what you want on this and that but we really know the truth abouts drops its random and your chances to even receive the drop are pittifully low.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

You said it perfectly as I farm casual and don't get near enough as pro.I remember the days when you could get 10 or 15 ectos on a single run or shards.I didn't farm the UW or FoW back then but I know some who have and got their FoW relatively easy .

Its ok bro you know if you every need help on anything, you know how to get ahold of me most of the time lol.

frodo7 · Jul 29, 2007, 01:14 AM // 01:14

Some of you seem confused because loot scaling and HM came out at the same time. People are getting more money and golds because of HM, not loot scaling. Loot scaling has nothing to do with the quality of drops, HM does. So if you are going to credit something from that update with your newfound ability to make more money, please attribute it to HM, because it sure as hell was'nt because of lootscaling.

reetkever · Jul 29, 2007, 01:29 AM // 01:29

Quote: