Curse

TheRaven · Feb 06, 2008, 04:08 PM // 16:08

I don't want this thread to turn into a debate/flamefest on the merits of running Ursan or running a balanced group. We all have our opinions and both sides have valid points.

What I would like to see is a discussion on which professions you feel are acceptable in an Ursan pug. Here is why I ask. Inger posted in a separate thread that Ursan has opened up a lot of areas to different characters that before were always excluded from elite areas **cough** Mesmer **cough**. I replied that I thought Ursan made areas like DOA even more restricted. I've been told that if you aren't an Ursan Warrior, don't bother.

Later someone else replied and said that wasn't true and any profession is welcome in Ursan groups.

I really want to explore DOA and it seems that Ursan is the only acceptable build nowadays. I wish that weren't true. Other builds are capable of completing DOA, but like I said that isn't the point of this thread. So with Ursan in mind I decided to try and boost my Ele's Ursan rank. She's currently a level 6 and I guess I'll need to be level 10 before attempting DOA.

I went to Olafstead and attempted to join some Ursan HM Norn point farmers. I saw a guy starting an Ursan group and advertising for more Ursans and 2 monks. He was only a rank 4 Ursan himself and only had 2 people in his group so I figured he'd accept my rank 6. I invited myself and got rejected. I tried again and was rejected again. I whispered him and asked why I couldn't join. I had Ursan. His reply was quite rude. "Noob! Only melee runs Ursan! ur a stupid Ele!"

So, should I even bother boosting my Ursan rank? I see posts here saying all professions are welcome as Ursans, but I don't see that ingame. I see Warriors or Dervishes only getting into the groups. And if I can't run Ursan as an Ele is there any way I can explore DOA. I can't depend on my Alliance to take me so don't even suggest that.

[Morkai] · Feb 06, 2008, 04:12 PM // 16:12

Nah man he was clearly retarded, true Ele's have lower armor than Melee chars, but they have a bigger energy pool which = pwn in Ursanway.

I see Eles, Rangers, Mesmers Necro,s ALL the squishes running Ursan... Doesn't really matter as long as you have competent Monks.

Also, I get accepted in DoA with r7 Norn and r8 LB so ya..r10 isn't *needed* as such. Just my two cents.

super strokey · Feb 06, 2008, 04:14 PM // 16:14

Sounds to me like he was a jerk, ive never had a problem getting Ursan group ever and i run a necor, given that necros and ursan were seemingly made for one another though that may help. Im a rank 8 ursan so im not too far ahead of you either and certainly nothing that would make a huge difference. If a group thats all ursan still wants just wars they gotta not understand how groups like that work.

enmitee · Feb 06, 2008, 04:15 PM // 16:15

Soulreaping = almost always ursan

aapo · Feb 06, 2008, 04:16 PM // 16:16

Higher AL = better result, since you don't need much anything else. Also your norn rank determines how powerful you will be. I'd say that you would be best making Warrior for DoA farming. PUGs accept other professions and lower than perfect ranks too when there's nothing better available, but your worth is only determined by the contribution you can make to your team.

Numa Pompilius · Feb 06, 2008, 04:27 PM // 16:27

That guy was obviously an idiot, and he probably saved you an unfortunate PUG experience by not letting you join, but warriors do have some advantages over other classes as ursans: stonefist insignia and stronger armor, and to a smaller degree also via their primary attribute (strength).

That said I suspect the best ursans are paragons.

cebalrai · Feb 06, 2008, 04:38 PM // 16:38

My R/W stance tank has silly high elemental armor and has a 75% block chance. Hit whirling, then Ursan (level 8), and I've got an invinci-bear.

Most overpowered thing Anet has ever conceived.

Also, who cares what your energy pool is with Ursan? My ranger has 26 max energy and never runs out.

GrimEye · Feb 06, 2008, 04:49 PM // 16:49

Both ursan group and balanced group have their share of retards. Anyone saying Ursan group are god-mode, have to go to olafstead to see how a "god-mode" in retarded way.

Anyway, as Ritualist, I always run secondary warrior to be able to get the full benefit of the shield armor and sword/axe. However, I also used a focus (asuran channelling) and Hauto's ambition with +12en +30hp and +10 armor against slashing (riddle of the steel) or +30 against piercing (through thick and thin). Casters can find a focus appropriate to their profession. This solves the problem of caster's armor greatly.

(I like Spirit Strength build, so Im familliar as a caster going melee)

If you really want to buff your armor, go paragon secondary. Bladeturn refrain will give you +28 to +34 against slashing damage and mending refrain +3 pips of hp regen. Since these are echo and reapplied every end of shout and chant, Ursan roar will most always maintain them while you are in bear. For a lone Ursan, its a hell to maintain, but in a group, it works quite well.

Again, I see another meta-build in the offing: ursan/paragon.

Bad players will always be playing bad, however seemingly "godly" their skills are.

My Take.

Kusandaa · Feb 06, 2008, 04:49 PM // 16:49

I never have problems getting in groups as a necromancer - R10 Norn, plus R8 LB for DoA. Soul Reaping is awesome since I can stay under UB a lot more than the others. I've tried Ursan on other characters, my assassin and my ele... and I highly prefer my necromancer because of SR.

However, I had one group refusing me because I was a necro, and the guy wanted warrior ursans only, which I found kind of dumb TBH. And yes, I know warriors having higher armor than casters and such.

Steps_Descending · Feb 06, 2008, 04:50 PM // 16:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by cebalrai

Also, who cares what your energy pool is with Ursan? My ranger has 26 max energy and never runs out.

Well technicaly Para, elem, and necro (the profession with the least energy problem (in ursan)) will have the advantage of (maybe) having enough energy to run between 2 groups and keeping ursan while a war (for example) will run out of energy. That said if there is a party member that runs out, the elem still has to wait for their recharge and HIS because he wil probably have ran out of energy by now.

tsmarcot · Feb 06, 2008, 04:50 PM // 16:50

My Monk is my primary for most Ursan groups. When I am not healing Ursans, I run a Mo/W with a minimum 9 tactics and 12 sword mastery. I take a zealous sword of Fortitude with a +5energy inscription. And a req9 tactics shield with +30 HP and -5/20% inscription or for DoA I use the Aegis of Augh for it's +10 armor vs. Demons.

With the shield you will have more armor (and be less squishy) and with a Sword or Axe you will do more melee damage with Ursan Roar (if you meet the requirements for the item)

This works for any caster class, and of course Ele and Necro have an easier time with energy, just bring a shield and meet its requirements to add survivability to your Character.

Increasing your Norn rank will help you acquire a place in PUG groups, and in DoA having a high or max rank in both Norn and Lightbringer with give you more opportunities.

NOTE: Going /Paragon will also give you the option for a shield as well as a hard res if you are not a primary monk.

KamikazeChicken · Feb 06, 2008, 04:51 PM // 16:51

Any profession can run Ursan just fine. Some professions have certain benefits (N soul reaping, E energy storage, R +ele AL/expertise, etc.), but that doesn't usually mean a whole lot overall.

I do like Ursan Rangers who run Dwarven Stability(?)+Serpent's Quickness though.

Steps_Descending · Feb 06, 2008, 04:54 PM // 16:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by GrimEye

Anyway, as Ritualist, I always run secondary warrior to be able to get the full benefit of the shield armor and sword/axe. However, I also used a focus (asuran channelling) and Hauto's ambition with +12en +30hp and +10 armor against slashing (riddle of the steel) or +30 against piercing (through thick and thin). Casters can find a focus appropriate to their profession. This solves the problem of caster's armor greatly.

If you really want to buff your armor, go paragon secondary. Bladeturn refrain will give you +28 to +34 against slashing damage and mending refrain +3 pips of hp regen. Since these are echo and reapplied every end of shout and chant, Ursan roar will most always maintain them while you are in bear. For a lone Ursan, its a hell to maintain, but in a group, it works quite well.

Bad players will always be playing bad, however seemingly "godly" their skills are.

My Take.

Allow me to quote that : The proof Ursan isn't plain&simple god mode : if you think a bit you can upgrade it even more.

jimmywho · Feb 06, 2008, 04:56 PM // 16:56

imo mesmer is one of the best class' for ursan as the elemental mantra's last over 70s with just 12 in inspiration, add dwarven stability and thats a 100+ seconds of elemental damage reduction and energy gain. mantra of frost for gloom, mantra of earth and fire for foundry, etc etc.

GrimEye · Feb 06, 2008, 05:01 PM // 17:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steps_Descending

Allow me to quote that : The proof Ursan isn't plain&simple god mode : if you think a bit you can upgrade it even more.

I can think of a few. But people hating Ursan may call it "ursan is beyond god-like".

EmptySkull · Feb 06, 2008, 05:15 PM // 17:15

Any class can run Ursan. We have been doing Ursan in my alliance. And almost always have several caster ursans. We even have a couple of low rank ursans and low rank LB. Still do fine. We have had some near wipe experiences but did finish.
I have an ele. This is what I did to increase my survivability. Fisrt I use geomancer insiginas. +10 ar ele + 10 vs earth. Really helps if you get alot of rage titans in foundry. I was taking zealous daggers to keep my ursan up. Matter of fact with zealous daggers I would never come out of ursan unless I wanted too. But I figured that I didn't need them and went for the extra armor of a shield. Right now I have got a R:9 tactics shield and put have 9 points in tactics. The shield has -5(20%) and a +30 health mod. If I get a green shield drop with +10 vs demons I'm gonna start using that.

I use a zealous sword with a +5 energy inscription and a +30 health mod. I have no points in sword attribute. Seems to work well.

I have 12+2 in EStorage. I have 9 points in tactics and the rest in Fire magic. That way when I do start in I glyph sac nuke then go ursan. But really you can do anyhting with those other points I put into fire. Because after you go ursan you won't come out till the long battle is done and that is because you chose too.

But there are many options you could go with. You could go secondary Para and use a para shield.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GrimEye

snip...
Since these are echo and reapplied every end of shout and chant, Ursan roar will most always maintain them while you are in bear. For a lone Ursan, its a hell to maintain, but in a group, it works quite well.

Right but unless you coordinate it well with the party the shout ursan roar never actually ends. So the refrains don't get reapplied. It is a good idea but just tough to micromanage.

~ Dan ~ · Feb 06, 2008, 05:31 PM // 17:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Berek

Nah man he was clearly retarded, true Ele's have lower armor than Melee chars, but they have a bigger energy pool which = pwn in Ursanway.

Well not really, energy management is always better than more energy. But that's the whole thing with ursan, encouraging bad players to play bad. Squishies in the frontline being well, squished.. for the sake of energy. Never learning anything but what 2 or so skills on their bar do.

I would feel sorry for the monks having to overheal for these idiots, but well.. they're probably bad anyway if they're running ursanway.

the Puppeteer · Feb 06, 2008, 05:38 PM // 17:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRaven

I went to Olafstead and attempted to join some Ursan HM Norn point farmers. I saw a guy starting an Ursan group and advertising for more Ursans and 2 monks. He was only a rank 4 Ursan himself and only had 2 people in his group so I figured he'd accept my rank 6. I invited myself and got rejected. I tried again and was rejected again. I whispered him and asked why I couldn't join. I had Ursan. His reply was quite rude. "Noob! Only melee runs Ursan! ur a stupid Ele!"

If you start listening to ppl like him - better just stop playing GW

hurric · Feb 06, 2008, 05:44 PM // 17:44

that's the most retarded thing I've ever heard anyone say (the guy organizing the pug and rejecting you). in DoA 2 things matter if you do ursanway
1- your ursan level (obviously)
2- whether or not you know the area. (learn this by doing it and getting on right targets)

overaggroing is what kills people or people who take quests too early in veil/etc. I used to run my Rit there (til I got bored) and I didn't bother with shield/etc. I have only minor runes though so it helps to have close to 600hp.
Ursan is stupidly overpowered for anyone with high rank to run more than efficiently. it's stupidly boring though as you'll probably find out.

Skyy High · Feb 06, 2008, 05:45 PM // 17:45

Wars and paragons make the best Ursans: high armor, wars get added bonus of melee damage and some nice effects that stack with UB like Signet of Stamina, paragons get energy from Roar.

Then comes Rangers and Necroes: Rangers have great armor against ele damage and can apply some long-lasting stances (especially with Dwarven Stability), and necroes really have no worries with energy.

Then comes eles and sins: the big energy pool is nice, but largely unnecessary, as you can get by just fine with a 20, 30, or 40 energy pool, depending on how fast you're moving (and you move fast when you're in an UB group). Sins have okay armor, and critical strikes can gain you some energy depending on how high leveled the foes you're facing are...but it's nothing spectacular.

Last come dervs, then mesmers and rits. Dervs have 70 armor, but that's about the only benefit they get. Rits and mesmers get absolutely no benefits at all, they're just 60 AL squishies running UB.

Monks obviously don't matter, because they never use UB; they're the ones doing the party healing in the back.

Now...not that this matters terribly much. You're still an overpowered bear as a mesmer. It's just really not the equalizer, casting down the evil cookie cutter builds, that everyone who backs it claims it is. Everyone is equal, but some are more equal than others.