Curse

Longasc · Mar 19, 2008, 04:56 PM // 16:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr_groovy

So the question now is if or when 90% of all these gold websites are removed from the game, what purpose does lootscaling still have?

Wrong assumptions.

First, loot scaling was not introduced solely because of gold seller websites. Inflation in this game can be related to mass farming, which mindless masses of farmers did. Or do over 50% of the players of this game buy gold???

Money buyers are the problem, not gold sellers - and their gold sellers will find their way around this IP block. Nothing changed!

My suggestion is to revamp the game so that special rewards of all kind do not require pure money but personal action, e.g. beating a boss, doing a quest chain or things like that.

Farming should not be required or pay off at all. People should actively do more things than smashing the same farm mob over and over.

joe3273 · Mar 19, 2008, 04:56 PM // 16:56

/signed
A thousand times.
I suck at farming but when I do attempt it, to get something I want, I would love better drops for myself...

Would be nice to see it gone....

O Nuxtofulakas · Mar 19, 2008, 04:56 PM // 16:56

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inflation

"Inflation is a rise in the general level of prices over time. It may also refer to a rise in the prices of a specific set of goods or services. In either case, it is measured as the percentage rate of change of a price index.

Mainstream economists believe that high rates of inflation are caused by high rates of growth of the money supply."

yeah!!! let's be the first worldwide supporting inflation

Also, those who think that when LS is removed they will have the money to buy high end items they forget that prices of high end items will increase too

In conclusion, if you cannot buy something now, LS removal won't make it easier for you - unless you become a 24/7 "human bot"...but we don't want human bots...right? right? right?

ValaOfTheFens · Mar 19, 2008, 04:59 PM // 16:59

/signed

When lootscaling was introduced it was somewhat helpful because the economy was different than it is now and everything was much more expensive. But now that I've beaten all 4 games and am doing dungeons, vanquishing, and title hunting its rather stifling. I have to spend hours and hours to get the money for high end items and would rather be able to spend less time grinding and more time playing. I got spec'ed for 55 just after the change and 55 farming has been really very disappointing, even in HM. Clearing an area and getting 30 whites and a few salvages is really discouraging and demoralizing to people new to farming. Even though I don't condone buying gold I can understand now why people do it.

bhavv · Mar 19, 2008, 05:01 PM // 17:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by joe3273

I suck at farming

Same here actually. I tried some UW runs yesterday. My first one I failed. My second one I killed all of the smites and got one ecto and maybe just 5 white items. My next three I failed

At least before loot scaling, you could make 1.5-2k per UW run just from merching off your white drops, which at least pays for your next run.

Now you get like 300-500 gold per run from your drops if you get lucky.

And we need 75 ecto for Chaos Gloves / FAIL FAIL FAIL!!!

pablo24 · Mar 19, 2008, 05:03 PM // 17:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by O Nuxtofulakas

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inflation

"Inflation is a rise in the general level of prices over time. It may also refer to a rise in the prices of a specific set of goods or services. In either case, it is measured as the percentage rate of change of a price index.

Mainstream economists believe that high rates of inflation are caused by high rates of growth of the money supply."

yeah!!! let's be the first worldwide supporting inflation

Rare items will still have the same chance of dropping as they did before and it will be easyier for everyone to get gold to buy skills. How is that inflation...? If it gets easyier to get gold anyways.

Bryant Again · Mar 19, 2008, 05:05 PM // 17:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkWasp

As much as I LOVE the idea, I really don't think it makes sense to make things harder for Gold Sellers then make them easier again.

The leading belief here is that if ANet were able to ban IPs before, that we wouldn't have any need of loot scaling.

Part of the problem with loot scaling is the remainder of set-priced items. Otherwise I'd be less in favor of it (although most of the items in the "economy" all center around vanity.)

Dawgboy · Mar 19, 2008, 05:07 PM // 17:07

Yes, please.
I was never much into farming, but I did enjoy the challenge(and reward) of beating quests/missions with as few supporters as possible.
Plus, it IS fun as hell wiping out 12 cave trolls single-handed and collecting a pile of stuff.

/signed /signed /signed!

Dronte · Mar 19, 2008, 05:08 PM // 17:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhavv

Same here actually. I tried some UW runs yesterday. My first one I failed. My second one I killed all of the smites and got one ecto and maybe just 5 white items. My next three I failed

At least before loot scaling, you could make 1.5-2k per UW run just from merching off your white drops, which at least pays for your next run.

Now you get like 300-500 gold per run from your drops if you get lucky.

And we need 75 ecto for Chaos Gloves / FAIL FAIL FAIL!!!

No, you fail.
1. farming wasnt hard at all, ever, especially UW.. there are several fast and easy builds to use
2. farming isnt the only way to get money, come on people, realize this!

Arv X · Mar 19, 2008, 05:09 PM // 17:09

/notsigned

seriously, you guys complain about how you cant get money, really? With fow chest update I can make 15-20k in FoW HM run consistently. If you want something good in this game you have to work for it, you cant just sit there and blow money on 5-10k items and such, you have to SAVE UP.

that said, if lootscaling were removed ursan would have to go too, because at 1hr per FoW run everyone would have so much money that everything would be pay in ectos only plz, and soon enough, pay in armbraces only plz because 100k would be as good as an ecto today...

Jade · Mar 19, 2008, 05:09 PM // 17:09

The greedy side of me says "/signed", 'cuz honestly, who doesn't like lots of drops just for themselves? I used to love going out and kicking the crap outta things and seeing a buncha golds drop.

The practical side of me says "/notsigned" though. Reson behind it is, the people that run these companies can easily afford a static ip. Now as I understand it (again, I'm no expert) if you have a static ip, your ip addy changes every time you access the internet. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, which I prolly am.

Fril Estelin · Mar 19, 2008, 05:10 PM // 17:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Longasc

which mindless masses of farmers did.

As a company, Anet cannot seriously ban farming.

Quote:

Money buyers are the problem, not gold sellers - and their gold sellers will find their way around this IP block. Nothing changed!

Yes buyers are the problem, but you cannot do anything serious against them without possibly grave consequences (you'd have to be in the shoes of someone whose salary depend on it to understand, or broaden your perspective IMHO). RMT companies may well find ways to bypass the new measures but the point is to make their business no longer profitable. Once you understand that, you understand why this may work, it's a cost/benefit analysis and you only need to tip the balance in the right direction (we, players, should continue reporting bots!).

Quote:

Farming should not be required or pay off at all. People should actively do more things than smashing the same farm mob over and over.

I'm no big fan of farming, but in the name of freedom, how can we say it's bad? Agree with the last part with one significant modification: it's the repetition of smashing which is farming, because you, as me, do a lot of monster smashing when we play!

the_jos · Mar 19, 2008, 05:10 PM // 17:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeniM

When they crippled our income they should of lowered those items prices.
The only way to make enough to survive is either power trade or farm 24/7, enter the hardcore players and bots
Thats why people buy gold, because they can't make enough through a few hours a week to ever finish an expencive title.

You are talking about a small population of the GW community, the ones who did solofarming to earn a good living.
I remember the days before lootscaling and most prices at the traders were a lot higher than they were now.
Green items would go for prices of 50K and up because everyone could farm that in a couple of hours. I still remember canthan greens being 100K+ while exact Tyrian counterparts were around 10.
That kind of difference can only be explained by the buying power of the players.

Furtermore, I still recall this very well, the moment you got on forums like gwg and 'complain' about high prices on items you would get the 'go farm' comment.
Well, I think one should not be playing a corpg and find out the only way you can obtain an 'accessible' item is by playing solo.
I am not talking about the old gold weapons but about items like the canthan greens. With solofarming they were accessible but not by regular gameplay.

The way to survive is to have a goal and save some gold for it.
Sure, it won't get you all the way but why would a casual player want a full HoM in a couple of months. You have about 2 years to play GW1 and if that's enough, face it, it won't happen. The moment you are talking about 15k/FoW on several characters all with maxed titles you are not that casual player anymore.
If you only play that few hours/day you will never get maxed Hero or Luxon/Kurzick supporter. And many other titles. It won't kill you.
Making the true expensive/time consuming titles account based would have my support though.

If you can't survive with LS could you please explain how I was able to buy a new GH (got Sigil from guildie, rest on me) for a guild I founded a couple of days ago.
I do think I'm not the casual player, though I'm not in a farming guild or something. Most of my activity is playing HM with people and chatting.
I don't trade ingame and merch most of my stuff or give it away.
If that time was devoted to soloplaying in the current situation, with lootscaling, I'd have at least 4 times more gold that I had.

Sure, the GH is several months of saving I can't spend on other stuff. I could not care less, this was an action I felt was the best and I payed the price.
No quick Drunk, no Sweet, no Treasure, no Wisdom.

It's about choices you make, not about lootscaling.
If you think it's about income and not your spending habits, you are wrong.
If you are on a $1000 net income and you spend $900 on stuff you need for a living you can save/spend $100 a month.
You can't afford something that will cost more than that $100 without saving or cutting back other expenses.
And believe me, you can cut a lot of expenses in GW without making your living completely miserable.

If you can't live with this, please continue to ask for a $1000 raise.
But don't be surpriced if your spendings rise to $1600-$1800. People burn the cash they get in their hands.

And remember, that $1000 raise does not mean you can afford that Aston Martin. Translated to GW: still no expensive title for you.

People don't buy gold because they can't survive.
They buy it because they don't understand that you can't afford something expensive when your spending power is too low.
It's pure greed and will always exist.

pablo24 · Mar 19, 2008, 05:12 PM // 17:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jade

The greedy side of me says "/signed", 'cuz honestly, who doesn't like lots of drops just for themselves? I used to love going out and kicking the crap outta things and seeing a buncha golds drop.

The practical side of me says "/notsigned" though. Reson behind it is, the people that run these companies can easily afford a static ip. Now as I understand it (again, I'm no expert) if you have a static ip, your ip addy changes every time you access the internet. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, which I prolly am.

Other way around...

Fril Estelin · Mar 19, 2008, 05:12 PM // 17:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jade

The practical side of me says "/notsigned" though. Reson behind it is, the people that run these companies can easily afford a static ip. Now as I understand it (again, I'm no expert) if you have a static ip, your ip addy changes every time you access the internet. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, which I prolly am.

Sorry you are (Wrong). Static IP=always the same IP address, all the time.

Dynamic IP on the other hand is what you have (most of the time) when you're connected from an ISP, they assign dynamically an IP address each time you connect to them (i.e. when your modem is switched on).

RMT companies do not use this, but if their employees connect from the same internet cafe computers, it's almost the same. So they'll have to switch computers, which will be banned, until they run out of computers. And BAM! We win

mr_groovy · Mar 19, 2008, 05:13 PM // 17:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by O Nuxtofulakas

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inflation
Also, those who think that when LS is removed they will have the money to buy high end items they forget that prices of high end items will increase too

In conclusion, if you cannot buy something now, LS removal won't make it easier for you - unless you become a 24/7 "human bot"...but we don't want human bots...right? right? right?

15K armor, 1k armor, skill points, Consumables these all have a fixed price. So they will be easier attainable. Eotn armor pieces wich use collectable drops will be more attainable too.

I'm reading a lot of farming is mindless, there are other means of getting money and such kind of things. Without LS the drop rate of items trough normal play increases too. Remember loot scaling also effects instant death to multiple foes. If you solo and kill a lot at the same time, or if you are in a group of 8 people and kill a lot in the same time, the outcome is still poor.

O Nuxtofulakas · Mar 19, 2008, 05:15 PM // 17:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by pablo24

Rare items will still have the same chance of dropping as they did before and it will be easyier for everyone to get gold to buy skills. How is that inflation...? If it gets easyier to get gold anyways.

inflation jumps in when you have to pay to get the rare you want.
Drop rate of course is not affected but prices of course will go up up up

and since we want to be honest in the community we all know that the issue here is not the 1k cost of the skills or the 15k armors

Bryant Again · Mar 19, 2008, 05:19 PM // 17:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by O Nuxtofulakas

and since we want to be honest in the community we all know that the issue here is not the 1k cost of the skills or the 15k armors

? For me the issue is dyes, armors, runes, and insignias, which are all set. But I can't speak for everyone, and neither can you.

O Nuxtofulakas · Mar 19, 2008, 05:25 PM // 17:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bryant Again

? For me the issue is dyes, armors, runes, and insignias, which are all set. But I can't speak for everyone, and neither can you.

yes definitely i can't speak for everyone...

but if this is the issue (price of dyes, skills, runes, insignias, consumables etc) why you don't ask to decrease the price of these items - and ask for a change that affects everything on the game...it would be more logical...

you don't have to answer cause i know the answer

bhavv · Mar 19, 2008, 05:26 PM // 17:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bryant Again

? For me the issue is dyes, armors, runes, and insignias, which are all set. But I can't speak for everyone, and neither can you.

Same for me actually, saving up for armors and dyes is a lot more difficult now then it ever was.

I actually havnt had a 6 figure number in my Storage since loot scaling was introduced, and I always find myself spending more then I can make.

Quote:

Originally Posted by O Nuxtofulakas

yes definitely i can't speak for everyone...

but if this is the issue (price of dyes, skills, runes, insignias, consumables etc) why you don't ask to decrease the price of these items - and ask for a change that affects everything on the game...it would be more logical...

you don't have to answer cause i know the answer

Because Anet doesnt actually listen anymore, and even if they decide its a good Idea to reduce prices, it would take them two years to put it into the game.