Curse

Ctb · Apr 17, 2008, 02:28 PM // 14:28

Quote:

fail and assume less plz

Quote:

Ir have 3k hours over 35 months.

Why? I was right. You've spent over 10% of your time for the last three years in Guild Wars. That's the equivalent of a part time job for an awful lot of people. On one video game. That you paid for twice.

And just because other people have even less useful things to do with their spare time doesn't mean you aren't playing the game an awful lot. Aspiring to be not the worst isn't really a great argument to make (unless you're a politician).

It's your time, I don't really care what you do with it. The point is you're probably a minority of Guild Wars players for not only having two accounts, but two accounts that you're maxing out titles on. Most of the people I know in game haven't maxed a single title yet on ANY character. As a minority, you don't get to dictate how things work. Just because 1 out 1000 people might get misidentified as a bot doesn't mean a whole lot when 1 out of 10 (these statistics are totally researched and absolutely rock solid and not at all coming out of my rear end, I swear to god...) are getting bot-spammed.

Quote:

They are a terrible company when it comes to player support.

No, they're a typical company when it comes to player support. Unfortunately, this is the standard. And compared to most other industries, this is pretty good treatment, too.

It's what happens when people demand that their products be as cheap as possible. You can either pay more and have some added benefits or you can pay less and only get a very basic package. Video games are expensive to develop, and they're priced to be fairly cheap compared to most other entertainment. Unfortunately, this is the end result.

Quote:

Waiting for Lyra Song, CTB and Dawnmist to declare that this treatment of paying customers is completly justified and A-Ok.

Well, since they're a successful company, it must be. If it weren't, intelligent consumers wouldn't buy their products and they'd go out of business.

You get what you pay for. If you don't like the way a company treats you, don't give them your money. It's not ANET's fault most consumers are too clueless to understand such a simple concept.

And it's not abnormal either. If people actually made intelligent and rational decisions as consumers, companies like Best Buy, Wal Mart, EA Games, etc. wouldn't even exist.

But people don't make intelligent choices as consumers, so this is what everyone, including those few people who do actually try to make smart buying decisions, wind up getting.

Maniac Monty · Apr 17, 2008, 06:48 PM // 18:48

LOL, this thread has made me laugh quite a bit! Guild wars is a great game, Anet are like gods to me, without them guild wars wouldn't be what it is (my opinion) for months people probably complained about the fact that so many bots and RMT's were taking all the gold so to speak and people wanted a system to tackle this problem! so with some time and probably a fair bit of the companies money (resources and what not) they eventually came up with the system that so many people wanted! there are alot of good replies i've read on this thread, but, now we have the system that we wanted, which does work (hardly any bots around now)! people are now complaining about it! true some instances will be innocent people getting banned but the system is just doing its job! what it was programmed to do! if it notices anything suspicious (i.e. large amounts of valuable items or gold being traded alone, nothing coming from the other person) then it's going to detect the situation as suspicious as some ppl have already stated! I hope this makes sense to people, I'm not usually good at explaining things :P but there you have it! My opinion on this matter!

Peace out! Monty for President

Kashrlyyk · Apr 17, 2008, 08:30 PM // 20:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by lyra_song

Thats troll and flame fodder. And you deserve a kick in the head for it.

I have read so many posts of yours, where you defend ANet. It is basically what you always do! You always defend ANet!

A kick in the head?? Didn´t know you are so weak!

Quote:

Originally Posted by lyra_song

There is no justification for poor customer service.

And the justification for banning innocents, even though all the "evidence" are in the hands of ANet, is?? Ah, right: Not able to hire enough people.

BTW banning innocents is bad customer service! But you justified that, didn´t you?

Quote:

Originally Posted by lyra_song

Rahja clearly made a distinction between ANET and NCsoft's support.

If your car doesn´t run anymore, would you care that it was the eletronic company, that is to be blamed? Would you complain to them or would you complain to the car manufacturer, expecting them to send it to the right department??

For me ANet/NCsoft is a blackbox. The inner workings are not of interest for me. I don´t care what department is responsible and I shouldn´t have to.
They are one company: Anything bad, that they do, falls on both partners.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lyra_song

You notice he mentioned Gaile (WHO IS FROM ANET....NOT NCSOFT) to look into it. Notice Gaile's new job position as "Support Liason"...hmmn

A nice service for how many of the banned players? Remember the majority doesn´t visit a forum and nobody tells the new players that they can appeal. So "something special" for the forum veterans.

There is a new message on the login screen now. It tells people about RMT. Notice that not a single word is said about appealing!!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by strcpy

...Even in real life there are times where there is no reason why the authorities should initially know you are in the right without you telling them something. In those cases they also remove your rights until you talk to a position of authority (police or in harder cases the courts).

That doesn´t work here, because unlike the real world ANet has all the evidence. They are just to lazy to look at them. Instead they put you in jail, not telling you that you have the right to call a lawyer and stopping any investigations to determine if you really did something bad, while keeping you in jail for the rest of your life. And there is no judge to question that behaviour and to ask for the "evidence" they have. Even if the evidence say, you are innocent, without you starting the investigation, you are kept in prison, unlike real world.

Chthon · Apr 17, 2008, 10:35 PM // 22:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief

Indeed, I was banned and they removed all 312k that I have been saving for an emerald blade over the last 2 months. I emailed gaile regarding this issue, and she is looking into it for me.

PlayNC support was:

A). Untimely (took them over 70 hours to even get back with me)
B). Rude (I was treated like a number, and I was guilty in their eyes no matter what I did)
C). Unwilling to even give my the benefit of the doubt.
D). Unwilling to even look at the evidence I provided against their claims (I screenshotted my Checking account activity and both of my credit card activity pages back to April 8th, clearly showing no gold purchased).

I was horrified by PlayNC's rudeness and total unwillingness to cooperate. They are a terrible company when it comes to player support. I wish ANET had the means to make their support totally internal instead of relying on those jerks at PlayNC. As far as I am concerned, PlayNC can take a long walk off a very short pier.

And that's why "ban first and let support deal with the innocent people later" is a very bad idea.

---

@dawnmist: I strongly suspect that most of those bans were not 1-investigation-to-1-ban, piecemeal bans, but rather the results of identifying the entire operation of particular RMT companies, so a-net got multiple accounts per investigation.

maraxusofk · Apr 17, 2008, 11:53 PM // 23:53

ok ctb. ur last argument was a perfectly coherent and civil statement, so therefore i respect your opinion and will respond in kind.

i may be in the minority of guild wars players overall, but this random banning does not only concern the minority of guild wars players. according to the other posts in this thread, people have been banned for merely giving money away. im pretty sure most people have given items of at least some worth to their friends in game (because the only gifts worth giving are those that are worth something). if this is true, that means there are potentially much more people banned by an automated service that not many know how to deal with. most guild wars players ARE casual players, so most will not visit forums such as these. since casual players make up the majority of the game, anet COULD possibly be tarnishing their reputation with many players who are banned for giving/trading gold with friends/own account. anet is responsible in that they are the ones who wrote the detection program in the game, and they should be the ones to fix or rewrite their own coding.

lyra_song · Apr 18, 2008, 12:30 AM // 00:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kashrlyyk

I have read so many posts of yours, where you defend ANet. It is basically what you always do! You always defend ANet!

I'm not really defending Anet.

I'm just dislike posts with any lack of logic or common sense.

So if it seems like im defending Anet, I'm really not. I'm just refuting stupidity.

Thats why ive posted against Anet many times, for their stupid decisions and changes.

Quote:

A kick in the head?? Didn´t know you are so weak!

I've studied martial arts since i was in middle school including Muay Thai, Eskrima (I love my knives), Kenpo and am currently studying Capoeira. I've knocked out 2 people (both males over 160 lbs each...and significantly taller than me) COLD with right roundhouse. People in my class know to stay away from my right side, even then i love faking roundhouses and then going into a reverse hook kick. I dance and I snowboard, so my legs are very strong.

Trust me, You don't want a kick in the head from me.

Quote:

And the justification for banning innocents, even though all the "evidence" are in the hands of ANet, is?? Ah, right: Not able to hire enough people.

No amount of people will be able to watch EVERY ACCOUNT, EVERY CONVERSATION LOG, EVERY TRADE, EVERY IP and EVERY CLIENT.

Thats why you automate things.

You clearly have no idea how this works, so I'll stop talking over your head.

Quote:

BTW banning innocents is bad customer service! But you justified that, didn´t you?

A false positive ban is not bad customer service.
NOT removing a false positive ban is bad customer service.

A UPC scanner in the supermarket is the fastest way to check items.
But a UPC scanner is NOT perfect.
It will only work if the UPC code matches up to the item.
Computers have glitches, stickers get misplaced, etc.
If a scanner scans a UPC code but registers the wrong item, it is a mistake.

Mistakes are NORMAL.

Now, GOOD customer service would be the manager coming to correct it, canceling it out and rescanning the UPC.
Bad customer service would be the manager NOT correcting it.

Sorry if im still talking over your head. I can't help it. I like to explain things.

Quote:

If your car doesn´t run anymore, would you care that it was the eletronic company, that is to be blamed? Would you complain to them or would you complain to the car manufacturer, expecting them to send it to the right department??

Yes, id want to know exactly what was wrong with my car, since I like knowing stuff.

Wether its a manufacturing defect, or simple wear and tear.

I don't like being ignorant and simply screaming "FIX IT FIX IT FIX IT FIX IT" and blaming random people.

Quote:

For me ANet/NCsoft is a blackbox. The inner workings are not of interest for me. I don´t care what department is responsible and I shouldn´t have to.
They are one company: Anything bad, that they do, falls on both partners.

You just want to complain.You want everything perfect.
Any mistakes is instantly someone's fault and someone must be blamed.
Any mistakes mean the system isn't working as its supposed to.

False positives are INEVITABLE.
There is NO OTHER SYSTEM that is even remotely plausible to handle the amount of traffic on the servers.

The customer is NOT always right.
Uninformed, ignorant customers that abuse the employees are WORTH losing.

Quote:

A nice service for how many of the banned players? Remember the majority doesn´t visit a forum and nobody tells the new players that they can appeal. So "something special" for the forum veterans.

There is a new message on the login screen now. It tells people about RMT. Notice that not a single word is said about appealing!!!

As I've said in another post, the automated message is harsh and doesn't mention appealing.

If you are truly innocent, and not willing to fight for it, and do everything you can, including going on guild wars fansites to get more information, you get no sympathy from me.

Quote:

That doesn´t work here, because unlike the real world ANet has all the evidence. They are just to lazy to look at them. Instead they put you in jail, not telling you that you have the right to call a lawyer and stopping any investigations to determine if you really did something bad, while keeping you in jail for the rest of your life. And there is no judge to question that behaviour and to ask for the "evidence" they have. Even if the evidence say, you are innocent, without you starting the investigation, you are kept in prison, unlike real world.

If Anet wanted to actually ban you for no reason.
Thats their right to.
You agreed to it when you signed up the game.