Curse

upier · Mar 15, 2008, 07:49 AM // 07:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brianna

The Realm of Torment was hard for me as well at first, I hated nightfall for that soul reason.

Now? It's easy for me, I can steamroll the whole place and most likely handle it similar on hard mode.

It's all about finding what skills, team builds, and the likes that are most effective against the tormented monsters, there's plenty of things.

Same thing here.
I was actually stuck on the quest where you need to escort that chick (to reduce the spoilers) though the place that has reduced movement and activation speed for a few days or was it even weeks.
These days - Nightfall is the first campaign I take my wanna-be survivors though. And they make it though alive.
BUT I actually feel that Nightfall taught me something. Compared to GWEN where I just abused everything that I could and now I have no desire whatsoever to go back there!

Now for the tips:
1. I don't know if you are running any protection on - but it's VERY nice! Many guys (eles or necros mostly - that is if you don't want to invest into a monky hero) - can live perfectly fine with going monk secondary and raising protection up to 9 for the break point in [skill]Aegis[/skill]. Also [skill]Protective Spirit[/skill] is a must for those places. It's the result of bad PvE and that's one of the things that is keeping it in check.
2. Heavy physical teams are REALLY good! Running paragons and warriors just works! Add some monks and a necro - bloody one for stuff like [skill]dark Fury[/skill] and [skill]Order Of Pain[/skill] or (and) cursing one for [skill]Barbs[/skill] and [skill]Mark Of Pain[/skill] (you can run all those skills on one necro of course!). (Possibly even add the protection monky spells - they have the energy to spam it!)
Those guys not only do very nice damage - they also have very nice armour - which cause less strain on the monkies and so they can focus on less people.
Ohh and that means you need to build your team build around those guys! That means you need to have hex removal and condition removal (because there is NOTHING worse then a bunch of warrior that are all blinded or "blurred") and stance removal!
3. Take a moment before engaging a foe. Check out their patrols - and maybe you can actually sneak by!
4. Having tons of HP is good! Since the heros don't understand how to pre-protect - you need to be able to live though the first spike. And sometimes - that means getting hit for some 400 damage (bloody water eles ....) and living to tell the tale. My first time visiting there - one sup rune and one major one (or maybe it was two sup ones ...) and radiant insignias all the way. I pretty much had DP the moment I stepped out of an outpost.
5. Ohh and if you are stuck on the "wonderful" quest (the one listed above) - for the love of everything that is pink - go though the Shiroken and NOT go south. Going south is evil in that place!
EVIL EVIL EVIL!

Arkantos · Mar 15, 2008, 07:50 AM // 07:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Viruzzz

Shiro is weak at full health, until he uses impossible odds. just kill the lich first, you can almost ignore shiro till he gets low HP

Yes, he's weak at full health, but along with the lich he can get quite annoying.

Aggro both, shutdown shiro with anti-melee, kill lich. Run back, lose aggro, regain health/energy. Prot melee, get melee to pull and hold aggro, keep casters back. Running a warrior with dslash + brawling headbutt + steelfang slash is going to keep him knocked down indefinitely, making him quite useless.

Arduin · Mar 15, 2008, 08:07 AM // 08:07

Try not to take too many quests at the same time. Some quests you can get at the start, like this one and this one will cause a lot of creatures to spawn, making that particular harder then it should be. Try getting familiar with the area first, run to some outposts, and only then try to do those quests.

Good luck

Operative 14 · Mar 15, 2008, 08:21 AM // 08:21

The Realm of Torment seemed impossibly hard for me when I first went through there. Then again, so did the Fire Islands, later parts of Factions, and GW:EN. It all comes down to experience. I find those areas annoyingly hard, but I don't find them game breakingly hard anymore. Just give it time, learn what you're doing wrong, accentuate what you're doing right, and the RoT won't seem so hard anymore.

Lord Sojar · Mar 15, 2008, 08:25 AM // 08:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

Also [skill]Protective Spirit[/skill] is a must for those places. It's the result of bad PvE and that's one of the things that is keeping it in check.

Protective Spirit is one the skills that breaks Guild Wars entirely. But without it, the game would be /fail. Other skills that fall into this catagory are...

[skill]Diversion[/skill]
[skill]Reversal of Fortune[/skill]
[skill]Frenzy[/skill]
[skill]Eviscerate[/skill]
[skill]Shock[/skill]
[skill]Gale[/skill]

Blackhearted · Mar 15, 2008, 08:29 AM // 08:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ju-On

So after having my rant, GAME DESIGNERS have some pitty on us casual gamers and TONE down normal mode just a smige plz! Otherwise its uninstall time and off to play something that is FUN for casual gamers!

Tone down normal mode? lawl. Normal mode is already so easy that i can not even pay full attention half the time with my hero/hench group and still easily win(even when monking). If it got any easier i could literally play in my sleep. perhaps you should practice and work out some better builds.

Master Knightfall · Mar 15, 2008, 08:32 AM // 08:32

It's not so much that normal is HARD, it's that most people don't want to think about changing their builds and welp even in normal mode you HAVE to change your builds from time to time to meet the situations. One set of builds is not going to work 100% of the time at 100% efficiency. So, OP start learning your opponents, write down the skills they use and then create parties to counter them. It's as simple as that really.

Two skills that I have or my heroes have in some order are "Maelstrom" and "Shadow of Fear" I never travel without someone or two having one or both of those skills. Other skills to consider always bringing are "enchantment removers" at least one, and "rend enchantments" is probably one of the single best to use since it wipes ALL of them off. Even Maelstrom without ANY points into water gives you 10 seconds of disruption...that's more than worth the cost of the skill alone as you can do a lot of damage to npc mobs in 10 seconds especially those that can't cast. Spinal Shivers and a cold weapon can shutdown anyone an anything for as long as shivers lasts. For a caster a cold spear is best since it's faster than wanding or staffing. I shutdown rain of terrors with maelstrom or shivers and then fireballed the hell out of them and am relentless attacking them above all others except a healer type around them. I carry both fire and cold weapons with me. So, I can heat up Mark of Rodgort, switch to a cold weapon and shut down any casters after my necro has cast shivers on them. Mark of Rodgort is very useful since most all monks carry a fire weapon and thus keep the fires burning constantly.

Considering skills that will work almost anywhere is my top priority and then adding skills for specific areas and specific mobs afterwards. Synergizing yourself with your heroes works wonders when you can spike some mob(s) in a matter of seconds with some powerful damage. Jest like them rain of terrors do you. <grin>

upier · Mar 15, 2008, 09:10 AM // 09:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief

Protective Spirit is one the skills that breaks Guild Wars entirely. But without it, the game would be /fail.

That's highly questionable.
It would be an entirely different game without it - and in the case of PvE - I am not so sure that would be bad. Because frankly - I can not imagine what is worse then this or Molotovs greeting (aka one-shot-kills).

garethporlest18 · Mar 15, 2008, 09:44 AM // 09:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ju-On

Dervish:
1. Ermite Attack 2.Mystic Sweep 3. AoB 4. Vatal Boon 5. Mystic Regen 6. Lightbringer Gaze 7. Balth Rage 8. Eternal Aura

I would change a few of your skills here. Put in Victorious Sweep for Vital Boon. Radiant Scythe for Balth Rage. Elite wise AoB is okay but I'd use Avatar of Lyssa or Wounding Strike.

As a melee, you don't need to focus on healing yourself or defense. Let your monks do that.

Master Knightfall · Mar 15, 2008, 09:49 AM // 09:49

I disagree since I think everyone should bring some form of self heal to take the pressure OFF of the monks. Monks are there as support, not as your sugar daddy/mama for heals.

Avarre · Mar 15, 2008, 09:52 AM // 09:52

I found RoT pretty easy... you just go through it and kill everything. The only tricky parts were some of the Master Quests from the Gate.

If you're failing, it's because you're not playing well, not because the game is too hard. Guild Wars is (supposedly) skill based, so if you don't develop as a player, you'll run into a wall.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master Knightfall

I disagree since I think everyone should bring some form of self heal to take the pressure OFF of the monks. Monks are there as support, not as your sugar daddy/mama for heals.

Actually, that's their entire purpose. To keep people alive through prot and healing. If someone is being killed, the worst thing they can do is stand around to use selfheals. They should be kiting and mitigating damage as much as possible while the monks prot/heal them.

Master Knightfall · Mar 15, 2008, 09:54 AM // 09:54

I think it has a lot to do with flag placements. If you're just running up the middle all the time you're sure to get setback every once inawhile. I just wish we had flags for ALL the henchies instead of 4 of them bunching up all the time. It would also be kewl if we could setup HOTKEY formations for the heroes/henchies to bo into like a circle or a square or a wedge or a general scatter feature. Like the Total War series has. <grin>

upier · Mar 15, 2008, 09:55 AM // 09:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master Knightfall

I disagree since I think everyone should bring some form of self heal to take the pressure OFF of the monks. Monks are there as support, not as your sugar daddy/mama for heals.

In which case - the monks should take some offence too.
I mean why waste 2 slots on characters that are designed to keep the players alive IF the players then need to take care of themselves?

Edit:
Curse you Avarre and your maxed FC!

Edit 2:
Wait that didn't make sense!
Edited my edit. :S

arcanemacabre · Mar 15, 2008, 09:55 AM // 09:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master Knightfall

I disagree since I think everyone should bring some form of self heal to take the pressure OFF of the monks. Monks are there as support, not as your sugar daddy/mama for heals.

No, the monks are there because they are part of the team - the part that heals/protects. If you are the part that deals damage, you should have everything on your bar that helps you do only that. Personal heal is a waste of a slot.

EDIT: Damn this slow internetz... beaten by two different posts... argh.

Master Knightfall · Mar 15, 2008, 10:05 AM // 10:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

In which case - the monks should take some offence too.
I mean why waste 2 slots on characters that are designed to keep the players alive IF the players then need to take care of themselves?

Edit:
I wish I had typing was a spell or a signet ...
Curse you Avarre and your maxed FC!

What if the monk dies? Then what are you going to do? Next arguement comes everyone should bring a rez of some sort. <grin> It's all about how one wants to organize their team. You can put all the pressure on the monks and if the monks die then it's all their fault. I prefer everyone to have a self heal in case of emergencies since they do happen yah know. <grin> Rezes too.

See you people that depend totally on monks have no plan B. You're all about dps powergamer and forget "strategy & tactics". I always have someone bring rebirth an is the dedicated run away and rez us if things go bad player. In PVE only areas it's not so important, but, when you get to MISSIONS where it's a win or lose all situation it's important to have backup and plan B's. Just ask any military afficionardo and they will tell you they always orgainze for backup and plan B's.<grin>

Lykan · Mar 15, 2008, 10:10 AM // 10:10

Wants to see heroes skill bars

my2cent · Mar 15, 2008, 10:10 AM // 10:10

Yea rot is veyr difficult for a newer player, i remember i got stuck in GOM for a whole week because i was a dervish.

If ur having difficulties takin down the torment monsters, try using the SAB necro triad build im sure it will hold our ur party long rnuff to wipe them all out.

Zahr Dalsk · Mar 15, 2008, 10:21 AM // 10:21

Normal Mode only felt hard when I sucked at Gw, aka when I was new.

Now it's just a lolfest. With some classes so is Hard Mode.

Play the game, practice, learn what works and what doesn't; and please, play some PvP, it's a great learning process for the game to prepare you for PvE.

Guildmaster Cain · Mar 15, 2008, 10:29 AM // 10:29

Due to 'Call of Torment' skill, which activates when they have <50% health (or 25?), it is generally better to spike singular targets.
If you go for AoE damage from nukers for instance, you will weaken the foes to around 25%, they start scatter around the place and then start using CoT. Presto, 8 more foes to worry about.
Better to spike them 1 by 1, leaving Rangers and Paragons last, since they are the hardest but do least damage. Monks and Elementalists first ofcourse. Then mesmers and necros. Then Warriors and Dervishes.

If you are stuck at the beginning of Realm of Torment, maybe it is because you still have that quest open, which spawns like 6 groups of 8 Torment creatures. I suggest dropping all sidequests which could make stuff harder then neccesary.

last tip: dont ever go to Domain of Anguish if you think RoT is hard

Avarre · Mar 15, 2008, 10:29 AM // 10:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master Knightfall

What if the monk dies? Then what are you going to do? Next arguement comes everyone should bring a rez of some sort. <grin> It's all about how one wants to organize their team. You can put all the pressure on the monks and if the monks die then it's all their fault. I prefer everyone to have a self heal in case of emergencies since they do happen yah know. <grin> Rezes too.

Evidently you don't understand Guild Wars organization. There are three parts in a team - Frontline, Midline, and Backline. The frontline kills things. The Midline provides offensive support to the frontline and defensive support to the Backline, while the Backline prot/heals. The offense of the other areas removes pressure on the backline by killing/disrupting things, while the defense of the Midline (blinds, snares, partywide support like aegis/wards) help hold the Backline in place.

All three lines are held up in their roles by support from the others and passively reduce as much damage as possible through mitigation (disruption, prot, positioning, and mobility, among other things). Spread-out damage is cleaned up by party healing (which completely overlaps the role of selfheals).

Resses will most likely be present in the midline since you want the Backline at full functioning capacity and stopping to Res from the middle of the enemy team (Frontline) is highly vulnerable to disruption. Everyone bringing a res is a huge waste unless you plan on everyone dying, in which case you have bigger problems than ressing.

Quote:

See you people that depend totally on monks have no plan B. You're all about dps powergamer and forget "strategy & tactics". I always have someone bring rebirth an is the dedicated run away and rez us if things go bad player. In PVE only areas it's not so important, but, when you get to MISSIONS where it's a win or lose all situation it's important to have backup and plan B's. Just ask any military afficionardo and they will tell you they always orgainze for backup and plan B's.<grin>

Having everyone die while you run to rebirth is not tactics. Correlating no other self heals with all pressure on monks is not tactics. Relying on straight healing in a full group to counter heavy damage and remove presure is not tactics (if anything, that's what a 'dps powergamer' would do).