Curse

Jenn · Jul 13, 2008, 08:53 AM // 08:53

Ethics and etiquette can be particularly argumentative topics, so you are being warned now. Respect your fellow posters and be constructive, or I'll send wild turkeys after you.

Guru has seen a few threads on problems like scamming, duping, etc., so I'd like to try and bring those problems all under one umbrella: the issue of ethics and etiquette in gaming.

I know you have all seen a massive range of playstyles and how players treat each other. I personally feel like there is usually a correlation between RL personality (even on the subconscious level) and in-game personality. I think that people who act like 12 year old twats in game probably are griefers in RL, too. I also think people who take their time to selflessly help others are the type of people that would do that for someone in RL.

As for ethics and etiquette - I have a few questions/scenarios to give you a visual of what I'm getting at. You don't need to fit it out - it isn't a questionnaire... just examples of things to consider.

Ethics:
- Is there a time and place to knowingly scam the unknowing or unprepared?
- Is there a difference between taking advantage of someone's ignorance and scamming? (I.e. someone selling an item for significantly less than it's worth).
- Do some players "just have it coming?"
- Do you think people owe it to most other people to show them respect?
- Is belittling others in the "spirit of the game" acceptable or immature?
- Are third-party methods of getting ahead acceptable or fair? (I.e. buying gold, afk-macroing drinking)

Etiquette:
- Do you needlessly and repeatedly spam messages in local chat? (wtb cloth x10 in 3 seconds)
- If someone is doing a CoF (or other) run for tips, are you the type of person to not even say thanks, not tip, and just get your reward? Or sometimes worse, do you add insult to the injury and only tip a meagre 100 gold?
- With little regard for the other people in a party, do you leave missions/quests/etc.? Without saying anything?
- Do you leech in PvP or PvE and just not give a damn?
- Do you say please and thank you? Or GG?
- Is trash talking necessary? Is it generally immature?

I know these are a lot of questions - but these are just topics of discussion that fall under the ethics/etiquette umbrella. The reason I made this thread is because I sometimes feel like people are just unbelievable. I'd have to say that a LOT of the lack of maturity and moral standing comes from the younger players, though (sorry for the stereotype, but it is kinda true...). There are also a large number of people who are old enough that should know better, but are just as undesirable, too. It just baffles me how selfish, arrogant, rude, malicious or snake-like some people are.

So what do we "owe" to the other people in this game? What immature or asshole-ish things grind your nerves that other people do?

pumpkin pie · Jul 13, 2008, 09:06 AM // 09:06

Do you feel responsible to others to uphold ethics and etiquette in game?

^^ does the above means you want to make other players be ethical?

Okay, thanks Illfated Fat, just need to make it clear before I can actually click the poll.
Yes, I've always been ethical in the game (hopefully). Don't see any need to be otherwise.

Ethics:
- Is there a time and place to knowingly scam the unknowing or unprepared?
Never

- Is there a difference between taking advantage of someone's ignorance and scamming? (I.e. someone selling an item for significantly less than it's worth).
Never - both are taking advantage of

- Do some players "just have it coming?"
No- not even when they are being a (insert insult here) becasue then you become them.

- Do you think people owe it to most other people to show them respect?
Owe No, but to yourself, do you want to be label as someone whose rude?

- Is belittling others in the "spirit of the game" acceptable or immature?
unacceptable and immature

- Are third-party methods of getting ahead acceptable or fair? (I.e. buying gold, afk-macroing drinking)
Definitely NOT acceptable and UNFAIR

Etiquette:
- Do you needlessly and repeatedly spam messages in local chat? (wtb cloth x10 in 3 seconds)
never, in fact, I seldom use the chat function. I usually have local, and trade chat off and are most certainly offline forever.

- If someone is doing a CoF (or other) run for tips, are you the type of person to not even say thanks, not tip, and just get your reward? Or sometimes worse, do you add insult to the injury and only tip a meagre 100 gold?

I usually take run that has a set price, less confusing, in the sense that I don't have lots of gold to tip, and I also do not want to under tip or over tip anyone.

- With little regard for the other people in a party, do you leave missions/quests/etc.? Without saying anything?
Never

- Do you leech in PvP or PvE and just not give a damn?
Never

- Do you say please and thank you? Or GG?
Yes, i think, but the occassion to say please and thank you is so rare. I say GG when its really a GG, not just GG after all game. (for instant, when its obvious all the inexperience Luxon/kurziks are out fighting and your side is like the wild fire burning, that is not a GG game, just getting lucky, and if you fight to the death, in a fun civil manner. then definitely

- Is trash talking necessary? Is it generally immature?
No, never done it either. But I do on rare occasions will shout of some fun encouraging war cry in AB :P~

**Marty Silverblade** · Jul 13, 2008, 09:07 AM // 09:07

I think the problem is that because it's not face-to-face, people feel free to be as rude as they want; saying things and acting like thay wouldn't even think about doing in RL.

Anyway, I try to be nice in general, though if someone really pisses me off then I won't hesitate to fire away. Of course, that doesn't happen often. I'll bite back a bit in places full of idiots (RA), but normally I'll just ignore it. I find that smartass answers will sometimes make idiots shut up, sometimes it doesn't. Meh.

Jenn · Jul 13, 2008, 09:13 AM // 09:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by pumpkin pie

Do you feel responsible to others to uphold ethics and etiquette in game?

^^ does the above means you want to make other players be ethical?

No, it means this:

Do you feel like you should act in a "good" way to other people. Is it your duty as an "ethical" human being to do so?

Hope that clears it up.

Artisan Archer · Jul 13, 2008, 09:15 AM // 09:15

Yeah, people say alot more if they know they are never gonna see that person.
You notice that immediately in for example a guild with people who know eachother in real life aswell.

Also, I do try to nice, and I think most people do, it's just that in gaming/chatting things can easily be blown out of proportion. You say something like "..." and people will feel attacked and retaliate, like Marty said: I" try to be nice but if someone pisses me off I won't hesitate to fire away". I think that that, combined with being anonymous and the fact that you are easily misunderstood over chatchannels (people tend to think the worst), makes the internet/online games such a 'happy' place.

(No offense Marty, it was just an example)

Lady Raenef · Jul 13, 2008, 09:15 AM // 09:15

Seriously, the ignorance of people in-game and even on this forum is annoying. People who think they know everything or stand by what they say. When they correct someone, they shove an insult in there to make their ego enlarge. People hate GWG because of the fact that most of you people are assholes to others asking simple questions or suggestions. It's ridiculous. Even I have caught myself doing so.

Here are my honest answers to your questions. Flame me if you want people, it seems to be in your blood.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Illfated Fat

Ethics:
- Is there a time and place to knowingly scam the unknowing or unprepared?
For some, they scam when they feel like it, but for others, no. I've given people appropriate prices, etc. I mean, it may save me one platinum or even ten, but they lose out on the money I gain.

- Is there a difference between taking advantage of someone's ignorance and scamming? (I.e. someone selling an item for significantly less than it's worth).
Not to even to random people. You should lead them in the correct path, or just correct them with the least amount of arrogance as possible.

- Do some players "just have it coming?"
People who are isolated and only insult others get the boomerang effect eventually.

- Do you think people owe it to most other people to show them respect?
Even without religion, I know that being courteous is a key factor to making peace. However, sometimes it's just unavoidable.

- Is belittling others in the "spirit of the game" acceptable or immature?
No.

- Are third-party methods of getting ahead acceptable or fair? (I.e. buying gold, afk-macroing drinking)
I don't think so. It's unfair to people who actually earn money in game, such as myself.

Etiquette:
- Do you needlessly and repeatedly spam messages in local chat? (wtb cloth x10 in 3 seconds)
You have to get a word out sometimes, not in local, but perhaps in trade. When I want answers or things sold, I'd prefer to use the least amount of time as possible.

- If someone is doing a CoF (or other) run for tips, are you the type of person to not even say thanks, not tip, and just get your reward? Or sometimes worse, do you add insult to the injury and only tip a meagre 100 gold?
I always tip. Always. Sometimes, I'll even pay for someone who leaves or refuses to tip simply to get out of paying.

- With little regard for the other people in a party, do you leave missions/quests/etc.? Without saying anything?
With the new Dishonorable hex, it's kind of hard anyway. I have before when we're losing in Alliance Battles. I'd rather not spend another ten minutes to earn 100 Luxon faction.

- Do you leech in PvP or PvE and just not give a damn?
Can't say I recall ever leeching once.

- Do you say please and thank you? Or GG?
When buying and selling, and when a game was actually fun.

- Is trash talking necessary? Is it generally immature?
Immature, as always, but sometimes you just can't help it. People will always put themselves over others, plain fact. So many people who say they'd take a bullet for someone that isn't their mutual partner is generally a liar.

I know I'm just one player, but I get wrapped up in things as well. Generally, I defend others who are being made fun of, rather than being the one going "Pwned, noob." on the playing field. It's a game, not a way of life. Others view it too seriously (HA players) and makes the game less fun. I haven't even ranked my Hero past rank 2 because the players I have to deal with are like a pack of children. If you screw up once, you amount to the pile of dog crap they've stepped in, and now they're desperately trying to wipe and wash you off with a water hose and the grass of someone else's lawn.

Just my thoughts.

$neekie · Jul 13, 2008, 09:18 AM // 09:18

I start out nice, but have little patients. Although i rarely badmouth, i just try to make the other ragequit

All depends on the other person, mutual respect ect.

mzzls

Squishy ftw · Jul 13, 2008, 10:05 AM // 10:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Illfated Fat

Ethics:
- Is there a time and place to knowingly scam the unknowing or unprepared?
No, never, nowhere.

- Is there a difference between taking advantage of someone's ignorance and scamming? (I.e. someone selling an item for significantly less than it's worth).
When I see something like this I usually whisper the person to tell him that's his price is way too low. I would not take advantage of it.

- Do some players "just have it coming?"
No. I think we were all newbs at one point in the game.

- Do you think people owe it to most other people to show them respect?
Yes I do. I think you should threat people the way you wish others would threat you.
How can you ever recieve respect from someone else when you don't show respect for them in the first place?

- Is belittling others in the "spirit of the game" acceptable or immature?
No, immature.

- Are third-party methods of getting ahead acceptable or fair? (I.e. buying gold, afk-macroing drinking)
Depends of the method.

Etiquette:
- Do you needlessly and repeatedly spam messages in local chat? (wtb cloth x10 in 3 seconds)
No, never.

- If someone is doing a CoF (or other) run for tips, are you the type of person to not even say thanks, not tip, and just get your reward? Or sometimes worse, do you add insult to the injury and only tip a meagre 100 gold?
No. I will always be polite, thank him for his/her run, and pay the usual 2-2.5k.

- With little regard for the other people in a party, do you leave missions/quests/etc.? Without saying anything?
Never. Unless my internet connections says otherwise

- Do you leech in PvP or PvE and just not give a damn?
No.
- Do you say please and thank you? Or GG?
Yup.
- Is trash talking necessary? Is it generally immature?
No, it's mostly immature behaviour.

I value a lot of those things very highly. I'll always try to be kind and helpfull to people, altho I don't always succeed in this.(bad days happen to everyone I guess)

Kumu Honua · Jul 13, 2008, 10:13 AM // 10:13

The problem with anything to do with ethics and etiquette in an online environment is the GIFT. (Greater Internet F-wad Theory).

Normal Person + Anonymity + Audience = Total F-Wad

My answers are as follows:

Ethics:
- Is there a time and place to knowingly scam the unknowing or unprepared?

Never. My moral compass simply wont allow me to do so.

- Is there a difference between taking advantage of someone's ignorance and scamming? (I.e. someone selling an item for significantly less than it's worth).

Scamming would require a scam. Buying something that is being offered cheap is not a scam. It's frugal.

Some people (myself) would rather sell something quickly and get on with playing the game instead of sitting on their ass in a town spamming a for sale message trying to squeeze every last drop of gold they can get. The buyer gets a good deal and can make a profit and I made my money and go on with other things.

- Do some players "just have it coming?"

That's like asking if a rape victim "had it coming". Ridiculous.

- Do you think people owe it to most other people to show them respect?

Respect is earned. Courtesy is a whole other matter. Common decency should be the norm but the GIFT screws that up all the time.

- Is belittling others in the "spirit of the game" acceptable or immature?

Depends on context. If some random person does the smacktalking you will take it in a whole different perspective than if it was a friend or a guildmate who said the same thing.

Text does not carry inflection. This can cause more miscommunication because "You got owned!" typed by a friend carries a much nicer message than "lol u got pwned!" sent by some random stranger.

I would err on the side of civility. Good game.

- Are third-party methods of getting ahead acceptable or fair? (I.e. buying gold, afk-macroing drinking)

Of course not. They are direct violations of the EULA. The "Rules" of the game. It isn't acceptable to hide an ace up your sleeve when playing poker either...

Etiquette:
- Do you needlessly and repeatedly spam messages in local chat? (wtb cloth x10 in 3 seconds)

No. Trade goes in trade chat. That's what it is for. Once every few minutes is enough. I frequently simply use party search and the single chat message that is sent from there.

- If someone is doing a CoF (or other) run for tips, are you the type of person to not even say thanks, not tip, and just get your reward? Or sometimes worse, do you add insult to the injury and only tip a meagre 100 gold?

Tipping is a loaded question. I will simply say that since I am in a profession that lives on the tips they receive, I tip well.

- With little regard for the other people in a party, do you leave missions/quests/etc.? Without saying anything?

Due to the GIFT I tend to avoid this situation all-together. The only people I play the game with are friends or NPC's. I communicate with my friends and Alesia doesn't care either way.

- Do you leech in PvP or PvE and just not give a damn?

Again avoided simply by playing the game and doing so with friends/NPC's.

- Do you say please and thank you? Or GG?

Redundant question. Courtesy should be the norm.

- Is trash talking necessary? Is it generally immature?

Another redundant question.

Arkantos · Jul 13, 2008, 10:21 AM // 10:21

Quote:

Ethics:
- Is there a time and place to knowingly scam the unknowing or unprepared?
- Is there a difference between taking advantage of someone's ignorance and scamming? (I.e. someone selling an item for significantly less than it's worth).
- Do some players "just have it coming?"
- Do you think people owe it to most other people to show them respect?
- Is belittling others in the "spirit of the game" acceptable or immature?
- Are third-party methods of getting ahead acceptable or fair? (I.e. buying gold, afk-macroing drinking)

Etiquette:
- Do you needlessly and repeatedly spam messages in local chat? (wtb cloth x10 in 3 seconds)
- If someone is doing a CoF (or other) run for tips, are you the type of person to not even say thanks, not tip, and just get your reward? Or sometimes worse, do you add insult to the injury and only tip a meagre 100 gold?
- With little regard for the other people in a party, do you leave missions/quests/etc.? Without saying anything?
- Do you leech in PvP or PvE and just not give a damn?
- Do you say please and thank you? Or GG?
- Is trash talking necessary? Is it generally immature?

Do I feel responsible to others to uphold ethics and etiquette in game? Absolutely not.

Ethics:

- No.

- Yes, there is, imo. Scamming is offering something for someone, and giving them cheaper. If I go to buy something for 100k + 10 ecto and I give him 100g + 10 ecto, it's scamming. If someone is selling something worth 100k + 10 ecto for 50k, it's taking advantage of ignorance.

- Yes. Players who drop an item in an instance because some random person came up to them and said they wanted to "try something", they had it coming. Rule #1 of the internet: Don't trust anyone.

- Respect is earned, etc etc.

- Meh, it's the internet. If people want to randomly be a douche, I could care less.

- Buying gold isn't getting ahead of people in Guild Wars, because gear means nothing. If gear did matter, like in WoW, I would say it's not fair. I personally don't see the problem with afk-macroing drunkard. Who in their right mind want to spend a total of almost a week to get a meaningless title?

Etiquette:

- If I have to compete with others, yes. If no one is talking, no.

- I'll always say thanks, and I'll give a tip (that is, if I did do those kind of runs).

- If the group is terribad beyond belief, yes. If they're just bad, I'll say they're bad and I'll leave. I play Guild Wars for fun, and playing with bad people isn't fun.

- No.

- Yes.

- Depends. If I'm ABing and winning, I'm going to be a complete ass and indirectly insult Luxons. If I'm RAing and someone starts trash talking me, I'll trash talk back. If a team plays a good match and are respectful, I'll leave it at gg.

This is an opinion of someone who doesn't like stupid/ignorant people, and has no feelings on the internet.

Quote:

What immature or asshole-ish things grind your nerves that other people do?

Honestly, nothing. It's the internet. I could get angry with immature assholes, but what's the point when the internet is full of them?

masta_yoda · Jul 13, 2008, 10:26 AM // 10:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lady Raenef

I know I'm just one player, but I get wrapped up in things as well. Generally, I defend others who are being made fun of, rather than being the one going "Pwned, noob." on the playing field. It's a game, not a way of life. Others view it too seriously (HA players) and makes the game less fun. I haven't even ranked my Hero past rank 2 because the players I have to deal with are like a pack of children. If you screw up once, you amount to the pile of dog crap they've stepped in, and now they're desperately trying to wipe and wash you off with a water hose and the grass of someone else's lawn.

Just my thoughts.

HA is fun and competitive sometimes, but if you cant take constructive criticism or harsh insults then its not the place for you

Ethics:
- Is there a time and place to knowingly scam the unknowing or unprepared?

yep...

- Is there a difference between taking advantage of someone's ignorance and scamming? (I.e. someone selling an item for significantly less than it's worth).

yes

- Do some players "just have it coming?"

definitely especially the ones who give there acc info

- Do you think people owe it to most other people to show them respect?

- Is belittling others in the "spirit of the game" acceptable or immature?

well it happens in all games cant say, sometimes its immature and unacceptable

- Are third-party methods of getting ahead acceptable or fair? (I.e. buying gold, afk-macroing drinking)

Etiquette:
- Do you needlessly and repeatedly spam messages in local chat? (wtb cloth x10 in 3 seconds)

maybe do it once to grab attention so, no

- If someone is doing a CoF (or other) run for tips, are you the type of person to not even say thanks, not tip, and just get your reward? Or sometimes worse, do you add insult to the injury and only tip a meagre 100 gold?

maybe, depends if the run was fast

- With little regard for the other people in a party, do you leave missions/quests/etc.? Without saying anything?

usually "gtg" *crosses out* , i said something so yes

- Do you leech in PvP or PvE and just not give a damn?

never leeched b4

- Do you say please and thank you? Or GG?

sometimes

- Is trash talking necessary? Is it generally immature?

its neccessary to some people or for the fun of it sometimes...it only gets imature when they bag your mums

Zahr Dalsk · Jul 13, 2008, 10:26 AM // 10:26

Ethics:
- Is there a time and place to knowingly scam the unknowing or unprepared?

No. I never felt it worth it, either, though power traders appear to do it often. Which is fine by me.

- Is there a difference between taking advantage of someone's ignorance and scamming? (I.e. someone selling an item for significantly less than it's worth).

See above.

- Do some players "just have it coming?"

Not sure what you mean.

- Do you think people owe it to most other people to show them respect?

Respect should be earned, not given.

- Is belittling others in the "spirit of the game" acceptable or immature?

Belittling others is not the spirit of Guild Wars; however it seems to get done anyways.

- Are third-party methods of getting ahead acceptable or fair? (I.e. buying gold, afk-macroing drinking)

Buying gold is bad; macros for drinking, well, since the titles are here, might as well, eh?

Etiquette:
- Do you needlessly and repeatedly spam messages in local chat? (wtb cloth x10 in 3 seconds)

No. In Kamadan D1 the text wall would pass it over anyways. I put my message in party search and wait for takers.

- If someone is doing a CoF (or other) run for tips, are you the type of person to not even say thanks, not tip, and just get your reward? Or sometimes worse, do you add insult to the injury and only tip a meagre 100 gold?

Tips means no actual obligation to pay, so no, I wouldn't, if they were collecting tips after the run. Exception for friends running; I'll pay them the amount of a regular run.

- With little regard for the other people in a party, do you leave missions/quests/etc.? Without saying anything?

Sure I do. Got this thing called real life, and got an even more important thing called The Internet. Those are more important than Guild Wars PUGs.

- Do you leech in PvP or PvE and just not give a damn?

Leeching in PvP is pointless since it leads to loss anyways, leeching in PvE is pointless since it wouldn't really gain anything (when someone leaches in my group, I lol at them and leave).

- Do you say please and thank you? Or GG?

Sometimes I use GG as an insult once I've completely destroyed someone's argument. For example, someone says "7 heroes would be overpowered" (even though it hasn't even been seen ingame). I reply with, "Ursan Blessing, GG."

- Is trash talking necessary? Is it generally immature?

Trash talking is unnecessary, immature, and constantly used by PUGs, which is why I play H/H and want the hero cap removed.

Age · Jul 13, 2008, 10:28 AM // 10:28

Yes.I usually behave the same way I would in public and I never do any cursing in game like some others do.I would say that other should show respect to others as online gameing is sort of being out in public.

tmakinen · Jul 13, 2008, 10:40 AM // 10:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Illfated Fat

Do you feel like you should act in a "good" way to other people. Is it your duty as an "ethical" human being to do so?

This goes pretty deep into ethics and morale but I'd tend to say that words like 'should' and 'duty' are potentially misguided in this context. A good deed may always have the same outward appearance but there is a huge difference between various motives that triggered it, from a psychopath manipulating his victims, to somebody doing it out of a sense of duty, to somebody for whom it is the only conceivable course of action and the happiness derived from the action its greatest reward.

A person who in real life is 'nice' out of duty towards other people is less likely to feel that duty in an anonymous context, leading to this well known theory.

A person who is genuinely nice will be just as nice in a game because that is her/his natural state of being.

N1ghtstalker · Jul 13, 2008, 10:41 AM // 10:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Illfated Fat

Ethics:
- Is there a time and place to knowingly scam the unknowing or unprepared?
no, i don't scam
- Is there a difference between taking advantage of someone's ignorance and scamming? (I.e. someone selling an item for significantly less than it's worth).
don't you mean buying an item for a price that's much lower?
no, i sometimes sell items for low low prices to get rid of them (like tomes)
- Do some players "just have it coming?"
if they're stupid someone is going to take advantage of it
- Do you think people owe it to most other people to show them respect?
i can respect others for their intellect and knowledge in the game or RL, much like respecting your elders
- Is belittling others in the "spirit of the game" acceptable or immature?
no
- Are third-party methods of getting ahead acceptable or fair? (I.e. buying gold, afk-macroing drinking)
i used texmod for a cartographer title, for the rest i get everything myself

Etiquette:
- Do you needlessly and repeatedly spam messages in local chat? (wtb cloth x10 in 3 seconds)
no, i hate that kind of people and imply them to stop spamming the local chat like a retard, if they ignore my warning i report them
- If someone is doing a CoF (or other) run for tips, are you the type of person to not even say thanks, not tip, and just get your reward? Or sometimes worse, do you add insult to the injury and only tip a meagre 100 gold?
no, i actually stay last when the team leaves when a runner screws up and i offer him help on improving his running skills
- With little regard for the other people in a party, do you leave missions/quests/etc.? Without saying anything?
no, i'm not the kind of guy that leaves without any warning
- Do you leech in PvP or PvE and just not give a damn?
no, i fight till the end
- Do you say please and thank you? Or GG?
yes
- Is trash talking necessary? Is it generally immature?
if they deserve it and act like an *sshole yes

there ya go, all filled in

Kashrlyyk · Jul 13, 2008, 10:48 AM // 10:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kumu Honua

The problem with anything to do with ethics and etiquette in an online environment is the GIFT. (Greater Internet F-wad Theory).

Normal Person + Anonymity + Audience = Total F-Wad
...

I am a normal person, nobody knows me ingame so there is anonymity and audience is there too in the european districts, and I am still normal.

I think it should be:

F-Wad + Anonymity + Audience = Extreme F-Wad

Arkantos · Jul 13, 2008, 10:52 AM // 10:52

Kusandaa · Jul 13, 2008, 10:56 AM // 10:56

Ethics:
- Is there a time and place to knowingly scam the unknowing or unprepared?
IMO no.

-Is there a difference between taking advantage of someone's ignorance and scamming? (I.e. someone selling an item for significantly less than it's worth).
Hmm... I'll admit I'd be tempted to buy the item for cheap, but usually my good side comes over and tells the guy the real price. Esle I'd feel like a scammer and I hate scammers. >_>

- Do some players "just have it coming?"
Depends for what... whoever's acting like an ass WILL have people acting like an ass towards them. Then they complain.

- Do you think people owe it to most other people to show them respect?
Kind of, it works both ways. Respect others and they'll respect you. If you don't respect anyone, then complain people aren't respecting you, you have a problem.

- Is belittling others in the "spirit of the game" acceptable or immature?
Immature.

- Are third-party methods of getting ahead acceptable or fair? (I.e. buying gold, afk-macroing drinking)
I'm not for these methods, really. However, they get me good laughs, especially the gold buying, because if they brag on how good they are at the game, then you team up with them and they suck... you have any other option to laugh? Ok maybe another guy does, but I just laugh.

Etiquette:
- Do you needlessly and repeatedly spam messages in local chat? (wtb cloth x10 in 3 seconds)
Spammers annoy me, why in hell am I going to spam? I send my trade messages usually as they aren't visible on my chat screen anymore, or more crowded areas like Kamadan, every 30 seconds or so. IMO it's decent for all the trade chat going on.

- If someone is doing a CoF (or other) run for tips, are you the type of person to not even say thanks, not tip, and just get your reward? Or sometimes worse, do you add insult to the injury and only tip a meagre 100 gold?
If someone runs for tips, in general I'll give the full price.

- With little regard for the other people in a party, do you leave missions/quests/etc.? Without saying anything?
Never.

- Do you leech in PvP or PvE and just not give a damn?
I didn't learn this game by leeching, so no. I hate leechers. (The only times I leech are when friends ask me to leech off them, and it happens!)

- Do you say please and thank you? Or GG?
I'll be honest and say I don't use "please" a lot, although it depends of the circumstances. I always thank others though.

- Is trash talking necessary? Is it generally immature?
Immature. However, I'll admit that feeding trolls is my guilty pleasure. Someone will come and insult me, I'll egg him on or show that I don't care too much; usually fires up the other guy who keeps on going and going. They're fun to mess with, I'll be honest... but I turn them to my advantage. It's really entertaining to me.

Pandora's box · Jul 13, 2008, 10:57 AM // 10:57

It's only a game. And immature behaviour is part of all games. That is inevitable. Even professional soccer players roll screaming over the ground when they are slightly touched by an opponent, hoping the referee will give the opponent a yellow or even a red card. Don't expect people to behave well when you are playing a game. Or take the consequence and play only in a protected environment, with friends.

Since I recognize and accept this part of online gaming, I avoid situations where others may be brought into temptation to abuse the situation. Mostly. That is why I always try to encourage devs to make it so that players can complete the game individually. Joining a (pug)party is a potential risk: players may leave prematurely, begin to yell when it takes too long, take a differend road to do a sitequest for themselves... Whatever. And of course I don't play PvP...

This is not a problem. Just go your own way. And take it as a guy

when someone tries to scam you in a trade or whatever.

As for the poll: no opinion given. I don't care very much.

bel unbreakable · Jul 13, 2008, 11:08 AM // 11:08

name and shame i say if sites like guru and wiki posted the names of these scammers it would help
after all any comunity is ment to look after its weakest members