Curse

Roland of Gilead · Jan 27, 2008, 10:24 PM // 22:24

Does it count as attacking if heroes keep up Strength of Honor/Winnowing/OoP etc. on me? If not, then my Locust's Fury Sin can keep up ca. 120 DPS all day long, with 3 optional skills. And yes, that's my everyday Sin build.

RavagerOfDreams · Jan 27, 2008, 10:57 PM // 22:57

104 dps with my sin :O...no scythe xD

no heros either

Rhedd · Jan 27, 2008, 11:03 PM // 23:03

Yeah, don't go using heroes to buff you. It throws everything off.

For the sake of consistency, just make it you, alone.

REMEMBER, THIS ISN'T A CONTEST! Nobody cares if you have the highest number!

And see what I was saying about Assassins? When they don't post their builds, they report numbers twice as high as other classes, so far.

Are they really consistently that good? What happened to the good ol' fashioned, do-one-combo-and-then-have-to-run PvE assassin? Did I miss a memo?

RavagerOfDreams · Jan 27, 2008, 11:07 PM // 23:07

wer just to sexy

and yes the memo came last week i forgot to email it to you

Martin Alvito · Jan 27, 2008, 11:09 PM // 23:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhedd

And see what I was saying about Assassins?...

Are they really consistently that good? What happened to the good ol' fashioned, do-one-combo-and-then-have-to-run PvE assassin? Did I miss a memo?

The mechanic of stacking % to crit buffs is broken, given the number of buffs available in the game at present. Especially in PvE, where an additional % crit buff provides IAS. Once you get upwards of 80% crit strike probability, you're looking at theoretically infinite energy, and that is broken in any context. (See: Blood spike, N/Rt healers, etc. in PvP before the most recent Soul Reaping nerf.)

The sin/derv simply represents the most efficient method of exploiting this mechanic, given the huge upper end on the damage range and the ability to hit adjacent targets.

Rhedd · Jan 27, 2008, 11:14 PM // 23:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martin Alvito

The mechanic of stacking % to crit buffs is broken, given the number of buffs available in the game at present. Especially in PvE, where an additional % crit buff provides IAS. Once you get upwards of 80% crit strike probability, you're looking at theoretically infinite energy, and that is broken in any context. (See: Blood spike, N/Rt healers, etc. in PvP before the most recent Soul Reaping nerf.)

The sin/derv simply represents the most efficient method of exploiting this mechanic, given the huge upper end on the damage range and the ability to hit adjacent targets.

So it's not just that they're really sexy, like Ravager claimed?

Now, if they could only stay alive, too. ^_^

Thanks for the explanation!

Now, back to science!

Roland of Gilead · Jan 27, 2008, 11:24 PM // 23:24

Quote:

Yeah, don't go using heroes to buff you. It throws everything off.

For the sake of consistency, just make it you, alone.

Then again, GW _is_ a team game, and if a team build is NOT designed for the sole purpose of embarrassing the MoD, it should be allowed.

Rhedd · Jan 27, 2008, 11:31 PM // 23:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roland of Gilead

Then again, GW _is_ a team game, and if a team build is NOT designed for the sole purpose of embarrassing the MoD, it should be allowed.

But buffs work equally well on almost any build, so any build posted could have its efficiency increased by allowing third-party buffs.

My usual party, just like everyone's, I'm sure, has someone who works to increase the damage of other party members. This should be assumed when looking at any individual build.

It's true that if you have a build that really MUST have this support to work, (That would be pretty gimmicky for an everyday build.) it makes it difficult to accurately compare your build in this context, but that's an unfortunate necessity, since otherwise ALL the numbers would be meaningless, because who knows what combination of buffing heroes you could be using.

Did I mention this isn't a contest for the highest damage number?

Maybe we can do a 4-man team test, later on.

Bryant Again · Jan 27, 2008, 11:53 PM // 23:53

My normal build:

I sometimes will trade in Standing Slash for "You Move Like A Dwarf!" for the lulz.

Whoops! To follow Rhedd The Great's template -

Who: Moi
Class: Warrior/Lol
Weapon: Sword
Avg. Damage: 77/second
Best Damage: 173
Death in: 9 sec
Stamina: None. I'm a Warriah.
Template Code: OQATERKX1xvAYIfLufCf9qgxBA

The Bard · Jan 28, 2008, 12:00 AM // 00:00

Who: Me
Class: Warrior/nothing
Weapon: Sword
Avg. Damage: 69/second
Best Damage: 143
Death in: 10 sec
Stamina: no energy/adrenaline problems at all
Build: OQATEZKXHax5U0Ujmkvyw6qAAAA (last spot usually goes for rez/condition remove/feel no pain. could of course put enduring harmony there to prolong the effects of FGJ

RavagerOfDreams · Jan 28, 2008, 12:47 AM // 00:47

don't listen to martin we are really just sexy o and with r little critical builds and such we've found this skill called critical defenses which helps with staying alive :P

Vazze · Jan 28, 2008, 01:07 AM // 01:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martin Alvito

The mechanic of stacking % to crit buffs is broken, given the number of buffs available in the game at present. Especially in PvE, where an additional % crit buff provides IAS. Once you get upwards of 80% crit strike probability, you're looking at theoretically infinite energy, and that is broken in any context. (See: Blood spike, N/Rt healers, etc. in PvP before the most recent Soul Reaping nerf.)

The sin/derv simply represents the most efficient method of exploiting this mechanic, given the huge upper end on the damage range and the ability to hit adjacent targets.

Nope, the trick is that he is using two VERY overpowered PvE skills which are basically doubling (+30 x +50 = +95%!) his 70ish DPS ( 70 is already pretty nice with standard skills). A sin is not supposed to have IAS for a reason just like the dervish IAS-s are not available to derv secondaries (they are in mysticism). Of course many of the PvE skills are overpowered, but not this much.

Good thread, most ppl are not aware of the importance of DPS (even less the utilities or god forbid survival skills...but first things first). Although DPS is not an objective number, armor level, aoe radius, enemy behavior,etc all have huge influence on dps, it is a solid number for basic comparison.

blakecraw · Jan 28, 2008, 02:00 AM // 02:00

Testing done by me
E/X
Fire Magic
Avg DPS: 50
Max DPS: 165 (Rodgort + Searing Heat + Burning)
Death: 8 seconds

12+1+1 Fire
9+1 Energy Storage
9 (+1 Earth, +1 Water, +0 Protection etc.)

[skill]mind blast[/skill][skill]rodgort's invocation[/skill][skill]searing heat[/skill][skill]teinai's heat[/skill][skill]fire attunement[/skill][skill]glyph of lesser energy[/skill][skill]resurrection signet[/skill] Utility/Support

Zorgy · Jan 28, 2008, 02:29 AM // 02:29

Testing done by me

W/either..... I use 100% w skills & a sword. In fact my AB build which rocks

5083 damage over 180secs & average 28 damage per sec.

My best damage in a single second was 101 done at 61 secs.

Death of Master after 22 secs.

Molock · Jan 28, 2008, 05:03 AM // 05:03

Then post at least the following information:
1) Me.
2) Elementalist
3) 40/40 fire set

I didn't exactly respect all the rules.. but anyway... this build is an AB build designed to spike an NPC shrine or group of enemies for very high damage in a very short amount of time. It takes 25 seconds of recharging before all my spells are ready for another spike. Energy is never an issue during battle as the build has good energy management.

Redfeather1975 · Jan 28, 2008, 05:08 AM // 05:08

Rhedd, I read the topic title and immediately thought of what the taxi cab driver yelled at me when I cut him off yesterday by accident.

Rhedd · Jan 28, 2008, 06:19 AM // 06:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redfeather1975

Rhedd, I read the topic title and immediately thought of what the taxi cab driver yelled at me when I cut him off yesterday by accident.

That was semi-intentional. ^_^

Now go do the test, you!

Carinae · Jan 28, 2008, 08:56 AM // 08:56

I stayed true to the purpose of the thread, but I needed to adjust the procedure. It should be valid, because it was maintained for 180 seconds. I could have maintained that indefinately, no prob.

arcanemacabre · Jan 28, 2008, 09:06 AM // 09:06

Nice, Carinae, that should dissolve all doubts of the absolute power of the minion master. I don't think anything can match that dps, but to top it all, minions provide the utility of meat shields. Not to mention you have shamblings, which provide degen that doesn't register on the MoD.

Still, I don't understand the need for Tahlkora in this test. You should be able to maintain all 10 minions the whole time, since the dummies provide constant corpses, right?

Carinae · Jan 28, 2008, 09:12 AM // 09:12

I only used Fiends for this run, no Shamblings. Tahlkora was just there to heal me so that I didn't have to self-heal. That would have taken energy away from OoU. It was an accurate battle-simulation.

Note: Tahlkora is on Passive.