Curse

SS Necro · Mar 19, 2009, 05:13 AM // 05:13

Not PVE areas, but The Central transfer chamber challenge missions and alike. I'm not complaining I just never understood the logic of GW for having areas a group can't finish but 2 people can?

I have tried to understand the logic and I just get a headache. Were these areas added to appease people that can go with a friend and complete them. Was it just a need that was filled? Or did the programmers really under estimate the players resourcefulness? Seems to me if they can complete them with such small groups GW will just make it harder and harder until no one can finish them.

*tilts head to the side like a German Shepard* O.o

Please help me understand and lets not let this become a rant about nerfing builds, skills etc..

Black Metal · Mar 19, 2009, 05:19 AM // 05:19

Because there's a difference between PvE questing and solo/duo farming

pumpkin pie · Mar 19, 2009, 05:20 AM // 05:20

freedom of choice?

MisterB · Mar 19, 2009, 05:27 AM // 05:27

Challenge missions are PvE areas. If you don't believe me, try to take a PvP-only character there, and report back how it goes. A group is defined as two or more entities forming a unit, in this case a party. Where is the problem?

AKB48 · Mar 19, 2009, 05:43 AM // 05:43

Welcome to MMO.

All I can say.

Amnel Ithtirsol · Mar 19, 2009, 06:18 AM // 06:18

I really do understand why the OP is confused. When I started out I also couldn't quite grasp the idea of a solo character or a smite team being able to complete areas that took me and my guild sometimes hours to do. And they do it in less than halve the time!

Certain skill sets are just unbalanced and overpowered. It beats the game. Simple as that. But, it also opens the door for people to make some money by running players (lazy and/or unskilled) through specific areas of the game (dungeons) and for others to farm, say, destroyer cores in Glints, as per your example.

It is really up to the individual to decide on how they want to play the game.
Personally I try have a balance between this and grouping.

Icy The Mage · Mar 19, 2009, 06:50 AM // 06:50

If your'e looking for a really hard area that takes a full party to beat, try DoA in hard mode. Sure you can 600/smite/famine it, but good luck having the sanity for spending 4+ hours there :P

Songbringer · Mar 19, 2009, 01:56 PM // 13:56

It is because the duo and solo people are using skills to counter that of what they are facing. Teams aren't. They are running into(lets use central transfer for example) the destroyer blazing with searing flames and other dumb crap. They randomly go in with people they don't know and don't take time to form proper teams and tacticly decide what is good and bad to use there.

Skyy High · Mar 19, 2009, 02:25 PM // 14:25

Many solo builds also get more powerful the more enemies that are directly attacking you, which make them more effective solo than in a group.

Vazze · Mar 19, 2009, 03:36 PM // 15:36

duo teams are better than human pugs because:
1) heroes focus fire on your target, pugs pick targets randomly
2) team build, easier to set up a hero than your teammates who can't or don't want to run/use the required builds/skills.
3) you control heroes (agro/attack/retreat), you can't control your pug.

TheodenKing · Mar 19, 2009, 03:55 PM // 15:55

OK, I think you need to understand the evolution involved:

The areas are not designed for farmers. For example, you mention Central Transfer Chamber challenge (I think what you meant was "A Time for Heroes"). Well, ATfH was designed for a group of 8. It is doable for a team of 8. And for the first month or two that is what everyone did.

Then, someone figured out how to use [Illusion of Pain] to 600 the Great Destroyer. Thus, a run was developed that completed the mission easily and efficiently in NM and HM.

So, no, they didn't design that mission for the farmer. But there are some smart freakin people that play the game, and they figure out ways to do things without a full party supporting them. But trust me when I say... there is not a single area of the game where a party is allowed that can only be completed by a runner.

So, you can load up a party and do it the way they designed it. Or you can pay a monk 1-2k to run it for you much faster. Your choice.

SS Necro · Mar 19, 2009, 07:09 PM // 19:09

Thanks for all the replies, I guess they saw a market/demand for it.

As for aTfH, that mission is a snap, have a warrior tank and use poisons, disease, - health degen and it's no big deal. Most hard hitting bosses cower at the use of "wail of doom" it makes them hit like big sissy's. I use my heroes as skill carriers. Spam skills and you're done.

BenjZee · Mar 19, 2009, 08:20 PM // 20:20

2 is a group
also who said we have to have maximum party?

Red Sonya · Mar 19, 2009, 11:45 PM // 23:45

GW has been like this since the 55 monk which they have never nerfed enough to end its reign among others like the solo sin or bushhog rangers. They should make these elite areas so tough there's no way anyone could do them or complete them without a full party of live players. And that should be on normal mode and hard mode should only be for the ultimate elite with brains.

byteme! · Mar 20, 2009, 12:58 AM // 00:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmithyBen

2 is a group
also who said we have to have maximum party?

Best response to this thread!

@OP It's called human ingenuity. Case in point. Some of the EoTN dungeons were initially designed in a way which forced most people into forming full teams (pugs/heroes/hench whatever). See "storm cloud incubus". However over time (a few months after release) the community figured how to get around this. If you want to blame anyone then blame the community, the farmers, wiki, skill templates etc... but it's not Anets fault WE broke their game. I have recently come up with a fail safe way to tackle the incubus aside from the method covered by Sacratus Ignis in the dungeon farming thread. I will remain hush about it for the time being however because I'm a firm believer in people earning the right to farm as opposed to just being handed everything on a silver platter. Damn pvxwiki to hell!!!

PS. This same rule applies to CTC as well in case someone tries to point that out to me.

byteme! · Mar 20, 2009, 01:10 AM // 01:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nerfed Necro

Well I was doing Ferndale in HM, all other enemies dead, Tarlok was the last , he would wipe us over and over. Ok, it happens. But we had him to 1% or less health he wipes us, we go to 60% dp, and are kicked back to the outpost.

This is the single biggest kick in the ..... I have ever experienced in the game. Makes no sense, and makes for rage quitting.

I'm beyond rational discourse right now and can only see red. There is no reason for it, none, period.

Then you or whoever you were with aren't good enough for HM. Makes perfect sense to me. Just because 1 person has troubles with an area doesn't mean it's a cause for concern. Lots of people find it too easy on the contrary. The AI of monsters make them predictable and often dumb as a rock. Only difference between HM and NM is a bunch of numbers. Higher lvl, higher armor and higher dmg and occasionally a few extra skills, toss those out and you have the same stupid predictable monsters.

Ate of DK · Mar 20, 2009, 01:51 AM // 01:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nerfed Necro

Not PVE areas, but The Central transfer chamber challenge missions and alike. I'm not complaining I just never understood the logic of GW for having areas a group can't finish but 2 people can?

You can tell that those other 6 players are very skilled.

Hero > Average Joe.

SS Necro · Mar 20, 2009, 01:52 AM // 01:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by byteme!

Then you or whoever you were with aren't good enough for HM. Makes perfect sense to me. Just because 1 person has troubles with an area doesn't mean it's a cause for concern. Lots of people find it too easy on the contrary. The AI of monsters make them predictable and often dumb as a rock. Only difference between HM and NM is a bunch of numbers. Higher lvl, higher armor and higher dmg and occasionally a few extra skills, toss those out and you have the same stupid predictable monsters.

I was ticked and have already removed my post. But to answer yours.. (your name here)

byteme! · Mar 20, 2009, 01:59 AM // 01:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nerfed Necro

I was ticked and have already removed my post. But to answer yours.. (your name here)

LOL Awesome. That's exactly why I have such a name.

Glad you recognized it.

Rhamia Darigaz · Mar 20, 2009, 02:55 AM // 02:55

abusing dumb AI > having more people