Curse

Ctb · Mar 04, 2009, 04:04 PM // 16:04

Quote:

When I play WoW it reminds me of a very bad Disney movies sometimes.

How does your personal preference in one of two unlike things say anything about the quality of either?

Quote:

...if that screen shot of Jora doesnt get you interested I dont know what will.

Creepy.

Quote:

Guild Wars looks exactly the same as it did two years ago when I joined, people coming and going just as you'd expect them to. I don't see how anyone could say Guild Wars is dying and actually believe it =/

And it doesn't look the same to me at all. Difference is, there are actually some numbers that suggest my perception may be more accurate than yours: Guild Wars sales are in pretty steep decline, which lends some credence to the idea that the game's active population may also be shrinking (also, in before somebody ignores "my perception" and "may be" and turns that last sentence into an absolute statement I never made).

Quote:

WoW can't kill GW because GW has no monthly fee.

Did you even bother to read the thread?

dylyn · Mar 04, 2009, 06:51 PM // 18:51

Just like the author of that article, I only got GW recently. The Trilogy came out right when I got broadband. I chose GW over WoW, even though I had a WoW guild invite from my coworkers. I had three reasons.

First off, the graphics for WoW seemed too cartoony, like anime. The more realistic GW graphics were way more appealing.

Next, no monthly subscription for GW. ("So I have to buy your game & then pay you every month to play it? I don't think so...")

Last, I heard about Blizzard's shenanigans with its search & destroy programs that would search your PC for bots or other illegal 3rd party stuff. Sorry, I'm not going to allow something on my network that can't behave itself. I also had friends who played WoW on Linux for quite a while, until Blizzard decided unilaterally that they couldn't use that OS.

I'll get GW2 as long as it doesn't have a monthly fee, and doesn't do any anti-social stuff like Blizzard (highly unlikely if ANet keeps to their current security model). Some of you might feel bored by GW, but I'm still really enjoying it.

enter_the_zone · Mar 04, 2009, 06:55 PM // 18:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gli

There's certainly a lot less activity in the European English districts than there was before travel to different servers became unrestricted. What happened is, many people went over to the Americas to join up with another large group of english speaking players.

Some of the other language districts in Europe are still going quite strong.

True. I blame it largely on the use of party search as a trade medium. Trying to determine who is selling/buying, and what they're selling/buying, in at least 6 different languages that you don't speak is just no fun...

ThunderStruck · Mar 04, 2009, 07:54 PM // 19:54

I honestly prefer GW to WoW simply because of the time factor. I haven't played WoW since TBC, but at 70 you needed a couple of hours for most of the endgame content, and had to "schedule" things for enough people to show up.

GW (which I haven't seriously played since June) is easily possible to just put "Anyone wanna do _____ HM?" "Sure" "Yeah" and then fill in with heroes and get going, and most likely be successful.

Alleji · Mar 04, 2009, 08:17 PM // 20:17

Oh, look, someone who played GW for 2 days and probably hasn't gotten out of presearing noticed that it's different form WoW! Stop the presses!

wetsparks · Mar 05, 2009, 04:55 AM // 04:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ctb

And it doesn't look the same to me at all. Difference is, there are actually some numbers that suggest my perception may be more accurate than yours: Guild Wars sales are in pretty steep decline, which lends some credence to the idea that the game's active population may also be shrinking (also, in before somebody ignores "my perception" and "may be" and turns that last sentence into an absolute statement I never made).

you and I have been over that before and i don't feel like...debating....it again, but I will post my thoughts for those who didn't read that thread. Guild Wars sold 1 million units in a year without any significant new content (what did we get, MOX?) I consider that pretty damn good.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zinger314

Pete Moleyneux says hi.

Twice.

Peter Moleyneux is a loud mouthed buffoon, you cant compare all game designers to him.

On topic, GW and WoW are to different to be compared and barely compete against each other. They both can, and are, extremely successful. If you want to compare GW against a game, you should choose something that isn't extremely dominate in the market, like FF11 or LotRO (both rumored around 600,000 paying subscribers, I believe SE put that in a financial report a year or two ago and I don't remember where I saw that for LotRO).

For everyone talking about GW2 being a WoW clone, if the guys leading ANet wanted to make WoW, they wouldn't have left Blizzard. Mountains of RPGs in the past have high level caps (usually at 99) and that didn't indicate lots and lots of grind. You just play through the game and if the devs are good an paced it right you should be the right level for some new mission and/or boss when you reach him.

FreeFalling · Mar 05, 2009, 11:42 AM // 11:42

I liked the article.

Tullzinski · Mar 05, 2009, 12:42 PM // 12:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by wetsparks

you and I have been over that before and i don't feel like...debating....it again, but I will post my thoughts for those who didn't read that thread. Guild Wars sold 1 million units in a year without any significant new content (what did we get, MOX?) I consider that pretty damn good.

Damn you beat me to it. Not suprised at the post..considering the source..Need a yawn icon.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wetsparks

For everyone talking about GW2 being a WoW clone, if the guys leading ANet wanted to make WoW, they wouldn't have left Blizzard.

Took their departure from Bliz as them wanting to try to do something DIFFERENT, being tired of the same old type of games that bliz has offered. Nothing but Diablo, Starcraft and Warcraft since 1998. I can see sticking with what works but damn, need that yawn icon again.

Ctb · Mar 05, 2009, 03:55 PM // 15:55

Quote:

I honestly prefer GW to WoW simply because of the time factor. I haven't played WoW since TBC, but at 70 you needed a couple of hours for most of the endgame content, and had to "schedule" things for enough people to show up.

They finally got their heads out of the sand on that and now most dungeons can be run pretty quickly. I guess they finally realized that not many people want to sit in front of the computer for three hours to do a quarter of a dungeon that gives a 10% chance at the reward they're going in for.

Still not as casual as GW though, because of the lack of henches and heroes.

Quote:

i don't feel like...debating....it again,

That's because there was nothing to debate. Sales declined, I pointed that fact out and clearly stated that I was of the opinion that it was neither interesting nor relevant since it compared the release year for EotN to the following year in which nothing was released.

You just tried keep arguing with me for the sake of it about something I wasn't even discussing.

Sephron · Mar 10, 2009, 04:28 AM // 04:28

I've actually moved on to WoW, have for quite awhile now. GW just got stagnant and boring for me. There's nothing left to hold my interest in GW anymore. I don't even think I have enough interest in GW2.

Axel Zinfandel · Mar 10, 2009, 04:49 AM // 04:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sephron

I've actually moved on to WoW, have for quite awhile now. GW just got stagnant and boring for me. There's nothing left to hold my interest in GW anymore. I don't even think I have enough interest in GW2.

This. I still poke around the community to play around with build ideas, but Anet's skill balancing is terribad.

I'm sure PvP is more fun if that's what you're into, but for PvE, GW is pretty horrible, because once you hit level 20, you'll find yourself asking yourself "what's the point?"

I can only hope that GW2 makes PvE more... rewarding

Hanging Man · Mar 10, 2009, 04:54 AM // 04:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dacomos

WoW cant kill GW becouse GW is just better ;p

- WoW has graphics looking like first part of Gothic. I want to play Hero, not mario looking 10 polygon "thing".
- GW graphics are more realistic. WOW = cheap cartoon.
- grind grind grind
- GW has more skills, in WOW u have skill levels which mostly do only dmg.
-Youtube WOW vs GW

I like the graphics point. I am not a fan of how cartoony the graphics are in WoW. that was one of my decided factors in choosing. I could not stand to stare at a cartoon for along ass time.

obsidian ectoplasm · Mar 10, 2009, 04:59 AM // 04:59

gw and wow are very different games

wow is deffanitly better for pve, and the amount of things that you can do.

but wow pvp is not so good, who ever has the best weapon wins

gw pve, however is good when you first start playing but then there is not much to do and it becomes very boring

gw pvp however is great but bad at the same time

the skill level needed, learning to spike, catch spikes all that stuff is great

but anet has kind of killed pvp

besides the monthly overall wow would be a better game, because pvp in gw is pretty much dead

but I am positive wow will be no match to gw2

FoxBat · Mar 10, 2009, 06:10 AM // 06:10

WoW has vastly more content, but after playing the beta to lvl 20 and then trying a 2-week trial, I couldn't really get into it. Soloing stuff means you beat on the same one or two mobs at a time for quite a while, which really puts the "grind" into MMO. "Solo" Battles in GW go faster and are more intricate because you're never solo. Then you have all those "kill X" quests, waste alot of time walking around, and the death penalty is literally making you walk 5-10 minutes- all of this in a world where things are constantly respawning and the quests rarey accomplish anything that feels important. GW while often corny, at least has a dynamic story/narrative that holds your attention, gives you a definite direction, and is easy to follow, and the quests usually are more involved too.

So while WoW definitely has more PvE (and you pay more for it), I'm don't buy the oft repeated mantra that it is "better" PvE - it's not for everyone (even if it's sold much more.) What's more troubling for me is that 99% of MMOs were ripped off or rip off wow, duplicating all these same fundamental aspects that I don't care for. Companies need to stop investing in the next WoW-wannabe failure a la Age of Conan, and start looking to duplicate GW's success.

pumpkin pie · Mar 10, 2009, 06:42 AM // 06:42

Why WoW can't kill Guild Wars.

I've actually have a copy of WoW on my computer that I can play anytime. But I don't want to, cause that would mean someone has to pay the monthly fees for me. I did have a server filled up with character all level 19 lol not gonna level them cause i want to play at the lower end PvP.

I also recently play a F2P game called Rohan. Downloaded Anarchy Online (over night), play for 5 minutes and uninstalled the damn thing, too ugly, instruction are too hard too follow, I want to play a game not read game manual

My very first MMORPGs is Guild Wars. so I inevitably compare all these to it when I play them. Comparing those game to Guild Wars.

i find all these other MMORPG lack:

1) A main storyline to carry your character through the game with primary quests and missions with the usual side quests of collecting X numbers of items or please talk to that guy 3 feet away cause i can't move over there quests :P~
2) Re-adjustable attributes points
3) Secondary professions
3) Skill Chain effects (the most other game has that I've notice are stun and frozen, you don't see them having, if foe is hex with water magic, then you use steam, your foes will be blinded type of skills chaining.)
4) Skills that are easily distinguishables between profession.
5) Do not have distinguishables areas with different monsters.

explanations:
Number one explain itself, they tell you the story, some only on their webpage, wow at least has an opening intoduction cinematic, and that's it. the others simply don't have any cinematic to speak of, weather or not you move on to the next area does not matter because there's no continuation to the story after the opening cinematic. When I play in Rohan Online, i'll just proceed to the next area with the "correct level" creatures and start hacking them. if you arrange your skills on the skill bar nicely. you can simply just 1.2.3 your way to the end. With the availability to acquire cheap mana and health potion, one can filled up their bags, goes out hunting and not return forever, seeing there's no missions and quest that need done to progress to the next area.

number 4, for instant, all profession/race in these games has almost the same type of skill set. meaning they have buff, heal, attack skills, with mana and health potion. although using different type of weapons they are actually doing the same thing just using different names. You do not need a support line, for instant, healer and theres no interrupt skills .... to begin with. (i think wow has thou)

all these features that guild wars has is why new player still coming and old player still playing. and I suspect skills balance plays a very important part in the whole scenario, (ahem, arena net) without which your game will surely die. skills update does not means that the game is so broken that it need fixing (off course thats part of it) but it provide "hope" for players, and after each balance, there are new builds that comes out. Which makes the game "new" and not "stale".

when you travel around Tyria or Cantha or Nightfall, you encounter different creatures, different locals, have different weapons sets, different skills, have different armors. unlike some game, all area have the exact same type of creatures. and as long as you grind your butt you'll get to the top end skills regardless if you have don't and complete the whole game or not.

If the creatures are level 1-5 they must be imps, level 7-8 they must be lycans.. for all towns outposts, i nearly die laughing when I see that. why would anyone do that? You build a marvelously beautiful gamescape, come up with beautiful class of characters, and you couldn't put in just a little bit more effort to make the monsters distinguishables in various areas?

Edit:
I also thought of something else that's quiet important that others don't have. Because of the nicely written stories, and allowing us to take part or party up with the character inside the stories itself is genious. I think this adds another level to the RPG part of the game greatly. Its also why Gwen is so popular, and why thread like this exist. It is also why having mini pets that does nothing is so fun. like you are part of the story.

Anywho, playing others mmorpgs has made me appreciate Guild Wars even more! I hope they don't turn into one of these other mmorpgs in GW2 thou... keep fingers crossed. and in them mean time I am also drooling over other un-reachable mmorpgs lolol.....

Faer · Mar 10, 2009, 06:44 AM // 06:44

This thread is a festering pit of bias, misinformation, and in some cases, downright idiocy. Can't believe it's been permitted to go on this long. May as well throw in a post though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by zwei2stein

And WoW has its share of useless skills too ... all that "L1 Firebolt / L2 Firebolt / ..." means that in WoW 4 out of 5 skills are useless. And no "there is use for them". Plain useless.

Classic example of uninformed misinformation. Go play WoW, report back when you know what you are talking about. Thanks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ctb

Still not as casual as GW though, because of the lack of henches and heroes

WoW has no need for them. Casual players of mediocre skill can solo almost all world quest content. Players of a somewhat higher skill level can solo quests designed for three to five players, assuming their class has the ability to effectively snare opponents, which most do. GW is designed around group gameplay, hence the need for H&H for casuals. WoW is designed around solo questing and group dungeons, so H&H are entirely unnecessary for anyone who isn't terrible, even super casual players.

GW is still more casual than WoW, but for reasons other than the lack of H&H in the latter.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pumpkin pie

wow at least has an opening intoduction cinematic, and that's it.

WoW has deeper lore and a more expansive story than Guild Wars will ever have. It just doesn't carry you through it like a pop-up children's book, à la single player adventure games, like GW does. You actually have to read quests and pay attention to what's going on. Most quests in WoW tie into a plot line of some sort, be it small or extremely large and spanning many areas and time periods. In contrast, most quests in GW are just once-off menial chores for you to do that don't really tie into anything important. GW has a single, short story to tell you in each game, and those stories fit together loosely. WoW has many stories, large and small, all around you, and plots that tie into plots that tie into plots that tie into more plots of epic proportions (for example, there is a long line of quests for one Faction that starts almost as soon as you roll a character and leads up to a massive betrayal and epic battle in the latest expansion).

And in direct response to the thread title, Blizzard could probably crush ArenaNet any time they wanted, with the right paperwork. But why bother? There's no threat for them to worry about.

Longasc · Mar 10, 2009, 08:53 AM // 08:53

WoW does not need to kill GW.

ANet does it themselves, with announcing the successor YEARS before it is released and many great ideas implemented badly.

Maybe they even inspired Blizzard, who will steal/copy the idea and polish it, as they always do. And boom, Blizzard invented something new, and people will love it, smash hit.

Thank you, ANet... :>

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theocrat

Go play WoW, report back when you know what you are talking about. Thanks.

Go to hell, ad hominem arguments are crap and are just insulting.

Just tell why you think that lower rank damage spells have a reason to exist, now that the new downranking rules even made healing spell downranking rather useless?

pumpkin pie · Mar 10, 2009, 10:48 AM // 10:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theocrat

WoW has deeper lore and a more expansive story than Guild Wars will ever have. It just doesn't carry you through it like a pop-up children's book, à la single player adventure games, like GW does. You actually have to read quests and pay attention to what's going on. Most quests in WoW tie into a plot line of some sort, be it small or extremely large and spanning many areas and time periods. In contrast, most quests in GW are just once-off menial chores for you to do that don't really tie into anything important. GW has a single, short story to tell you in each game, and those stories fit together loosely. WoW has many stories, large and small, all around you, and plots that tie into plots that tie into plots that tie into more plots of epic proportions (for example, there is a long line of quests for one Faction that starts almost as soon as you roll a character and leads up to a massive betrayal and epic battle in the latest expansion).

And in direct response to the thread title, Blizzard could probably crush ArenaNet any time they wanted, with the right paperwork. But why bother? There's no threat for them to worry about.

I believe I don't play WoW that much to argue as to weather the story is good, bad or what not, ... (this be another topic).

I agree WoW has a much complex story than that of Guild Wars, but it does not give you the impact the way Guild Wars does with its missions and quests and eventually you arrive at the end of the chapter, even with it less complex storyline.

Most mmorpg has a background story, actually i think all of them have one, but where do you find it? is the game play dependable on this story/lore. Its how the developer use this to their advantage, and guild wars did, i also don't see it in any other (only a few) game that I've play. How does one find out about WoW's lore? and How does one find out about Guild Wars' Lore? WoW, you go to their webpage to read the story. With Guild Wars you fignt (play) and become part of the story without having to read the quest, off course if you want to read it, thats a plus. I probably might enjoy Lord of the Ring ... hrmzzz... if only the client doesn't take forever to download.

Faer · Mar 10, 2009, 11:09 AM // 11:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Longasc

Just tell why you think that lower rank damage spells have a reason to exist

I don't have time to theorycraft or explain in great detail the mechanics of a game other than Guild Wars on a Guild Wars forum, but in short, downranking is not as effective as it was before patch 2.0.1 (and more recently 3.0.2 due to the switch from set mana costs to base percentage costs), but there are still plenty of uses for downranked skills, mostly relating to speed and specific damage output.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pumpkin pie

WoW, you go to their webpage to read the story

No, you pay attention to quest text and NPC chatter while playing the game (EXTREMELY small amounts of additional info are found on the website, and supplemental information can be learned from related literature from your local library, or previous Warcraft games). WoW is like a novel, GW is like a picture book or a movie. One expects you to read and make mental notes, the other expects you to sit back and let things be shown to you directly.

agrios · Mar 10, 2009, 12:22 PM // 12:22

WoW cant kill GW - and vice-versa - just like beer cant kill wine - and vice versa.

Different flavors for different tastes. Pick yours and enjoy.

Peace!